Hey Atheists! Why?

[333halfabeast]

Okay glad to have you by my side. Quick! You distract the atheists with your good looks because they walk in the flesh while i gather some information.:jk

Southern Baptist? Pentecostal? Evangelical? Just curious.

 

[All Else Failed]

First off. If you were really a religious person the faithless are not your enemy, they are just the wayward sheep. Secondly, read my posts again. I just don't believe in organized religion.

I'd rather be a goat than a sheep.

 

[333halfabeast]

I'd rather be a goat than a sheep.

The flock binds and saves you from the wolves. Just saying.

 

[StanJon]

Mr. Failed, if i testify to you and tell you that i was a sickly person and being a believer, send my request to Jesus to heal me completely and am now healthy. Would you be open mined, and believe me? Or would you try to say that is nature or some nonsense like that.

 

[All Else Failed]

Mr. Failed, if i testify to you and tell you that i was a sickly person and being a believer, send my request to Jesus to heal me completely and am now healthy. Would you be open mined, and believe me? Or would you try to say that is nature or some nonsense like that.

A) you could be lying

B) your new good health was most likely purely biological in nature and had nothing to do with prayer. What were you sick with?

The flock binds and saves you from the wolves. Just saying.

I'd rather be the wolf. Sheep are sheep.

What are you even implying? What am I in danger of?

 

[333halfabeast]

A) you could be lying

B) your new good health was most likely purely biological in nature and had nothing to do with prayer. What were you sick with?

I don't really agree. the power of prayer is real. Whether the reaction is psychosomatic or divine, it still works. Kind of like the old "Indian" tricks. Say you have a cramp, you go find a round rock and spit under it. Why, because it takes your mind off the pain, gets you to stretch to pick up the rock and spit and so on. Same thing with prayer.

 

[All Else Failed]

I don't really agree. the power of prayer is real. Whether the reaction is psychosomatic or divine, it still works. Kind of like the old "Indian" tricks. Say you have a cramp, you go find a round rock and spit under it. Why, because it takes your mind off the pain, gets you to stretch to pick up the rock and spit and so on. Same thing with prayer.

I think you're referring to the "placebo effect". Even then, its your brain that is taking your mind off of things, not some divine source of power. What if I find a rock and spit under it and still have pain?


If prayer works, then why do people in hospitals die? Why do mothers who pray for their son's safety in Iraq die? Why do wars happen when so many people throughout our existence pray for it to go away? I suppose god is quite picky when answering prayers and selecting who will be brutally killed or not.

 

[333halfabeast]

I'd rather be the wolf. Sheep are sheep.

What are you even implying? What am I in danger of?

We all work and live together "sheep" Goats are greedy and just for themselves, Wolves are evil and kill sheep. That is the full implicitness of my statement. So to function at a civil and cohesive level some level of conformity is required. Making us all sheep or wolves.

 

[Tim]

I don't really agree. the power of prayer is real. Whether the reaction is psychosomatic or divine, it still works. Kind of like the old "Indian" tricks. Say you have a cramp, you go find a round rock and spit under it. Why, because it takes your mind off the pain, gets you to stretch to pick up the rock and spit and so on. Same thing with prayer.

I agree with this in part... altering your mind and body is well documented. But that does not even come close to a divine intervention. Like you could not pray for god to save you if you fell off a very tall building. Gravity will take it's course and finish you off no matter how strong your faith or how many people are praying for you. And if god can cure the terminally ill, he can surely allow you to land softly on your feet from a 40 story building...

 

[StanJon]

A) you could be lying

B) your new good health was most likely purely biological in nature and had nothing to do with prayer. What were you sick with?



I'd rather be the wolf. Sheep are sheep.

What are you even implying? What am I in danger of?

Not me. But i have seen a lot of people, who had cancer, a swollen foot that it have to cut off (dont remember what it is called) and many more severe illness, and they were heal by prayer and fasting.

I am Pentecostal beast. (curiosity kill the cat)

 

[All Else Failed]

We all work and live together "sheep" Goats are greedy and just for themselves, Wolves are evil and kill sheep. That is the full implicitness of my statement. So to function at a civil and cohesive level some level of conformity is required. Making us all sheep or wolves.

