How Can God Prove Himself?

[dkwrtw]

look BRO, me being out of this has nothing to do with our conversation being peaceful or not peaceful, it has to do with it being a pointless discussion, you said that god does not tell us how we should live our lives and I proved that wrong, and your only responses have been nonsensical babbling.

 

[mhtal3at]

Excuse me!
suit yourself yeah right you have proven my point wrong, what should I do know, sign out? Do whatever you want! I don't want u telling me that I am telling u what 2 do.

 

[dkwrtw]

I never accused you of anything bro, you're not making any sense right now.

 

[mhtal3at]

the sense to you is saying something only you know. it's ok if I don't make sense to you, I am not the all-knowing creature, nothing is omniscient except for God, and you should be ready to take it easy when you raise questions and they remain unanswered to you.

 

[dkwrtw]

where are you from bro?

 

[BornReady]

Muhammed is called the illiterate prophet, which is one of God's miracles to prove that Muhammed did not come up with it

It's not certain that Muhammed was illiterate. But it doesn't really matter. Either way he could still have lied about the source of the Quran. Again, I'm not saying that he did lie but how do you know that he didn't?

 

[Peter Parka]

I get the feeling this is going to come to the old cop out "blind faith" answer that religious people give when they have no evidence.

 

[dkwrtw]

even the "blind faith" answer would be better than a bunch of nonsensical babbling.

 

[mhtal3at]

It's not certain that Muhammed was illiterate. But it doesn't really matter. Either way he could still have lied about the source of the Quran. Again, I'm not saying that he did lie but how do you know that he didn't?

You don't understand, Quran was sent down in Arabic, it wan not translated and is in the same form as it had been 1431 years ago, people have it, people read it, people memorize it, and the Quran is the same in the form it was written in, so no way that it has been distorted if that's what you imply. Muhammed was illiterate, and it is a miracle of God's the same as Jesus Christ was born from a mother that was never touched(now you'll say how do you know) well, as for Muhammed lying I don't think he would, first because he never needed to(why would he come up with something that people believe in and the system of which ruled the world peacefully(a nation that extended from China to Spain was the world back then) a nation that would only fall when corruption dominates. Second, because God promised not to let it be distorted.

 

[mhtal3at]

where are you from bro?

I thought you were out, because it got pointless, now you want to ask me things that are absolutely off point, I may consider leaving this topic.

 

[Codrus]

No religion knows, this relationship is kind of personal and between you and God. In Islam you don't have to go to somebody to satisfy the divine entity, you just pray from you to up.
(Who said that there is a religion that knows these answers, and what questions???)

so you are saying that there are multiple religions with multiple Cods and none of them know for certain if they are correct in the belief of that Cod...they are taking a chance in the hope that if there is an afterlife they have hitched there wagon to the right mule?

answer my question please

i dont think im going to get an answer...maybe he has me on ignore :cool

 

[mhtal3at]

even the "blind faith" answer would be better than a bunch of nonsensical babbling.

OK! you got yourself a question; show me your sensical talk, in believing there is a God, and telling him to stay off your way, you definition of God is a bit corrupted. Hating God will only get you in more trouble, especially when you believe in him. Just try to show me the wise words of your own. In fact, I don't know what you are arguing, you want people to condemn God for not satisfying you, or people to convince God to make your life better, I think I didn't quite get your point.

 

[Minor Axis]

OK! you got yourself a question; show me your sensical talk, in believing there is a God, and telling him to stay off your way, you definition of God is a bit corrupted. Hating God will only get you in more trouble, especially when you believe in him. Just try to show me the wise words of your own. In fact, I don't know what you are arguing, you want people to condemn God for not satisfying you, or people to convince God to make your life better, I think I didn't quite get your point.

I think his point is that just admitting it's your "faith" would be better than trying to prove based on religious documents and lore that the Islam view of God is the truth. A simple difference of opinion, if that is possible when it comes to religion.

 

[mhtal3at]

I think his point is that just admitting it's your "faith" would be better than trying to prove your religious views are accurate, that the Islam view of God is the truth.

I know Minor, and just said it to you, but this was for dkwrtw

 

[Codrus]

No religion knows, this relationship is kind of personal and between you and God. In Islam you don't have to go to somebody to satisfy the divine entity, you just pray from you to up.
(Who said that there is a religion that knows these answers, and what questions???)

so you are saying that there are multiple religions with multiple Cods and none of them know for certain if they are correct in the belief of that Cod...they are taking a chance in the hope that if there is an afterlife they have hitched there wagon to the right mule?

answer my question please

i dont think im going to get an answer...maybe he has me on ignore :cool

im going to go ahead and let fly since it appears that i will never get a response.

in confirming that there are multiple religions and multiple Cods....you cannot be a Muslim and/or believe in the religion of Islam , why or how can i say this you ask?

