Occupy Oakland Raids

[The Man]

And further, the purpose of a union isn't to make a profit, it's supposed to represent the members in wage, benefits and working conditions in regards to contractual agreements with businesses.

Exactly.
at one time they were useful for the work force...but has evolved into a very large form of corruption.

 

[Johnfromokc]

You repeat yourself endlessly.

Example:

But never post what it is or evidence .
That's merely bullshit trying to shout down an argument.
meh.


And yet you have been unable to present proofs in an argument to that effect.
Just more verbal diarrhea....


Again, you present no proof of that, merely more verbal diarrhea.



Give it time , I just got here recently.
I've also learned not to be distracted away from a topic.


I can see it pains you to be beaten by logic


Another time, I'm having too much fun booting your ass all over the forum concerning your support of the OWS and socialism...


Serious question:

Why do you so vehemently deny you tilt to the left?

Stone, are you a complete fucking idiot? I asked you what you stood for, but you won't answer.

You can't baffle me with volumes of bullshit because I'm going redirect your narrow little mind back to the topic.

In brief, this is what OWS stands for:

Occupy Wall Street is a people-powered movement that began on September 17, 2011 in Liberty Square in Manhattan’s Financial District, and has spread to over 100 cities in the United States and actions in over 1,500 cities globally.

OWS is fighting back against the corrosive power of major banks and multinational corporations over the democratic process, and the role of Wall Street in creating an economic collapse that has caused the greatest recession in generations. The movement is inspired by popular uprisings in Egypt and Tunisia, and aims to expose how the richest 1% of people are writing the rules of an unfair global economy that is foreclosing on our future.

The occupations around the world are being organized using a non-binding consensus based collective decision making tool known as a "people's assembly".

Now Stone, what part of that are you against?

Are you OK with Wall Street and major Corporate lobbyists controling our government?

Do you condone a $$TRILLION in our taxes being used to bail out banks?

Do you support corporate welfare?

Do you support corporate socialsim?

Answer those questions so we will know what you stand for - otherwise I will simply consider you just another right wing parroting asshat that repeats what your talk radio masters tell you to.

 

[The Man]

Seems like everyone but you knows that photo is several years old and has nothing to do with OWS. I'm trying real hard to be nice and not call you out as a dumbfuck that is too lazy to investigate things for yourself.

Look at the police car. See the precinct number 81 on the car? Well, with a quick Google search, you would have found this information in about 2 seconds:



You have thus far proven yourself unworthy of debating. A cure for your type of self inflicted Cranial Rectumitus is called exercising due dilligence before you post moronic shit like that photo.

So what kind of liquor are you swilling tonight?

John the detective,
Perhaps it is old after all.
But dont blame me...after all it was within the first hits from within google...perhaps they thought it was fitting..
None the less they still need to take a hose to those nasty asses.
Unless they have showers and laundry mats in the camps.
But wait...they would have to leave ..go to the mailbox to get their check ...it will be spent before they return.
Perhaps thats why such conveniences are not supplied.
Maybe Walmart will give them gift certificates for toilet paper and tide....its the least those rich bastards can do right?

 

[Johnfromokc]

Tell me John.Whats wrong with businesses making money.
You referenced Wall Mart earlier for an example.
Ok so they made a few billion
Do you know how many stores they have..how many employees on payroll?
I suppose you feel the same for any large business that is sucessful?
How about we shut em down...let K Mart take back over? ROFL

The stupidity of the anti-OWS people never ceases to amaze.

The comparison was between the lobby power of corporations versus unions. Are you truly so fucking thick that you cannot comprehend that?

Maybe you can answer the question:

Who has greater lobby power - American corporations with their combined $$TRILLIONS, or all American unions with their combined $5 Billion?

 

[Tim]

Exactly.
at one time they were useful for the work force...but has evolved into a very large form of corruption.

Maybe you might consider the other sections of the forum since debate doesn't seem to be your strong point.
I mean you aren't even on the same page with your anti-OWS propaganda. As John pointed out, that picture was taken years before OWS was even conceived. That picture was discredited along with the anti-OWS sound machine that put it out there. But it's very apparent why crap like that is put out there... Because idiots will cling onto it and keep repeating the lies. They know these idiots won't fact check a single thing they put out. That they will get these idiots to keep repeating it over and over...

