How far is too far?

[boxer810]

One example does not a precedent make.

No, it doesn't but you asked for an example

 

[TheOriginalJames]

One example does not a precedent make.

A friend of mine was put on suspension by her christian college for drinking on campus. Her father was a pastor her entire life and she was raised as a Christian as well.

Tattoos, partying, piercings, drinking and driving. Doing pot. These are all activities she got involved with despite being raised by a pastor and going to a christian college. She was an absolute angel in high school.

I can give you several more examples, as well.

 

[boxer810]

Same here....the dean of Roanoke Bible College in my hometown had a son attending classes there....he got expelled for showing porn movies in the dorms....

 

[TheOriginalJames]

Now I'm not saying all turn out as such; but there is a portion of these kids out there who turn out to do bad things when they grow up. Obviously though, we cannot directly associate this to church or a christian upbringing.

But look at Tim. Successful, intelligent, responsible with his time, family and money.

Look at me, responsible with my money management, I own a house, I don't steal do drugs or do anything else illegal. I work and come home to enjoy my accomplishments.

Is not going to church really such a bad thing?

 

[Breath]

Is not going to church really such a bad thing?

Are you happy?

 

[Breath]

No, it doesn't but you asked for an example

I think I was leaning more toward some reliable sources, if they even have statistics on something like this, rather than individual anecdotes.

 

[TheOriginalJames]

Are you happy?

In this particular way, I am quite happy.

 

[boxer810]

I think I was leaning more toward some reliable sources, if they even have statistics on something like this, rather than individual anecdotes.

Reliable sources? :confused I don't consider them "anecdotes." They are facts...I thought that was conducive of a good debate :smiley24:

 

[Breath]

Reliable sources? :confused I don't consider them "anecdotes." They are facts...I thought that was conducive of a good debate :smiley24:

Oh, I'm not saying your story isn't reliable. But it is anecdotal.
If we just throw stories back and forth at each other it just turns into a "He said-She said" argument. That doesn't help prove a point.

 

[boxer810]

Oh, I'm not saying your story isn't reliable. But it is anecdotal.
If we just throw stories back and forth at each other it just turns into a "He said-She said" argument. That doesn't help prove a point.

I guess you have a point there....


In light of that comment I encourage you to read this....

Wayward Children

 

[Peter Parka]

I see it as a parents job to teach good morals ect, I fail to see how forcing a religion upon them does that. Religion is a choise and not a necessity to being a moral and good person.

 

[Breath]

That link totally supports what I've been saying.
Do what you can while you have them, be proactive while they are underage, because yes, they can certainly make their own choices when they aren't your responsibility any longer.

 

[boxer810]

That link totally supports what I've been saying.
Do what you can while you have them, be proactive while they are underage, because yes, they can certainly make their own choices when they aren't your responsibility any longer.

I saw that and thought of what you had been saying

 

[Breath]

I see it as a parents job to teach good morals ect, I fail to see how forcing a religion upon them does that. Religion is a choise and not a necessity to being a moral and good person.

We've discussed that, dear Peter. The point now is...if the PARENT thinks a religious upbringing will inspire their child to greater things, is it not the parent's right to do whatever they find necessary to teach their own child?
Who is anyone to say, "You can't try to make your kid a better person with religion" ?
Fuck outta here. If I'm ever a parent, I'll make those decisions, religious or not, and a big one-fingered salute to anyone who criticizes my good intentions.

 

[boxer810]

Whew...getting a bit personal now...I think that religion is a touchy enough subject, and everyone had vastly different views...this is a great debate but the bottom line remains the same...parents will do what it is that they believe will make their children better as adults.

 

[Peter Parka]

I don't personally believe that brain washing children into religion is a good thing. A lot of religion teaches prejudice and hatred, not good things. I most certainly don't support that being taught to children!

No need to be rude. I won't get the fuck out of here just because you say so, keep your personal comments to yourself!

 

[Breath]

Whew...getting a bit personal now...I think that religion is a touchy enough subject, and everyone had vastly different views...this is a great debate but the bottom line remains the same...parents will do what it is that they believe will make their children better as adults.

The bottom line is always the clincher. :clap

 

[TheOriginalJames]

Whew...getting a bit personal now...I think that religion is a touchy enough subject, and everyone had vastly different views...this is a great debate but the bottom line remains the same...parents will do what it is that they believe will make their children better as adults.

And the way I feel about that is if you continually forcefully push your child to do something he/she doesn't want to do, eventually he's going to look back and go... I do not want to do this, and I'm going to rebel against and/or completely ignore this.

In doing so, the parents' good intentions have turned around and bit them in the ass because the child is now doing the exact opposite as they reach the age of consent and begin to think on their own.

Being overly forceful, IMO, had detrimental effects towards the ultimate goal my parents had for me growing up. Yet I still turned out responsible with my head on straight.

 

[All Else Failed]

When I raise my kids, they will be raised atheists. I will teach them about other religions and beliefs, but from the perspective of that they are simply myths, and ancient ways that man used to make sense of a world they were mostly ignorant of.

 

[TheOriginalJames]

When I raise my kids, they will be raised atheists. I will teach them about other religions and beliefs, but from the perspective of that they are simply myths, and ancient ways that man used to make sense of a world they were mostly ignorant of.

As long as you tell them that this is simply your perspective on religion, I don't see a problem with that. But if you raise them to not believe in anything, you're forcing your beliefs on them.

My children will be raised under the ideology of; This is my belief, this is how I feel, if they have questions I will give them all the answers I can, and show them where they can get answers to the questions I cannot answer.

I will let them find both sides of the questions and make their own decision, but as far as a denomination/atheism, they'll decide what they want on their own.