What is your attitude to gays and lesbians?

[The Man]

I'm asking you how you know they aren't (which you won't answer), I'm not arguing anything.

Good question...as there is no way to actually prove what one is thinking.
Jacking,using a vibrator or having sex with an animal..is merely the desire to get off...thus causes the action of the sexual activity.
Desire and attraction have two different meanings.
It is my opinion that people are not attracted to their hand the vibrator or an animal...but are fulfilling their desire to get off.
Much like the last woman to picked up at the bar....One is not attracted to her..but she will suffice for the need.

 

[The Man]

n

I think your problem is that you don't believe someone can be homosexual without committing a homosexual act... Am I right on that?
That you think that it's a choice because you have the ability of not engaging in a homosexual act.

If that's the case and that's what you believe, then you are just talking right past the rest of us on this topic.

You can be a homosexual without ever have acting on it. You do not need to perform a homosexual act to be a homosexual.
It all comes down to what you are attracted to.
As a guy, I am only attracted to females. Always have been and there is no question in my mind that I am straight. If I were to perform some sort of homosexual act some day, it would not make me a homosexual. I would just be a hetero sexual that engaged in a homosexual act at some point. It wouldn't magically change my preference from liking women to liking men and that's what makes you a homosexual... your preference, not your actions...

I think your problem is that you don't believe someone can be homosexual without committing a homosexual act.

Correct...Just like daydreaming about killing the guy across the street..you are not a killer as you havent committed the act.

That you think that it's a choice because you have the ability of not engaging in a homosexual act.

Correct...thus why I would exclude someone being tricked at a gay bar or similar....such as dude gets sucked the she pulls down her pants and turns out to be a he......One has to knowingly engage in the activity....I also dont include force

You can be a homosexual without ever have acting on it.

I disagree..just like one cant call his self a killer without killing.
One may think about becoming homosexual..that doesnt mean they are..they can toss the idea around in their head without committing.

It all comes down to what you are attracted to.

You dont have to be attracted to something to have sex with it.

If I were to perform some sort of homosexual act some day, it would not make me a homosexual.

Correct...it would make you bi-sexual as you engaged in sex with another man.

I would just be a hetero sexual that engaged in a homosexual act at some point

I disagree...the action defines the label..not the quantity of times it has occurred.

It wouldn't magically change my preference from liking women to liking men and that's what makes you a homosexual... your preference, not your actions.

That would label you as bi sexual as you prefer women but will also engage with a man.

 

[Panacea]

Good question...as there is no way to actually prove what one is thinking.
Jacking,using a vibrator or having sex with an animal..is merely the desire to get off...thus causes the action of the sexual activity.
Desire and attraction have two different meanings.
It is my opinion that people are not attracted to their hand the vibrator or an animal...but are fulfilling their desire to get off.
Much like the last woman to picked up at the bar....One is not attracted to her..but she will suffice for the need.

I can think of at least two cases of individuals forming emotional bonds with animals with which they have sex. Nothing is black and white.

 

[The Man]

I can think of at least two cases of individuals forming emotional bonds with animals with which they have sex. Nothing is black and white.

An emotional bond isnt exclusive to attraction

 

[Tim]

n


Correct...Just like daydreaming about killing the guy across the street..you are not a killer as you havent committed the act.


Correct...thus why I would exclude someone being tricked at a gay bar or similar....such as dude gets sucked the she pulls down her pants and turns out to be a he......One has to knowingly engage in the activity....I also dont include force

I disagree..just like one cant call his self a killer without killing.
One may think about becoming homosexual..that doesnt mean they are..they can toss the idea around in their head without committing.

You dont have to be attracted to something to have sex with it.

Correct...it would make you bi-sexual as you engaged in sex with another man.

I disagree...the action defines the label..not the quantity of times it has occurred.


That would label you as bi sexual as you prefer women but will also engage with a man.

This is the definition of sexuality...

Human sexuality can be described as the way someone is sexually attracted to another person of the opposite sexhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex (heterosexualityhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosexuality), to the same sex (homosexualityhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality), to both sexes (bisexualityhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bisexuality), or attracted to no sexes in a sexual way (asexualityhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asexuality).

It has nothing to do with your actions and everything to do with what you are attracted to. Didn't you ever here of a closet homosexual? That can mean someone who is attracted to the same sex but won't act on it.
A homosexual can pretend to be straight and marry because it's the right thing to do in the eyes of their family and never have a sexual relation with the same sex. They are just as gay as the guy who has a same sex marriage. It's all about who you are attracted to, not what you do in the bed...

 

[Panacea]

An emotional bond isnt exclusive to attraction

That doesn't negate my point.