Go grab a book, preferably nonfiction and leave the debates to those who actually care if what they post is at least partly true.

 

[The Man]

John the OWS supporter,
Why is it that anyone that doesnt agree with you is a right wingnut?
Wait I know...because you are a leftwing nut

 

[Johnfromokc]

And further, the purpose of a union isn't to make a profit, it's supposed to represent the members in wage, benefits and working conditions in regards to contractual agreements with businesses.

Jesus fucking Christ, lol. Where did you come up with that idiotic comment?

You claimed the unions had all this political influence.

I showed you the unions combined income as compared to just one corporation.

Then I asked you a simple question:

Who has the greater lobby power? American corporations, or American unions.

Just answer the question and stop spinning. Surely ya'll can't be so goddamned dense as to be unable to answer a simple mathematical question can you?

 

[The Man]

Maybe you might consider the other sections of the forum since debate doesn't seem to be your strong point.
I mean you aren't even on the same page with your anti-OWS propaganda. As John pointed out, that picture was taken years before OWS was even conceived. That picture was discredited along with the anti-OWS sound machine that put it out there. But it's very apparent why crap like that is put out there... Because idiots will cling onto it and keep repeating the lies. They know these idiots won't fact check a single thing they put out. That they will get these idiots to keep repeating it over and over...

Go grab a book, preferably nonfiction and leave the debates to those who actually care if what they post is at least partly true.

Detective Tim
Google supplied a picture I used it....and now I am a bad debater .
Perhaps you should brush up on your skills with logic...after all you argued in another thread that if you had sex with another man it wouldnt make you gay.
I was fooled by google
But you fooled yourself

 

[Alien Allen]

Lets face it both the far left and the far right post a ton of shit that needs fact checking.

I get that most of the protesters are not camping out over night. Still it is illegal to do that in just about any urban setting I would bet. And during the day in some of these places it has to be messy and a health concern. I don't have to visit Manhattan to come to that conclusion. Logic tells me there is no way it is properly equipped to handle the volumes of people there day and or night.

I agree with much of what OWS claims to represent. But IMO the movement is not what it appears. Stone has stated it pretty clearly IMO. So while I might like the message the devil is in the details and the messenger I do not trust. Follow the money is an old saying.

 

[Tim]

Detective Tim
Google supplied a picture I used it....and now I am a bad debater .
Perhaps you should brush up on your skills with logic...after all you argued in another thread that if you had sex with another man it wouldnt make you gay.
I was fooled by google
But you fooled yourself

Absolutely!

You googled for what you wanted and posted the picture to back up your point. You didn't even bother to check if it was true or not. An additional 3 minutes would have shown you that the picture was not from OWS, that it had nothing to do with it at all.

That's the problem, you hear what you want and post it up as fact. That's what makes you suck as a debater.

 

[Tim]

Lets face it both the far left and the far right post a ton of shit that needs fact checking.

I get that most of the protesters are not camping out over night. Still it is illegal to do that in just about any urban setting I would bet. And during the day in some of these places it has to be messy and a health concern. I don't have to visit Manhattan to come to that conclusion. Logic tells me there is no way it is properly equipped to handle the volumes of people there day and or night.

I agree with much of what OWS claims to represent. But IMO the movement is not what it appears. Stone has stated it pretty clearly IMO. So while I might like the message the devil is in the details and the messenger I do not trust. Follow the money is an old saying.

You're right, it should be fact checked. But when was the last time I posted crap that was easily disproved? I do take the time to check sources on my stuff. Our opinions may differ, but I don't post crap to support my opinions. It's the quickest way to discredit yourself and I try very hard to keep it honest.

The protesters have been working hard to keep their camps clean. Most do go home or to others homes to wash and do laundry.

And this is why they are welcoming opinions like yours. This movement isn't closed to anyone. Like I said, in NYC they have entire groups from the tea party that have joined and added their voice, they even have a large group of libertarians. I would love to see many more from the right join. That way balance can be achieved and our common goals can be addressed.

 

[Johnfromokc]

John the OWS supporter,
Why is it that anyone that doesnt agree with you is a right wingnut?
Wait I know...because you are a leftwing nut

Because I know the right wing talking points by heart, and when you parrot them, I call your intellectually lazy ass out on it.