Sheep are symbolically bad because they refer to the status quo, people who do not think. Sure, there must be a certain level of conformity, however one must be a wolf to not fall into madness because of conformity.

 

[333halfabeast]

I think you're referring to the "placebo effect". Even then, its your brain that is taking your mind off of things, not some divine source of power. What if I find a rock and spit under it and still have pain?


If prayer works, then why do people in hospitals die? Why do mothers who pray for their son's safety in Iraq die? Why do wars happen when so many people throughout our existence pray for it to go away? I suppose god is quite picky when answering prayers and selecting who will be brutally killed or not.

See, now you have taken the slippery slope and jumped from simple prayer to heal yourself to metaphysics and philosophy of a greater being and the will of that being. I am simply saying that the placebo effect works and whether that is manifested in a sugar pill for the faithless or prayer for the faithful it is still is effective. But like anything else zealous people and corruption usually ruin the original intent because it is driven by the greedy human instead of the message.

 

[All Else Failed]

Not me. But i have seen a lot of people, who had cancer, a swollen foot that it have to cut off (dont remember what it is called) and many more severe illness, and they were heal by prayer and fasting.

I am Pentecostal beast. (curiosity kill the cat)

I always hear this from Christians. "I've seen a lot of people healed by prayer!". I can't take them seriously since they could be possibly just lying to make a point. Their illnesses could have easily went away on their own. That happens. My grandmother had cancer, and it went into remission and pretty much went away. No prayer, no nothing. It happens.

 

[All Else Failed]

See, now you have taken the slippery slope and jumped from simple prayer to heal yourself to metaphysics and philosophy of a greater being and the will of that being. I am simply saying that the placebo effect works and whether that is manifested in a sugar pill for the faithless or prayer for the faithful it is still is effective. But like anything else zealous people and corruption usually ruin the original intent because it is driven by the greedy human instead of the message.

well yeah it works sometimes but the placebo effect is not the same as willing a divine power to heal you.

 

[333halfabeast]

Sheep are symbolically bad because they refer to the status quo, people who do not think. Sure, there must be a certain level of conformity, however one must be a wolf to not fall into madness because of conformity.

Conformity is not madness, it is order. Blind faith and patriotism is where the conformity starts to become the insanity.

 

[All Else Failed]

Conformity is not madness, it is order. Blind faith and patriotism is where the conformity starts to become the insanity.

You don't see how conformity can lead to madness? Conformity is why we have zealots. Conformity is why we have useless pop culture which turns people's minds into mush. Conformity is why originality is destroyed. All great creators are wolves.

 

[333halfabeast]

I agree with this in part... altering your mind and body is well documented. But that does not even come close to a divine intervention. Like you could not pray for god to save you if you fell off a very tall building. Gravity will take it's course and finish you off no matter how strong your faith or how many people are praying for you. And if god can cure the terminally ill, he can surely allow you to land softly on your feet from a 40 story building...

Duality does not exist in this world. Things are not always polar opposites.

Not me. But i have seen a lot of people, who had cancer, a swollen foot that it have to cut off (dont remember what it is called) and many more severe illness, and they were heal by prayer and fasting.

I am Pentecostal beast. (curiosity kill the cat)

I can tell by the zeal in the way you approach this discussion.

 

[333halfabeast]

You don't see how conformity can lead to madness? Conformity is why we have zealots. Conformity is why we have useless pop culture which turns people's minds into mush. Conformity is why originality is destroyed. All great creators are wolves.

Actually, by the definitions I laid out before, the people that are leading some sheep astray and into zealous actions are the wolves. Even sheep have leaders but they only lead to the next green pasture, not into a trap with another pack of wolves to eat them.

Okay the metaphors are difficult to understand I am sure.

 

[All Else Failed]

Actually, by the definitions I laid out before, the people that are leading some sheep astray and into zealous actions are the wolves. Even sheep have leaders but they only lead to the next green pasture, not into a trap with another pack of wolves to eat them.

Okay the metaphors are difficult to understand I am sure.

these metaphors are getting silly.


Conformity: Mostly bad


Individuality (not individualism): good

 

[StanJon]

Duality does not exist in this world. Things are not always polar opposites.



I can tell by the zeal in the way you approach this discussion.

you knew i was pentecostal? How did i approach? Now you guys have forced me to draw the big guns.