Please, tell me your argument. I WILL listen. I am here to learn not just to argue for hours on end and get no where. If your argument is better then so be it... you win. If I ask questions to your argument than I am clarifying things and am not trying to disproof you.
Abortion. Right or wrong?
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Alex Kanashi
New Member
That is the best sitution for a girl to do when she's 14 or 15 and expecting a baby. I hold nothing agianst girls who do this
No...i dont agree with that. That just sends the message to kids that age that they can go off and have tons of sex with no consequences, just because of their age. If you feel that you are mature enough to have sex, then you need to understand that there are risks to that and accept those risks and the outcome if you choose to go through with it.
I don't agree with the statement above yours Darkstar about it being the best thing for young girls. Educating them is the best solution...
But you have to remember that they are kids, they are not mature enough to accept those risks because they have sex. Just because an 8 year old can pick up a bottle of Vodka and drink it, does not make him mature enough to handle his actions while drunk. The fact that 14-15 year olds are getting pregnant shows that there is more need for parental involvement. at 14-15 they shouldn't be allowed to be in situations where they aren't suppervised around boys.
Peter Parka
Well-Known Member
Come on Tim, how can you make sure a boy and girl of that age are supervised together 24/7 and how are they supposed to learn about developing relationships with members of the opposite sex if there is always an adult watching them? I think if you did that they would grow up a very emotionally stunted individual!
My mom tried that with my younger sister. She just went out and did it elsewhere. She told me mother that her first child was conceived IN SCHOOL. Education can help, yes. But for some kids, it just doesnt work. Come on...we've all seen the Maury Show.
You make sure as a parent you are involved in your childs life. You cannot supervise them 24/7 but you can raise them with morals and disipline. You don't let your teen run the house, you ask them where they are going, with whom they will be with, when they will be home. You call suzies mom to make sure that your daughter is there and that they will be under supervision. You tell your kids to come home striaght from school...
Why is it so far fetched that a parent actually does their job and raise their children to KNOW right from wrong and have a strong moral upbringing that helps steer them from making wrong decisions in life? Why does it sound strange to you that making sure your teen isn't running around town with god knows who can't be accomplished.
My daughter is almost 18... and like most teen girls, she has tried to pull fast ones on me. I have always wanted to know where she was, who she was with, when she would be home. But none of that would be any good if I didn't raise her to respect me and to respect her elders. She knows I ask because I care because I have always told her that. She also knows to tell me the truth about where she is going because I do check. I just don't send her on her way and trust that everything will be alright... Now that she is 17, she has a lot more freedom, but she is still in my care for now. When she was younger, I met all her friends. She wasn't able to sleep over at a friends house unless I met the other parents and approved of how they raised their own child. I did the things that a good parent should do. I always knew that being tough yet fair was better for her. She had her freedom yet she knew what was expected from her to keep that freedom. Being consistant with punishment let her know from one day to the next what was expected of her.
Hell, I'm just rambling now... but I firmly believe that how a child acts is directly linked to how well a parent raised that child. If you have a 13 year old pregnant teen as a daughter, then you have failed her someplace along the way.
Peter Parka
Well-Known Member
Yes raise them with morals and try and find out who they are with and what they are doing but as you yourself said, your daughter has tried to pull a fast one before. That is the point I'm making, whatever you do you cannot always be in control of what your kids do. Kids need to gradually be given more responsibility as they mature.
I completely agree with you. It is a parent's job to guide their children through life, instilling good morals and forming them into decent human beings. The point I was trying to make was only that if a kid DOES make a mistake that ends up with them being pregnant or impregnating someone else, that the lesson be learned by accepting that responsibility.
First off, abortion is a personal choice that none of us has the business of sticking our noses into. You can argue for it or against it ad infinitum, but it comes down to what your own personal morals and views are. Simply put, if you don't like it, don't do it.
I'm the mother of (almost) 15 year old twins. From the time they could form simple words, I had started giving them simple choices; food, clothes, toys, etc., always instilling the fact that each choice has an outcome and that they couldn't change the choice at whim. Choose spaghetti, that's it. As they got older, choices became more important, as did the consequences.
Teenagers will try to 'pull one over'-it's the nature of the beast. It's called exerting independence and we've all done it. But by instilling the life fact that there will always be consequences to choices and actions, we as parents hope that they remember this and choose wisely.
I think it's also important that parents instill as second nature, honesty. I would and have found it more important to do something wrong and own up to it than to lie and cover it up-my kids have gotten punished harsher for lying than for making stupid decisions.
All this may or may not have impact regarding sexual maturation, but statistics show that it is not teenagers who seek the most abortions-it is women between the ages of 18-35, when, supposedly they already know the consequences of poor choices.
