Bullycide in America

[Codrus]

Boxers are good right up to the point you grab them. 2 Feet is perfect distance for a close-range hook, and at that distance you wouldn't see it coming

ok,..let me rephrase it...if i get within 2 feet of someone...its nighty night time.
ive tangled with boxers...and im not dumb enough try try and box them,..and those left or right hooks..you tend to expect at close range..you grab the arm and use it to your advantage

 

[edgray]

ok,..let me rephrase it...if i get within 2 feet of someone...its nighty night time

is that a challenge?

 

[Codrus]

is that a challenge?

i dont challenge..i defend and let them make a mistake

 

[edgray]

i dont challenge..i defend and let them make a mistake

:surrender

 

[Guyzerr]

There is one thing that hasn't been mentioned here...

as parents we have a responsibility to teach our own kids to NOT be bullies or to never treat others disrespectfully. If my boys turn out to be jocks, they won't engage in that behavior or they will answer to me.

Actually Tim I think you did when you said this...

I will teach them to ignore and be the better person,but if need be a quick take-down may be necessary.

 

[Guyzerr]

But when it comes to street fighting, invariably there isn't the room to kick. That's where a good left hook comes into play.

Actually there's lots of room for the use of boots. Ya just gotta know how and when to use 'em.


Anywhoo... it's real nice to know I'm not alone in my thinkin'. I really didn't think I was but it took a while for it to come out. So Ed.... you feeling lonely yet? :24:

 

[edgray]

So Ed.... you feeling lonely yet? :24:

loneliness is my only friend.

 

[darkangel]

I don't doubt Karate's power as a martial art, but stick a boxer in the ring against a karate master and the result is one KO'd Karate Master pretty much every time.

Have you ever seen a boxer beat a martial arts guy in the Octagon in UFC I think it's called? That's where they go one on one and let it all hang out. Just like in a real life fight. I've seen many boxers get their asses kicked in the Octagon...And not a single boxer win.

 

[edgray]

Have you ever seen a boxer beat a martial arts guy in the Octagon in UFC I think it's called? That's where they go one on one and let it all hang out. Just like in a real life fight. I've seen many boxers get their asses kicked in the Octagon...And not a single boxer win.

I've watched many of the training videos in MMA, they all study boxing at some level - you can't beat boxing punches - they're fast, powerful, effective and the boxers stance is highly defensive as well as being great for attacking. The most effective fighters in MMA have several disciplines they study, one for each range.

But I don't think the octagon is the same as out on the street. In the octagon, for example, it's very beneficial for grapplers to take a man down quickly. On the street that's a terrible tactic as it leaves the grappler vulnerable to attack from accomplices.

 

[darkangel]

But I don't think the octagon is the same as out on the street. In the octagon, for example, it's very beneficial for grapplers to take a man down quickly. On the street that's a terrible tactic as it leaves the grappler vulnerable to attack from accomplices.

We were talking about one on one boxers versus martial arts. Martial arts will beat boxing any day on the streets.

 

[edgray]

We were talking about one on one boxers versus martial arts. Martial arts will beat boxing any day on the streets.

I think it depends on so many factors, the skill level involved of both fighters, the setting, size, power, speed etc.

There's a great book, "Watch My Back" by Geoff Thompson, a world-renowned UK martial artist in which he details his rise as a notorious doorman on some of the UK's worst bars and nightclubs. The book contains details of some 300 fights. All of which were ended with jabs and hooks. There's only 1 kick thrown in the whole book, and no grappling whatsoever. A great book, well worth a read.

 

[darkangel]

I think it depends on so many factors, the skill level involved of both fighters, the setting, size, power, speed etc.

A martial artist is more disciplined than a boxer. They are taught as much offense as defense. I've seen many martial artists take down huge boxers and just choke them out. Martial art is an art. Boxing is just pure punching skills and defensive against punches and that's all.

 

[edgray]

A martial artist is more disciplined than a boxer. They are taught as much offense as defense. I've seen many martial artists take down huge boxers and just choke them out. Martial art is an art. Boxing is just pure punching skills and defensive against punches and that's all.

