Divine Hiddenness

[anathelia]

IMO, if I may, I think He encourages an open mind, that's why He created us with such an inqusitive one. We're not little dolls that he created in order for Him to play house with on a rainy saturday afternoon....we're much more than that. He's given us so much, and He expects us to question it...just like He expects us to experience life and death and anything else that may come our way, good or bad, we learn from it all.

I agree with you. The pastor at my church, however, would not. And a lot of die-hard Christians will tell you the same. There are a lot of people out there who believe the bible is to be taken literally.

 

[sexysadie]

I suppose. But, imo, your faith is not your best attribute. Your sexy flirtatious nature is.

I suppose I could say the same thing about you

 

[sexysadie]

I agree with you. The pastor at my church, however, would not. And a lot of die-hard Christians will tell you the same. There are a lot of people out there who believe the bible is to be taken literally.

That's what I don't get, I mean, I believe in God with all my heart, and trust me when I say that mine was not an easy heart to win over....like many, I've had my moments, to say the least, but I've pulled through with His help. What I dont' understand is, this word 'christian'....when most people hear it they cringe. Could it be that they're judging God by the few so called christians that they've had to encounter? I consider myself to be a Christian but I rarely use that word....I'm just me and I believe in God. that's it.

 

[anathelia]

That's what I don't get, I mean, I believe in God with all my heart, and trust me when I say that mine was not an easy heart to win over....like many, I've had my moments, to say the least, but I've pulled through with His help. What I dont' understand is, this word 'christian'....when most people hear it they cringe. Could it be that they're judging God by the few so called christians that they've had to encounter? I consider myself to be a Christian but I rarely use that word....I'm just me and I believe in God. that's it.

People cringe because, unfortunately, the few loud mouth over-zealous Christians out there have given people an impression that we're all crazy.

I prefer to not associate myself with a particular religion. It's kind of like with politics, I believe what I believe, and that doesn't perfectly fit with any religion.

 

[sexysadie]

People cringe because, unfortunately, the few loud mouth over-zealous Christians out there have given people an impression that we're all crazy.

I prefer to not associate myself with a particular religion. It's kind of like with politics, I believe what I believe, and that doesn't perfectly fit with any religion.

Exactly, that's why I don't go to church. When I was younger...lol..I attended church on a regular basis and I enjoyed it for the most part, but the people were horrible. They were show offish rich minded cold hard assed empty minded hypocrites as far as I was concerned and I didn't want to associate with them at all. My last sunday in church became my last because those so called christians turned away a man who walked in off of the street in old blue jeans and a tshirt, just because he was different. I guess one had to dress in furs and expensive jewels to get along in that church....I was actually worried about them on rainy sundays that most of them would drown....lol...nose up in the air? get it?...lol

 

[Minor Axis]

People cringe because, unfortunately, the few loud mouth over-zealous Christians out there have given people an impression that we're all crazy.

I prefer to not associate myself with a particular religion. It's kind of like with politics, I believe what I believe, and that doesn't perfectly fit with any religion.

Would you call yourself a Christian or something close? I'm speaking of the foundation of Christianity. Christ = Son of God, part of Holy Trinity.

 

[anathelia]

Would you call yourself a Christian or something close? I'm speaking of the foundation of Christianity. Christ = Son of God, part of Holy Trinity.

In that sense, yes. But I don't like labels.

 

[sexysadie]

In that sense, yes. But I don't like labels.

What she said:thumbup

 

[Minor Axis]

In that sense, yes. But I don't like labels.

And I assume your familiarity with Christ is based on the Bible and a bunch of adults who indoctrinated you as a child? What is the basis for trusting the Bible as an accurate representation and defacto proof of God as described? This is a rhetorical question, as I don't expect you to explain yourself, but you may recognize the dilemma. Just because a bunch of adults believe, have elaborate rituals in a fancy building, is this a reason for you to believe? What if you were born on the opposite side of the World, maybe you would have been exposed to a different religion that does not recognize Jesus as the Son of God? My intent is not to belittle your beliefs but provoke some alternate ideas. I realize my chances are slim. Once the God theory variant has taken root, it is really hard to consider any other possibility because it feels so comforting.

 

[BornReady]

I realize my chances are slim. Once the God theory variant has taken root, it is really hard to consider any other possibility because it feels so comforting.

One of my teachers in high school told me the worldview a person has at age 30 will most likely be the one they die with. He never backed that up with anything so I don't know if it's true. If so, then I'm an exception.

 

[Peter Parka]

One of my teachers in high school told me the worldview a person has at age 30 will most likely be the one they die with. He never backed that up with anything so I don't know if it's true. If so, then I'm an exception.

It was probably true because he had faith in that belief.:24:

 

[sexysadie]

It was probably true because he had faith in that belief.:24:

Perhaps he's speaking from experience........his own experience. Besides the typical replies, are you able to provide me with some proof that He DOESN'T exist?

 

[Peter Parka]

Perhaps he's speaking from experience........his own experience. Besides the typical replies, are you able to provide me with some proof that He DOESN'T exist?

I believe that their are ants orbitting the earth in flying toasters. Can you prove there arn't? That is why your argument there is spurious.
Its up to the believer to prove their belief, not the other way round. And blind faith is no evidence whatsoever.

 

[Minor Axis]

Perhaps he's speaking from experience........his own experience. Besides the typical replies, are you able to provide me with some proof that He DOESN'T exist?