 

[rback33]

I sincerely appreciate the attempts by some of you to educate the bigoted, but alas it is falling on ears that refuse to listen.

 

[The Man]

This is the definition of sexuality...

Human sexuality can be described as the way someone is sexually attracted to another person of the opposite sex (heterosexuality), to the same sex (homosexuality), to both sexes (bisexuality), or attracted to no sexes in a sexual way (asexuality).

It has nothing to do with your actions and everything to do with what you are attracted to. Didn't you ever here of a closet homosexual? That can mean someone who is attracted to the same sex but won't act on it.
A homosexual can pretend to be straight and marry because it's the right thing to do in the eyes of their family and never have a sexual relation with the same sex. They are just as gay as the guy who has a same sex marriage. It's all about who you are attracted to, not what you do in the bed...

You consider thought to be enough for label
I consider action to place the label.

One can crave cigarettes..doesnt make him a smoker
One can dream of killing doesnt make him a killer
One can dream about banging his sister...doesnt mean he has committed incest..but merely tossed the idea around in his head.
I could dream about fucking Miss America..doesnt make me star fucker....regardless of how attracted I am to her.

And last but not least one could have suicidal thoughts...doesnt mean he is dead...or he wouldnt be able to talk to that shrink.

 

[The Man]

That doesn't negate my point.

Sure it does,unless emotional bond is defined as attraction /which it isnt

 

[redliner]

Everyone has such good points in this thread. Heres my question. Who cares ? If a guy want to kiss a guy let them. It does not effect my life at all. If two girls want to hold hands and kiss WTF is wrong with that ? If there is two guys that want to get married let them. If they want to raise a family that is awsome. Good for it. Some people are retarded if this actually bothers them. It does not matter what color or sex you are. Love is love. Lust is lust. Attraction can't be helped. If my best friend told me he was gay that would be awsome that he could share that with me. Lifes to hard worring about other peoples lives.

 

[anathelia]

Everyone has such good points in this thread. Heres my question. Who cares ? If a guy want to kiss a guy let them. It does not effect my life at all. If two girls want to hold hands and kiss WTF is wrong with that ? If there is two guys that want to get married let them. If they want to raise a family that is awsome. Good for it. Some people are retarded if this actually bothers them. It does not matter what color or sex you are. Love is love. Lust is lust. Attraction can't be helped. If my best friend told me he was gay that would be awsome that he could share that with me. Lifes to hard worring about other peoples lives.

:homo:

I knew I liked you.

 

[The Doc]

You have a warped definition of "winning". Are you related to Charlie Sheen?

That being said, you haven't addressed the issues of that study being 35 years old, or its small sample size. People could have been gay without admitting it prior to serving time in prison... especialy in the 70s. Homsexuality has only started to gain mainstream acceptance in the last 10 years. Additionally, the fact that those men "became" homosexuals after spending time in prison could have come from the fact that they realized that they possibly enjoyed the homosexual encounters that they experienced while in prison, thus assuming that they're gay. There are any number of other factors that could be considered. Like I said, it's still a small sample size, and it doesn't nothing to "prove" that homosexuality is a learned behavior, which seems to be your assertion.

Now run along and let the grown ups talk.

Also: learn the fucking difference between your and you're; as well as there, their, and they're. Those aren't particularly difficult grammatical concepts, and yet they seem to escape you.

I'm sorry, but does that come in english?



Here is what you're missing. Prison has changed in the last 35 years, and our understanding of human psychology has also changed in that time period. You also haven't considered the possibility that due to the prevailing view of homosexuality 35 years ago, they could very well have been using prison as an excuse for their now open homosexuality. That is obviously all conjecture, but life isn't nearly as black and white as you seem to view it.



The numbers are going to be skewed in a "study" like that. Here's what you haven't considered --- the percentage of male to female sex offenders against minors. Studies have shown that the percentage of molesters that are women ranges anywhere between 4-43%, with the estimated number of incarcerated offenders amounting to 0.04% female and 99.6% male in 1993. In cases of people involved with education, the number is 69% male and 31% female. Then you also have to consider the age ranges of those molested. But, going back to the percentages; you are obviously going to end up with a larger proportion of males that end up being homosexual that were abused by men than by women. If homosexuality were a learned behavior due to abuse, then wouldn't girls become homosexuals after being abused? Or is it only same-sex abuse that "causes" homosexuality? Do you see the slippery slope that your "logic", or lack thereof, uses?