No boxing is so much more than that, it is actually a martial art too, you know, and requires a lot of discipline. Remember, boxers fight 10, sometimes 12 or even 15 rounds. You can't do that without 100% dedication.

Check out Bruce Lee's books too, he raves on about boxing, and his punching techniques (aside from the infamous and deadly "1 inch punch" of course ) in are based on western boxing because of it's effectiveness at attack and parry. He admired boxing's simplicity, and that was a big part of the development of his style of kung fu. He hated the unnecessary moves in martial arts that have little use other than for fancy displays, and developed his style to only have effective moves in it: jab, hook, uppercut, right cross, front snap kick and roundhouse.

 

[edgray]

A good quote about Geoff Thompson:

Thompson began his martial arts training in the Eastern arts including karate, Aikido and Kung-Fu. However, during his time as a nightclub doorman he found that what he had learned was inadequate for the reality of violence. Thompson came to realise the techniques encouraged and practised in touch contact and semi-contact martial arts were not always suitable for self defence. Though he utilizes a small core of techniques from touch contact and semi-contact martial arts as part of his teachings, Thompson prefers more pragmatic full-contact martial arts and combat sports such as boxing, kick boxing, Muay Thai and wrestling (Greco-Roman, Judo, Jujutsu and Freestyle).

 

[darkangel]

No boxing is so much more than that, it is actually a martial art too, you know, and requires a lot of discipline. Remember, boxers fight 10, sometimes 12 or even 15 rounds. You can't do that without 100% dedication.

How is boxing a Martial art? They punch, duck and have stamina. Martial arts covers a whole lot more than that...I've never seen a 15 round boxing match. Do they exist there or something?

 

[edgray]

How is boxing a Martial art? They punch, duck and have stamina. Martial arts covers a whole lot more than that...I've never seen a 15 round boxing match. Do they exist there or something?

I'm not sure if they go up to 15 these days, but I remember seeing a lot when I was a kid. More commonly nowadays they're 8, 10 & 12 for the epic battles.

Boxing is a martial art because it fits the criteria:

Martial arts or fighting arts are systems of codified practices and traditions of combat.

I know you hate wikipedia, but it's listed as one of the UKs martial arts: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_martial_arts

It's so much more than simply punching, ducking and being super fit. It really is a fighting system, like any other martial art.

Out of interest, have you studied a martial art yourself?

 

[darkangel]

Out of interest, have you studied a martial art yourself?

I have or rather had a Brown Belt in Karate. I studied in my 20's when I decided to send my daughter to take classes.

 

[edgray]

I have or rather had a Brown Belt in Karate. I studied in my 20's when I decided to send my daughter to take classes.

Nice! How much of it do you think you'd use in a street fight?

 

[darkangel]

Nice! How much of it do you think you'd use in a street fight?

Well I'm getting a little old to street fight but I would use all of it. I took it to help my daughter out when she needed to practice and also for self defense against rapists. And I have encountered that in my life.

 

[edgray]

Well I'm getting a little old to street fight but I would use all of it. I took it to help my daughter out when she needed to practice and also for self defense against rapists. And I have encountered that in my life.

All of it? A hook kick, for example?

There was a really interesting interchange between Bruce Lee and rival Kung Fu masters. Lee's style was simplicity, with only a handful of moves. He didn't see the point in learning something like a reverse round-house or an axe kick because he would never use them in a fighting situation. A rival master commented "it's better to know it and not need it" which is pretty sage advice. Lee then challenged one of their best fighters to a match, where legend has it, Lee said he would only use the most basic of moves (jab, right cross, uppercut, hook, front snap and roundhouse) and beat any opponent. He won.

It's actually quite interesting to read people's opinions on this subject. I myself studied kickboxing back in my twenties, along with a little kung-fu (my dojo taught both) and I have to say I'd never use anything I learnt in kung-fu, and wouldn't use most of what we learnt in kickboxing. Landing kicks is hard enough in the ring, but on the street you've got to be a genius to knock someone out with one. In the few altercations I've ever had, I only used a hook, an uppercut and a right cross. Fast, effective punches all with great knock out potential.

I think the idea of teaching a kid any kind of martial art is great, not only for defense, but for self-discipline and self confidence. I'd personally favour boxing, or kickboxing or muay thai over anything else.