So, if "unable to prove" is the standard, might I assume you also believe in the Greek/Roman Gods? My point is when it comes to spirituality proof/disproof is not really part of the emotional equation. Many of us believe in such things simply because we want to. It makes us feel good. In contrast those who require proof are using a reasonable standard to live their lives by, probably the best standard. Saying I don't believe in something, really is saying there is no basis to believe in that something. I'm sure most Atheists will agree with this. However, when it comes to spirituality, due to the something I sense, I prefer to say "I don't know."

The religions I'm familiar with try to put individuals on the spot to commit to a God the individual may not see. This is a human failing. I'm convinced that a high percentage of people attend church to hedge their bets. "I can't see this God, but if I do all the "right" things, I'll be in good shape for judgment day." I don't think God would be impressed by someone "just going through the motions" to gain favor. Doing the right thing because it is the right thing to do is what counts, not to gain favor. However, I do believe good people do good things because it does make them feel good, not to make their God happy. I feel that if we have spirits and our existence continues in some manner, living a good life, being a good person, gaining wisdom could have an outcome on our spiritual development. This is something that can't be told to you, you must feel it. Therefore it is a human standard, not God's standard. And feeling these things has nothing to do with if you believe in a particular God or not.

As I said before, the issue I have with people who say they believe in God is not that they believe in "God", a higher power of some kind, but when they claim to know all the details as fed to them by their Church. This is God's word, these are God's rules 1,2,3. In contrast I find the concept of "God" to be a large mysterious abstract. Yes there could be something there. But, I don't think our belief is that important to any deity who may desire a relationship with us, otherwise it would not be this much of a mystery. The sermon is over for now.

 

[sexysadie]

I believe that their are ants orbitting the earth in flying toasters. Can you prove there arn't? That is why your argument there is spurious.
Its up to the believer to prove their belief, not the other way round. And blind faith is no evidence whatsoever.

On the contrary my love, yours is where this so called debate begins....I've never started a thread making you or anybody else here look like a lunatic for believing in something....and your flying toaster comment just proves my point....I would go so far as to say that your comment was insulting and demeaning but I just love it when you use such desperate examples as an argument....aha...it makes ME look bad...lol Please!

 

[Peter Parka]

On the contrary my love, yours is where this so called debate begins....I've never started a thread making you or anybody else here look like a lunatic for believing in something....and your flying toaster comment just proves my point....I would go so far as to say that your comment was insulting and demeaning but I just love it when you use such desperate examples as an argument....aha...it makes ME look bad...lol Please!

:24::24::24:

So basically, despite all the comments on here, the only thing you can bring to the table is "I believe it, because I have faith" and to point out that is a nothing argument is insulting and demeaning. You really are one sensitive individual! Yes, believing in something with absolutely nothing to back it up is a very convincing argument!:sarcasm

 

[sexysadie]

:24::24::24:

So basically, despite all the comments on here, the only thing you can bring to the table is "I believe it, because I have faith" and to point out that is a nothing argument is insulting and demeaning. You really are one sensitive individual! Yes, believing in something with absolutely nothing to back it up is a very convincing argument!:sarcasm

I dont' believe in God because I have faith, if faith was like that then I'd believe in everything you say too and we all know that's not so...lol My reasons for believing are complicated but they're real.. Why is it that whenever you're faced with somebody that believes in God you pull out your 'sarcasm' button? :24:

 

[edgray]

Perhaps he's speaking from experience........his own experience. Besides the typical replies, are you able to provide me with some proof that He DOESN'T exist?

it's actually impossible to prove that something does not exist. The burden of proof, as Peter said, lies squarely in the hands of the believers.

 

[sexysadie]

So, if "unable to prove" is the standard, might I assume you also believe in the Greek/Roman Gods? My point is when it comes to spirituality proof/disproof is not really part of the emotional equation. Many of us believe in such things simply because we want to. It makes us feel good. In contrast those who require proof are using a reasonable standard to live their lives by, probably the best standard. Saying I don't believe in something, really is saying there is no basis to believe in that something. I'm sure most Atheists will agree with this. However, when it comes to spirituality, due to the something I sense, I prefer to say "I don't know."

The religions I'm familiar with try to put individuals on the spot to commit to a God the individual may not see. This is a human failing. I'm convinced that a high percentage of people attend church to hedge their bets. "I can't see this God, but if I do all the "right" things, I'll be in good shape for judgment day." I don't think God would be impressed by someone "just going through the motions" to gain favor. Doing the right thing because it is the right thing to do is what counts, not to gain favor. However, I do believe good people do good things because it does make them feel good, not to make their God happy. I feel that if we have spirits and our existence continues in some manner, living a good life, being a good person, gaining wisdom could have an outcome on our spiritual development. This is something that can't be told to you, you must feel it. Therefore it is a human standard, not God's standard. And feeling these things has nothing to do with if you believe in a particular God or not.

As I said before, the issue I have with people who say they believe in God is not that they believe in "God", a higher power of some kind, but when they claim to know all the details as fed to them by their Church. This is God's word, these are God's rules 1,2,3. In contrast I find the concept of "God" to be a large mysterious abstract. Yes there could be something there. But, I don't think our belief is that important to any deity who may desire a relationship with us, otherwise it would not be this much of a mystery. The sermon is over for now.

I dont' need a reason to feel good about myself, that's just who I am.

 

[Peter Parka]

Its up to you what you believe but if you're going to come in a debate about god and the only thing you're got is "I have faith" or your reasons are just "complicated" without any attempt to explain them, you're not going to convince any one of anything.