I do lean left socially and I'm fucking proud of it because I made that choice after many years as a brain washed conservative when my research of the right wings propaganda revealed a total disconnect of conservatism with reality. I am for living wages and Universal health care for all Americans and I make no apologies for that stance.

Google supplied a picture I used it....and now I am a bad debater .

Pretty pathetic actually. Damn dude, verify shit before you post it and look like an uninformed parrot.

I was fooled by google.....

Google didn't fool you. Your lack of due dilligence made you look like an ass.

It only takes a few seconds in most case to verify a source. Don't be a dumbass..you can do better.

 

[Alien Allen]

John not to get off target but since you make the comment what is your definition of a living wage?

 

[The Man]

e

Absolutely!

You googled for what you wanted and posted the picture to back up your point. You didn't even bother to check if it was true or not. An additional 3 minutes would have shown you that the picture was not from OWS, that it had nothing to do with it at all.

That's the problem, you hear what you want and post it up as fact. That's what makes you suck as a debater.

No Tim
I typed in Occupy Wall Street images...it was on the first page as news...Fact is everything isnt going to be accurate.
Furthermore what is 3 minutes to you here is 10 minutes here on satellite connection..not to mention Data usage is precious...I am close to a FAP now...so no I am not playing detective with every source I come across.
To be honest if I was going to do that I would be spending that usage on discrediting Support of OWS...not sinking my own fucking ship

 

[Stone]

Stone, are you a complete fucking idiot? I asked you what you stood for, but you won't answer.

You can't baffle me with volumes of bullshit because I'm going redirect your narrow little mind back to the topic.

In brief, this is what OWS stands for:



Now Stone, what part of that are you against?

Are you OK with Wall Street and major Corporate lobbyists controling our government?

Do you condone a $$TRILLION in our taxes being used to bail out banks?

Do you support corporate welfare?

Do you support corporate socialsim?

Answer those questions so we will know what you stand for - otherwise I will simply consider you just another right wing parroting asshat that repeats what your talk radio masters tell you to.

Stone, are you a complete fucking idiot? I asked you what you stood for, but you won't answer.

Already answered.
You merely don't understand that a centrist position is largely one of pragmatism.
As such, socialism on your level is irrational and illogical as a solution to corruption.

You can't baffle me with volumes of bullshit because I'm going redirect your narrow little mind back to the topic.

That's my line

In brief, this is what OWS stands for:

I've already presented evidence in this forum as to what OWS stands for and some of the major league backers like the Communist party....but you seem intent to keep on pressing with your silly argument.

Now Stone, what part of that are you against?

I'm against the part where the OWS was first intended to enhance leftist empowerment as according to Lasn, one of the early founders, against the part where anarchists became involved in the movement, definitely since seeing evidence that the Communist Party USA was also involved in the movement and finally, that OWS and Unions have become mutual supporters with out mention of confronting union influence in buying favors in government.
How's that for some reasons or are you so damn ignorant none of that registers on all of your 3 brain cells?

Are you OK with Wall Street and major Corporate lobbyists controling our government?

No....and I've already posted to that elsewhere.
It's not my fault you have such a short attention span.

Do you condone a $$TRILLION in our taxes being used to bail out banks?

No....and I've already posted to that elsewhere.
It's not my fault you have such a short attention span.

Do you support corporate welfare?

No....and I've already posted to that elsewhere.
It's not my fault you have such a short attention span.

Do you support corporate socialsim?

No....and I've already posted to that elsewhere.
It's not my fault you have such a short attention span.

Are you a dumb ass with the attention span of a mite?

Answer those questions so we will know what you stand for - otherwise I will simply consider you just another right wing parroting asshat that repeats what your talk radio masters tell you to.

Fool.....I've already posted directly to those questions in this forum

I am opposed to the concept of neo-concervatism and think Straussian philosophy is a pile of steaming shit.
But that does not mean I support the OWS nor your quest for socialism while you hide your own opinions in the lime light of populism.

You've been posting bullshit.

 

[Johnfromokc]

John not to get off target but since you make the comment what is your definition of a living wage?

I'd like to see the United States adopt Australia's wage and labor laws, as well as health care. They have one of the best systems on the planet.

