Anti-Gay Concentration Camps

[Joe the meek]

haha, love how you put the disease part in the situation when no one is talking about disease. We're talking about rounding them up to "cure them" of homosexuality.


Rounding people up because they are gay and to "cure them" of homosexuality is immoral.


If they had some sort of ultra-deadly, apocalypse style virus I could see rounding them up, but they don't.


Now. I'm asking you. If your commander told you to round gays up to put them into camps to "cure" then of homosexuality, would you?

That's right about the disease part. We're talking hypothetical here, remember?

Personally, I don't like to answer hypothetical questions

 

[All Else Failed]

I'll take that as a yes.

 

[Joe the meek]

I'll take that as a yes.

Ohh, ohh, do I win something??????

How about more tokenz? or how about rep points?

 

[All Else Failed]

I'm just saying. You seem to be avoiding a direct repsonse because it seems to me you wouldn't mind seeing gays gathered up and put into camps.

 

[Joe the meek]

If they had some sort of ultra-deadly, apocalypse style virus I could see rounding them up, but they don't.

Yeah, and here's a news flash, the military isn't rounding up gays

 

[Joe the meek]

I'm just saying. You seem to be avoiding a direct repsonse because it seems to me you wouldn't mind seeing gays gathered up and put into camps.

Yeah, kind of like how some people think I'm a gun nut, but I wouldn't mind seeing some kind of mandatory training before you can actually own a gun.

 

[All Else Failed]

what




man up and be straight forward with me

 

[Tim]

Yeah, and here's a news flash, the military isn't rounding up gays

But it's funny that you still don't understand the fact that you swore an oath to the constitution. You can skirt around the question all you want, but you don't seem bright enough to grasp the concept

 

[The Doc]

Congress would amend the constitution if they planned on breaking it, so that they would technically be following the law. If the military was rounding up homosexuals then it was agreed upon by many different people. By rounding up homosexuals in camps would seem more like a Geneva Issue to me then a constitutional one at that point anyways.

Like i said you arent told WHY you do things just HOW you do things. With our modern set of laws though, no one would be stupid enought to say to you "Lets go collect Fags" and you say "Yes seargent lets go!!!". As for standing up and defending homosexuals if they were being tossed in concentration camps, we dont keep our weapons in our rooms or our homes. The weapons are property of the army. As soon as u get off the plane from iraq/afghanistan you return it. Its not like i can wake up one day decide something is not right, get my gear on, grab my m-4 and start wreaking vigalante justice lol. Everyone argued the whole patriot act thing about jailing people without trials was unconstitutional, but at the end of the day the Government won. A soldier will ask "How can i Get this done." The politician will ask "Why are we doing this?". I am telling you, you never ever ask WHY to someone above you when they tell you todo something.

 

[Joe the meek]

But it's funny that you still don't understand the fact that you swore an oath to the constitution. You can skirt around the question all you want, but you don't seem bright enough to grasp the concept

No, I understand.

I also understand Doc's very last sentence above this post.

 

[All Else Failed]

Congress would amend the constitution if they planned on breaking it, so that they would technically be following the law. If the military was rounding up homosexuals then it was agreed upon by many different people. By rounding up homosexuals in camps would seem more like a Geneva Issue to me then a constitutional one at that point anyways.

Like i said you arent told WHY you do things just HOW you do things. With our modern set of laws though, no one would be stupid enought to say to you "Lets go collect Fags" and you say "Yes seargent lets go!!!". As for standing up and defending homosexuals if they were being tossed in concentration camps, we dont keep our weapons in our rooms or our homes. The weapons are property of the army. As soon as u get off the plane from iraq/afghanistan you return it. Its not like i can wake up one day decide something is not right, get my gear on, grab my m-4 and start wreaking vigalante justice lol. Everyone argued the whole patriot act thing about jailing people without trials was unconstitutional, but at the end of the day the Government won. A soldier will ask "How can i Get this done." The politician will ask "Why are we doing this?". I am telling you, you never ever ask WHY to someone above you when they tell you todo something.

No see you can't imprison someone when they didn't do anything wrong.

also concentration camps would probably count as cruel and unusual punishment under the eight amendment in the bill of rights


you know, that thing you're also supposed to defend and uphold as well





I wouldn't call it stupid. The Germans had no problem with saying "Alright, lets round up all the jews!" publicly and rather loudly.

I am telling you, you never ever ask WHY to someone above you when they tell you todo something.

you probably should if the situation is THROWING FELLOW AMERICANS IN CONCENTRATION CAMPS.

 

[Francis]

Congress would amend the constitution if they planned on breaking it, so that they would technically be following the law. If the military was rounding up homosexuals then it was agreed upon by many different people. By rounding up homosexuals in camps would seem more like a Geneva Issue to me then a constitutional one at that point anyways.