Additionally, the page that you found is flawed at its core. Why? Because of statements like these:

[/B][/COLOR]

Do you see what I'm getting at? Probably not, so let me break it down for you. Your link is coming at the subject from an obviously biased point of view, and cherry picking statistics in order to fit with it's predefined opinions. Their view is that homosexuality is a sexually deviant and learned behavior, that should be "treated" because it isn't natural in their opinion. So all you've really done is link to a page with an obvious bias and attempted to pass it off as scientific fact. Sorry, but it doesn't work that way. Try again with some non-biased sources. Kids these days, I swear.

Oh, and here are the sources for the statistics that I made reference to.

http://www2.ed.gov/rschstat/research/pubs/misconductreview/report.pdf
http://www.springerlink.com/content/m2tn305232r312g3/
http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/gi_0199-3286320/The-myth-of-innocence-sexual.html

Your right i didnt consider the possibilitythey could very well have been using prison as an excuse for their now open homosexuality. There are endless posibilities and what if statements. Theres a possibility the reasearcher paid the subjects, theres a possibility I have hidden superpowers from the radiation i was exposed to in an X-ray last week. Theres a possibility Osama Bin Ladens still alive, theres a possibility that aliens built the pyramids. Theres pretty much a 'possibility' for anything.

So one statement you listed says "Most if not all homosexuals were born heterosexual" You cant prove gay people are born 'gay' with some homo gene. They tried, and it came out inconclusive. But since your in the realm of 'possibilities' im completely sure theres a 'possibility' they might have been born gay, just as there is a 'possibility' they learned it when their little league couach molested them.

I also dont see why you highlighted the statement of providing therapy to homosexuals to cope with their problems. I agree with that. If you dont remember im arguing its an environmental/learned behavior which can be undone.

There are some 'possibilities' for you little fella

 

[Tim]

So one statement you listed says "Most if not all homosexuals were born heterosexual" You cant prove gay people are born 'gay' with some homo gene. They tried, and it came out inconclusive. But since your in the realm of 'possibilities' im completely sure theres a 'possibility' they might have been born gay, just as there is a 'possibility' they learned it when their little league couach molested them.

Here is my problem with all of your arguments...

You believe you are NOT gay unless you perform a gay act.
That means you are NOT straight until you have straight sex.

So that means you cannot be born straight or gay in your view. You are born asexual until you screw a man or a woman and then you are considered straight or gay.

You cannot have it both ways.

And sure as hell cannot argue for or against a gay gene since you cannot be born gay or straight according to you.

 

[retro]

Here is my problem with all of your arguments...

You believe you are NOT gay unless you perform a gay act.
That means you are NOT straight until you have straight sex.

So that means you cannot be born straight or gay in your view. You are born asexual until you screw a man or a woman and then you are considered straight or gay.

You cannot have it both ways.

And sure as hell cannot argue for or against a gay gene since you cannot be born gay or straight according to you.

I think you're confusing the two, "The X" people in this thread. The Man is arguing that you're not gay or straight unless you have sex with someone, while The Doc is arguing well... he's arguing in favor of bigotry and that being gay is a deviant behavior that can be "fixed".

While The Man's arguments are somewhat confusing and don't really make a lot of sense. The Doc is simply spreading his prejudice against homosexuality around and trying to ass it off and something that's socially acceptable. He hates homosexuals (he's probably afraid that he'll catch "the gay" from them), and has showed his age and immaturity in every aspect of this discussion.

 

[Tim]

I think you're confusing the two, "The X" people in this thread. The Man is arguing that you're not gay or straight unless you have sex with someone, while The Doc is arguing well... he's arguing in favor of bigotry and that being gay is a deviant behavior that can be "fixed".

lol, you're right... I guess they all look alike to me

 

[Natasha]

I sincerely appreciate the attempts by some of you to educate the bigoted, but alas it is falling on ears that refuse to listen.

Good point. Exactly why I only venture into this area by accident. Time to unsubscribe, LOL

 

[Tim]

Good point. Exactly why I only venture into this area by accident. Time to unsubscribe, LOL

Quitter...


:24:

 

[Natasha]

Quitter...


:24:

Absolutely!!! And dammit, I forgot to click the "unsubscribe" button when this thread popped up again. Damn you, Tim!!!

 

[darkcgi]

I love when people try to put a simple lable on something that is very complex and they don't know enough or are just a brick and cannot label properly but are content that their labeling is the best and no one elses labeling is better
I know my grammar sucks... my excuse I'm bipolar and some times I just don't give a flying flukie!

 

[retro]

I love when people try to put a simple lable on something that is very complex and they don't know enough or are just a brick and cannot label properly but are content that their labeling is the best and no one elses labeling is better
I know my grammar sucks... my excuse I'm bipolar and some times I just don't give a flying flukie!

Please don't use being bipolar as an excuse for atrocious grammar and/or posting shit that doesn't make any sense. It's an insult to those of us that suffer from the mental disorder.