I'm the mother of (almost) 15 year old twins. From the time they could form simple words, I had started giving them simple choices; food, clothes, toys, etc., always instilling the fact that each choice has an outcome and that they couldn't change the choice at whim. Choose spaghetti, that's it. As they got older, choices became more important, as did the consequences.
Teenagers will try to 'pull one over'-it's the nature of the beast. It's called exerting independence and we've all done it. But by instilling the life fact that there will always be consequences to choices and actions, we as parents hope that they remember this and choose wisely.
I think it's also important that parents instill as second nature, honesty. I would and have found it more important to do something wrong and own up to it than to lie and cover it up-my kids have gotten punished harsher for lying than for making stupid decisions.
All this may or may not have impact regarding sexual maturation, but statistics show that it is not teenagers who seek the most abortions-it is women between the ages of 18-35, when, supposedly they already know the consequences of poor choices.
Alex Kanashi
New Member
Hold on Darkstar, I'm a virgin and i never had sex and i won't until i'm married
Alex Kanashi
New Member
Thanks most people tease me about it
andcuriouser
Active Member
And how do you know that, exactly?
I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. From what I understand, you mean that past civilizations were anti-abortion? Not at all.
Hippocrates (you know, that famous Greek physician) actually reccommended to a dancer to jump up and down to induce a miscarriage. In cultures all over the world, abortions were tolerated and sometimes even acknowledged as necessary; China, Greece, Rome, India, Japan, England, native tribes in New Zealand ...
Abortion has been with us since the beginning, in many different forms. It could vary from actual surgical procedures to pushing on the pregnant belly or doing a lot of strenuous work with the intent of having a miscarriage.
Past empires and nations never "declined" abortion. It was regarded as a necessary means to an end.
I would think the two worst things would be more along the lines of, oh I don't know, world hunger and war? Poverty and disease? That sort of thing. It seems a little silly to me to feel that sodomy and abortion are the lowest of lows when there is really so much worse that actually matters. If you choose not to engage in sodomy, fine. It will never, ever effect you what people do behind closed doors.
Uh. No.
Ancient Jews, for instance, believed that a woman had every right over her unborn child, especially if her life was in danger. That woman had other responsibilities and was a lot more important to her family than a fetus. A fetus is not an integral part to the family unit. A mother is.
The Roe v. Wade case caused a lot of publicity, but I wouldn't say it's treated lightly. Hardly. The United States government interpreted their Constitution and ruled based on it. There has been nothing but intense bickering from both sides since.
There are 17 maternal deaths per 100,000 live births in the year 2000. That doesn't seem like a whole lot, but that's still enough to say that some women will find abortion necessary to save their lives.
And what about rape? Incest? Those women never did it for "pleasure".
Disclaimer: I'm not saying I am pro abortion or against it here.
The fact that people use the argument of the history of abortion techniques to justify abortion being "okay" today is absurd and should hardly be called an argument.
As time goes on society advances and so does the standards by which we must live. Just because history proves that slaves were the norm in Acient Egypt, China, Greece, Rome, and the Good old USA, this does not justify, or even begin to be an argument for the right to own slaves in today's modern society.
The fact that women and minorities were treated as lesser people in history does not mean that we can use that argument against them today to justify the lower average wages they earn compared to males.
It's like a "old" person whom lacks knowledge of new technolgy trying to justify the way they do things because "thats the way its been done for 100 years." Well, times changes and betters ways are created.
The fact that people use the argument of the history of abortion techniques to justify abortion being "okay" today is absurd and should hardly be called an argument.
As time goes on society advances and so does the standards by which we must live. Just because history proves that slaves were the norm in Acient Egypt, China, Greece, Rome, and the Good old USA, this does not justify, or even begin to be an argument for the right to own slaves in today's modern society.
The fact that women and minorities were treated as lesser people in history does not mean that we can use that argument against them today to justify the lower average wages they earn compared to males.
It's like a "old" person whom lacks knowledge of new technolgy trying to justify the way they do things because "thats the way its been done for 100 years." Well, times changes and betters ways are created.
That's a great statistic. But whose to say that any one of those women were contimplating abortion? You can't claim that those 17 women could have been spared had they went through with an abortion.
Here's a stat for you. There are 100,000 deaths per 100,000 abortions in the year XXXX. That does seem like a whole lot.
GuesSAngel
Well-Known Member
I would think that it would be easier for you to say that since you're a guy. If you were a woman and put in the wrong situation, I bet that you would change your mind. And you're probably going to say no to that answer, but then again you're a guy...so you really wouldn't know what women go through. Murder is such a strong word.
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