Islamic exegisists have always maintained that the confession of faith, the "shahada", which is the first cornerstone of Islam is twofold and reads :
"I bear witness that there is no God but Allah and that Muhammad is His servant and messenger."
("...and Muhammad is His servant and His messenger." is not part of the confession of faith as dictated by God, Those who still insist that the confession of faith contains the words should go back to the Quran and read carefully 2:285)

In Chapter 3, 'Ali-I'mran, at verse 18
"God bears witness that there is no god but Him and so do the angels and those possessed of knowledge. In justice, there is no god but Him, He is the exalted, the wise."

in Chapter 2, Al-Baqara, at verse 285
"The messenger has believed in what was revealed to him from his Lord and so have the believers; each has believed in God, His angels, His scriptures and His messengers. 'We do not differentiate among His messengers' and they said 'we heard and we obeyed; we seek your forgiveness, Our Lord, and unto You is our destiny'."

Thus the believers have five attributes:
(1) they believe in one God, Allah
(2) they believe in His angels,
(3) they believe in His books,
(4) they believe in His messengers and, finally,
(5) they do not differentiate among God's or the messengers whom they claim to believe in. Anyone who differentiates among God's or the messengers is, ipso facto, not a believer.

...i will go away now....for a little while anyway

 

[Minor Axis]

...i will go away now....for a little while anyway

But without an ID how do we know God is who he says he is? Seriously when it comes to celestial beings, how do you truly know whom you are dealing with? And what about that thing... God appears to different people by different names, names mostly likely created by the locals where God appeared? I mean "God" is pretty generic.

 

[mhtal3at]

im going to go ahead and let fly since it appears that i will never get a response.

in confirming that there are multiple religions and multiple Cods....you cannot be a Muslim and/or believe in the religion of Islam , why or how can i say this you ask?

Islamic exegisists have always maintained that the confession of faith, the "shahada", which is the first cornerstone of Islam is twofold and reads :
"I bear witness that there is no God but Allah and that Muhammad is His servant and messenger."
("...and Muhammad is His servant and His messenger." is not part of the confession of faith as dictated by God, Those who still insist that the confession of faith contains the words should go back to the Quran and read carefully 2:285)

In Chapter 3, 'Ali-I'mran, at verse 18
"God bears witness that there is no god but Him and so do the angels and those possessed of knowledge. In justice, there is no god but Him, He is the exalted, the wise."

in Chapter 2, Al-Baqara, at verse 285
"The messenger has believed in what was revealed to him from his Lord and so have the believers; each has believed in God, His angels, His scriptures and His messengers. 'We do not differentiate among His messengers' and they said 'we heard and we obeyed; we seek your forgiveness, Our Lord, and unto You is our destiny'."

Thus the believers have five attributes:
(1) they believe in one God, Allah
(2) they believe in His angels,
(3) they believe in His books,
(4) they believe in His messengers and, finally,
(5) they do not differentiate among God's or the messengers whom they claim to believe in. Anyone who differentiates among God's or the messengers is, ipso facto, not a believer.

...i will go away now....for a little while anyway

First you think you gave a retort

...i will go away now....for a little while anyway

, think again, there is a pretty big difference between Muslim and faithful, in order to become a Muslim, you have to be Faithful first(how can you believe in a religion that was sent down by God, to his Prophet, while you don't believe in neither or at least in one of them?)
A faithful person is(since you like quoting)
I will let Muhammed(PBUH) asnwer you from the Imam Nawawi's Fourty Hadeeth:Hadeeth number two:

Imam Nawawi’s forty hadeeth – Yahya ibn Sharaf an-Nawawi

Hadeeth 2
Also on the authority of Umar ibn al-Khattab (may Allah be pleased with him), who said:
One day while we were sitting with the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah
be upon him) there appeared before us a man whose clothes were exceedingly white and
whose hair was exceedingly black; no signs of journey were to be seen on him and none of
us knew him. He walked up and sat down in front of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him), with his knees touching against the Prophet’s (peace and blessings
of Allah be upon him) and placing the palms of his hands on his thighs he said, “O
Muhammad, tell me about Islam.”
The Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said, “Islam is
to testify that there is no deity worthy of worship but Allah and Muhammad is the
Messenger of Allah, to perform prayers, to give zakat, to fast in Ramadhan, and to
make the pilgrimage to the House if you are able to do so.”
He said, “You have spoken rightly”; and we were amazed at him asking him and saying
that he had spoken rightly. He [the man] then said, “Tell me about iman.”
The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said, “It is to believe in Allah,
His Angels, His Books, His Messengers, and the Last Day, and to believe in divine
destiny (qadr), both the good and the evil of it.”
He said, “You have spoken rightly.” He [the man] said, “Then tell me about ihsan.”
The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said, “It is to worship Allah
as though you see Him, and if you do not see Him, then (knowing that) truly He sees
you.”
He said, “Then tell me about the Hour.”
The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said, “The one questioned
about it knows no better than the questioner.”
He said, “Then tell me about its signs.”
The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said, “That the slave-girl will
give birth to her mistress, and that you will see barefooted, naked destitute shepherds
competing in constructing lofty buildings.”
Then he [the man] left, and I stayed for a time. The he [the Prophet (peace and blessings
of Allah be upon him)] said, “O Umar, do you know who the questioner was?” I said,
“Allah and His Messenger know best.” He said, “It was Jibreel, who came to teach you
your religion.”

It was related by Muslim.

P.S Iman is faithfulness.
Muhammed said it.
Now fix out what you mean, I am sure you got something better to say, and I am waiting for it.

Just so you know

I think you have sort of corruption, something tells me that your background tells you to think that Muhammed said that there were no prophets nor messengers before him, that is inaccurate anyway, and you have to know that all Muslims love all prophets and messengers the same, why not, God told us to(as you quoted), and we love God most, and believe in him, so we do as he says, and he says not to differentiate between them.

 

[mhtal3at]

how do we know God is who he says he is? .

You must be joking, where would he get out this ID from, which office do you recommend?
Am sure the thing is different with God, what do you recommend for God to prove he is God, just name it, really!

 

[Codrus]

But without an ID how do we know God is who he says he is? Seriously when it comes to celestial beings, how do you truly know whom you are dealing with? And what about that thing... God appears to different people by different names, names mostly likely created by the locals where God appeared? I mean "God" is pretty generic.

or what they thought was a god, but i agree, and any "Being" that has the power to do all that nifty stuff without mechanical or other means other than self..i will consider a god...no matter how many their might be. my point was based off of what i quoted M3ntal on..he stated that "no religion knew"..so not only did he acknowledge/accept other religious beliefs/gods, but he also took away his own.... according to his own religion

First you think you gave a retort
, think again, there is a pretty big difference between Muslim and faithful, in order to become a Muslim, you have to be Faithful first(how can you believe in a religion that was sent down by God, to his Prophet, while you don't believe in neither or at least in one of them?) I dont..havent you figured that out yet?
A faithful person is(since you like quoting)
I will let Muhammed(PBUH) asnwer you from the Imam Nawawi's Fourty Hadeeth:Hadeeth number two:
P.S Iman is faithfulness.
Muhammed said it.
Now fix out what you mean, I am sure you got something better to say, and I am waiting for it.

Just so you know

I think you have sort of corruption, something tells me that your background tells you to think that Muhammed said that there were no prophets nor messengers before him, that is inaccurate anyway,(<--so now your calling one of the main figures in your religion a liar?) and you have to know that all Muslims love all prophets and messengers the same, why not, God told us to (messengers and prophets of God/Allah ...to quote Conner MacLeod "there can be only one")(as you quoted), and we love God most, and believe in him, so we do as he says, and he says not to differentiate between them.

your still not answering the question or presenting a logical debate..you are a blind child trying to paint within the lines....and yes i was quoting,...i was using your own religion against you,....i know your religion, i know several religions that is part of my background, corruption?...funny you use that term when talking about religion..that is one of the reasons i don't believe...because man has corrupted all religions with his greed, his lust for power and control over others

you are going from A to 5 to L to 2,...so fix what you mean and what you are saying so people can understand you and respond , i am sure you have something better to say about something else....why dont you sing us a verse of "chocolate rain",...it would have to be better than what you have presented us with so far

 

[dkwrtw]

OK! you got yourself a question; show me your sensical talk, in believing there is a God, and telling him to stay off your way, you definition of God is a bit corrupted. Hating God will only get you in more trouble, especially when you believe in him. Just try to show me the wise words of your own. In fact, I don't know what you are arguing, you want people to condemn God for not satisfying you, or people to convince God to make your life better, I think I didn't quite get your point.

I never said that I believed in god bro, I said that I don't know or care if he exists, that IF he is real he should not intervene at all in peoples lives, my point is that I get by just fine without god in my life, I have never prayed to him or asked him for anything, and I asked where you are from because I am curious bro, the way you talk(type, whatever) suggests to me that english is not your first language, I was just curious as to where you are from, don't answer me if you don't want to.