Like i said you arent told WHY you do things just HOW you do things. With our modern set of laws though, no one would be stupid enought to say to you "Lets go collect Fags" and you say "Yes seargent lets go!!!". As for standing up and defending homosexuals if they were being tossed in concentration camps, we dont keep our weapons in our rooms or our homes. The weapons are property of the army. As soon as u get off the plane from iraq/afghanistan you return it. Its not like i can wake up one day decide something is not right, get my gear on, grab my m-4 and start wreaking vigalante justice lol. Everyone argued the whole patriot act thing about jailing people without trials was unconstitutional, but at the end of the day the Government won. A soldier will ask "How can i Get this done." The politician will ask "Why are we doing this?". I am telling you, you never ever ask WHY to someone above you when they tell you todo something.

OK so you understand people come out of closet at anytime in life right ?

Say the military decides in the next 5 years to do exactly what you say and round up the "Gays" and your Mom or dad who who ever the fuck decided to come out, because it does happen.. And the order is to shoot on site.. Or even worse you have a kid and find out he / she is gay..

Do you shoot them when you come face to face with them ?

You may not like "gays" at that point but I don't know anyone who would shoot a parent or child for the simple reason they are "Gay" especially if they are in the medical.. If you would I highly recommend you leave the field you promised to help people and gave an oath to save people and any cost, because in there it never said anything about letting "Gays" die..

I respect your right not to like gays, as much as I respect your right not to like blonde hair people or blue eyed people.. But just remember that for each gay person who is proud to be gay there are probably 2 that are afraid to say they are.. Will you live in fear of the ones you have no idea who they are and shoot straight people just because they "maybe" gay ? WOW...

 

[Tim]

Hey AEF, why do you even bother?

Apparently they can NOT grasp the concept that they swore to uphold the constitution. They are nothing more than robots trained to follow without question.
Numerous times in our history soldiers have tried the "I was only following orders" defense only to learn that it doesn't work. They are suppose to follow ALL lawful orders, even if it's sure to lead to their death. But they will be held accountable for their own actions if they follow an unlawful order.
Simple logic to the average joe.... I just don't think they can grasp the concept... I think you are wasting your time

 

[The Doc]

OK so you understand people come out of closet at anytime in life right ?

Say the military decides in the next 5 years to do exactly what you say and round up the "Gays" and your Mom or dad who who ever the fuck decided to come out, because it does happen.. And the order is to shoot on site.. Or even worse you have a kid and find out he / she is gay..

Do you shoot them when you come face to face with them ?

You may not like "gays" at that point but I don't know anyone who would shoot a parent or child for the simple reason they are "Gay" especially if they are in the medical.. If you would I highly recommend you leave the field you promised to help people and gave an oath to save people and any cost, because in there it never said anything about letting "Gays" die..

I respect your right not to like gays, as much as I respect your right not to like blonde hair people or blue eyed people.. But just remember that for each gay person who is proud to be gay there are probably 2 that are afraid to say they are.. Will you live in fear of the ones you have no idea who they are and shoot straight people just because they "maybe" gay ? WOW...

What the fuck are you talking about. I have said a couple times in this thread I PERSONALLY WOULD NOT SUPPORT THE KILLING OR DETAINING OF HOMOSEXUALS but IF IT HAPPENED I WOULDENT CARE. You can not shoot anyone who does not pose a threat to you, that is violating Geneva law which i must very closely follow in the Medical field with my non-combatant status. I DO NOT SHOOT ANYONE UNLESS PERSONALLY PROTECTING MYSELF OR MY PATIENTS. That is the law. At no fucking point did i ever say i would shoot homosexuals. If they shot at me, hell the fuck yes i would shoot back. If they are just walking around being gay, I DONT CARE ABOUT THEM.

If for some reason mexico decided to start rounding up and killing homosexuals I WOULD NOT CARE. If i was ordered to go there and liberate them from that, i surely would. I would save as many as i can because its my job, i am ordered to be there and protect them. I cant just break into the Troop Arms room and grab my weapons and do some Vigilante Justice.

In the US, if homosexuals are being rounded up and put in camps and i think its wrong... i cant just buy a personal weapon and go around serving what i think is justice. I dont lose sleep over shit i have no control over.

I have stated this before. Homosexuality is a behavior, just like stealing, violence or sucking your thumb. It can be taught, learned, rejected etc. Your not born gay. Regardless, i may not approve of their homosexual behavior but they are still human beings. They bleed like I do, cry when they are sad like I do, and smile when they are happy...like i do. I understand that concept. What your not understanding is i have enough of a headache worry about my FRIENDS, my FAMILY and my PLATOON. Death is a re-occuring theme for me in those 3 groups for me. I cant get hung over death, because i have people to take care of. I am busy dealing with death in MY FRIENDS, FAMILY, and PLATOON i cant afford to waste time worrying about insignificant people that dont affect my life in any way, shape or form...like homosexuals for example.

If you told me today everyone in Croatia with a birth mark on their ass is going to be rounded up and killed. I would give you the exact same response as i did with the homosexuals being rounded. Both of theese are a group of people that dont matter to me at all.

I hope you understand now. Theres a different between AGRESSION and not giving a fuck. I am the latter.

 

[Joe the meek]

Hey AEF, why do you even bother?