It will take some looking to learn what it entails, but if you are interested, you will find all the information here:

http://www.fairwork.gov.au/Pages/default.aspx

 

[Codrus]

You've been posting bullshit.

Hey!!!



thats my job...

 

[The Man]

Because I know the right wing talking points by heart, and when you parrot them, I call your intellectually lazy ass out on it.

I do lean left socially and I'm fucking proud of it because I made that choice after many years as a brain washed conservative when my research of the right wings propaganda revealed a total disconnect of conservatism with reality. I am for living wages and Universal health care for all Americans and I make no apologies for that stance.



Pretty pathetic actually. Damn dude, verify shit before you post it and look like an uninformed parrot.



Google didn't fool you. Your lack of due dilligence made you look like an ass.

It only takes a few seconds in most case to verify a source. Don't be a dumbass..you can do better.

Because I know the right wing talking points by heart, and when you parrot them, I call your intellectually lazy ass out on it

.
Psychologist John...your education has failed you..I am neither right nor left..I am not loyal to either

I do lean left socially and I'm fucking proud of it

An obvious character defect on your part.

because I made that choice after many years as a brain washed conservative when my research of the right wings propaganda revealed a total disconnect of conservatism with reality

Wow John...from one extreme to the other....Have you tried giving up being a nut altogether?

I am for living wages and Universal health care for all Americans and I make no apologies for that stance

You do understand you could raise the price of the minimum wage to lets say 25 bucks an hour...you do realize what that will do the prices correct?.....the "living wage" will have to be increased again...There is no end to that tunnel Johh...flip on the light and go out the other way before its to late .

Pretty pathetic actually. Damn dude, verify shit before you post it and look like an uninformed parrot.

I get fooled by a picture....basic science eludes you however...but that is expected from a self proclaimed leftwinger

 

[Stone]

Jesus fucking Christ, lol. Where did you come up with that idiotic comment?

You claimed the unions had all this political influence.

I showed you the unions combined income as compared to just one corporation.

Then I asked you a simple question:

Who has the greater lobby power? American corporations, or American unions.

Just answer the question and stop spinning. Surely ya'll can't be so goddamned dense as to be unable to answer a simple mathematical question can you?

Jesus fucking Christ, lol. Where did you come up with that idiotic comment?

You claimed the unions had all this political influence.

Again, more denial of reality....don't you get tired of being a dumb ass?

Who has the greater lobby power? American corporations, or American unions.

The public unions aren't in a contest with business for labor negotiations, fool.
You've continually avoided this issue.
That business has more influence in government with in their sphere is not comparative to the public unions influence in their labor contracts .
Moron....the issue isn't how much each spends, the issue is what they each spend has a large influence on taxpayers.
States are facing bankruptcy on pension/right to work issues because of this union intrusion of influence.
Quit being a dumb ass and face up to all the problems, not just the ones you favor because they embolden your political position.

Just answer the question and stop spinning

Even the above has been posted before, brain of a mite.


Are you supportive of some corruption but not that which favors your political position?

If you support some types of corruption, what is the logic for it?

 

[Johnfromokc]

OK - I editied out the 90% of your post that was nonsensical rambling and came up with this flawed, but semi-coherent portion:

I'm against the part where the OWS was first intended to enhance leftist empowerment as according to Lasn, one of the early founders, against the part where anarchists became involved in the movement, definitely since seeing evidence that the Communist Party USA was also involved in the movement and finally, that OWS and Unions have become mutual supporters with out mention of confronting union influence in buying favors in government.

1. There was never any leftist intent in OWS - unless you are making up your own defintion of leftist.

2. Lasn was not an early "founder". Was he an early supporter - yes -founder? No. Just because you keep repeating it wont make it eventually become true. Yes, he has some involvement as do thousands of others.

3. If there is some support from fringe groups like Anarchists and Communists, so the fuck what? They have no control or sway over OWS whatsoever. OWS has made that clear repeatedly.

4. Unions support OWS - again, so the fuck what? Unions are at their weakest in 100 years in America - all unions combined cannot compare to even one Fortune 500 corporation as a lobby power. Further, unions represent labor, and the corporations represent the top 1%, so of course the unions will fall on the side of OWS.

So tell me Stone - what is Socialism and what does it mean to you?