Apparently they can NOT grasp the concept that they swore to uphold the constitution. They are nothing more than robots trained to follow without question.
Numerous times in our history soldiers have tried the "I was only following orders" defense only to learn that it doesn't work. They are suppose to follow ALL lawful orders, even if it's sure to lead to their death. But they will be held accountable for their own actions if they follow an unlawful order.
Simple logic to the average joe.... I just don't think they can grasp the concept... I think you are wasting your time

Tim

I've got to ask, have you ever served in the military?

No, nothing to do with respect, but understand the meaning of taking orders.

You guys are missing Doc's point about what it would take for the orders to actually come down.

It's not like on a Friday night a CO comes in and says "come on boys, we're going to round the fags up and hog tie em because that's what I want you dumb fucks to do!"

I also find it funny that no one has even questioned the title of this thread. How many pro gay concentration camps can you find? :24:

 

[Tim]

Tim
No
I've got to ask, have you ever served in the military?

No, nothing to do with respect, but understand the meaning of taking orders.

You guys are missing Doc's point about what it would take for the orders to actually come down.

It's not like on a Friday night a CO comes in and says "come on boys, we're going to round the fags up and hog tie em because that's what I want you dumb fucks to do!"

I also find it funny that no one has even questioned the title of this thread. How many pro gay concentration camps can you find? :24:

No I have not served in the military, my service comes every time I pay my taxes/your pay.

But I don't need to be in the military to understand contracts, obligations and the law. I don't need to be a police officer to understand that they will be held accountable if they break the law, even if they are ordered by their superior to do so.
And I am fully capable to understand the oath you took upon signing up.
Why don't you just ask those soldiers that are serving time for mistreating the prisoners in abu ghraib prison. They were following orders yet the court held them accountable for their actions because they should have disobeyed an unlawful order. Can you understand that? (It's not a hypothetical)

 

[Joe the meek]

No I have not served in the military, my service comes everytime I pay my taxes/your pay.

But I don't need to be in the military to understand contacts, obligations and the law. I don't need to be a police officer to understand that they will be held accountable if they break the law, even if they are ordered by their superior to do so.
And I am fully capable to understand the oath you took upon signing up.
Why don't you just ask those soldiers that are serving time for mistreating the prisoners in abu ghraib prison. They were following orders yet the court held them accountable for their actions because they shoul vedsobeyed an unlawful order. Can you understand that? (It's not a hypothetical)

Well thank you for your service SIR! (honestly, big deal, I've been in the rat race a good 20 years as well).

Per your question on the prison, yes, those men/women should be held accountable for their actions. That said, I think I have a pretty good understanding on how they could of ended up in their situation.

Here is a fact SIR! no one can answer for certain what they would do in the future, particularly under continued stressful conditions, lasting long periods of time.

So, when civilians say for certain what they would or would not do in an environment that they pretty much don't have a clue about, I take that with a grain of salt.

 

[Tim]

So do you think they did the right thing by following unlawful orders? Do you think they should be in jail for following orders?

 

[Tim]

Oh, and there is no need to thank me... Its the least I can do.

 

[The Doc]

No I have not served in the military, my service comes every time I pay my taxes/your pay.

But I don't need to be in the military to understand contracts, obligations and the law. I don't need to be a police officer to understand that they will be held accountable if they break the law, even if they are ordered by their superior to do so.
And I am fully capable to understand the oath you took upon signing up.
Why don't you just ask those soldiers that are serving time for mistreating the prisoners in abu ghraib prison. They were following orders yet the court held them accountable for their actions because they should have disobeyed an unlawful order. Can you understand that? (It's not a hypothetical)

You havent served in the military, so im guessing you watched Black Hawk Down or saving Private Ryan and think your a military expert. being in the military has very little todo with movies or commercials you see. You follow a completely different set of laws, Uniformed Code Of Military Justice. The bill of rights no longer apply to you, you have temporarily lost alot of your rights as a citizen. You are GOVERNMENT PROPERTY. If i got depressed today and started cutting my forearms (Self Mutilation) I would get UCMJ for DAMAGING GOVERNMENT PROPERTY.

"I was just following Orders" is not an escuse todo something unlawful. Its been used for years now, but it doesnt work. The point i was trying to make about following orders, is your not told WHY but HOW. i.e Today we are briefied we will be going to san francisco in the gay part to detain certain personell in certain locations. We would be kicking down the door, and detaining who we came for. Not shooting unless aggression is shown to us. There is nothing unlawful against detaining. Once they leave us for interrogaters/military police etc.. those guys decide wheather they are a threat and can be lot go or not, further interrogation, etc... MP's do that sort of stuff, determining guilt and innocence.

Our order to grab someone and get them to the MP's is not unlawful. It happened to me when i was a teenager. Cops detain me, take me to the station, 2 hours later realize i didnt do anything wrong and let me go.

Also, paying Taxes isnt your "service" its your obligation. Its the law, thats why you do it. When i walk in a store, im not doing the store a service by buying the product instead of just stealing it, im following the law.