socialists movment woot woot!!!!

[Obdurate]

State Socialism is lame.

 

[Strauss]

Wrong, the Bush Administration wanted the Act made permanent with no changes.

Congressional Democrats and even many Republicans worked for the changes.

Wrong again, the Bush Administration suggested the changes with Congressional backing. If it hadn't occurred it would have been a showdown which neither side would have a won, the essence of compromise.

Two of the more controversial provisions, sections 206 and 215 are up for reauthorization in Dec 2009. Hardly a dead issue.

Again, why are the Democrats waiting. This abortion of an Act is such a threat to you, your family, your American way of life how is it they have allowed it to remain for these last two years? You protested, written about and moaned this Act for years yet it gets renewed with minor changes and even then your liberal buddies, including Obama. vote to continue the Act. A cynical man might suggest that you like getting lied to and fucked at the same time. :24:

 

[Destroyer Dave]

So what you are saying is that the declaration as being unconstitutional was never challenged at the appellate level. Big frig deal. Until the Supreme Court says its unconstitutional or refuses to review an Appeal's Court decision declaring a statute unconstitutional you got nothing. I'd explain why just having a declaration by a District Court means nothing but you don't want the truth, you just want to keep on spouting the talking points.

My we have such a soft constitution, are you a man or a mouse? Face it you can't defend your position without crying wolf...."you're picking on me boo hoo boo hoo". Grow some balls.

And as Alien Allen has so righteously pointed out you still haven't explained why if the Patriot Act is such an infringement on your personal liberties why it hasn't been repealed by this Democrat Congress. Address this point if you can. BTW, your prior lame attempt that they are busy with other matters doesn't hold water, they've had two years prior to the current mess to address the issue of the Patriot Act and didn't other than to vote to extended it or was that to make it permanent?

BTW genius, its the weekend and I don't post much during the work week.

well its simple relly, dems and reps are all in the same pockets, there is no such thing as freedom or at least not like we were told in school. From the day you are born no matter were in the world you will always be a slave to some bull shit controll system, ex; god, show me god and I will give you my faith, govt, and any government for that matter, for the people by the people is a fars, our founding fathers were smart men and ther for knew how to manipulat the uneducated masses of an angry and distant english colony. and this is basicaly how,

"for the people by the people (some big word that they dont realy understand)(yet another fairly confusing phrais that sound pretty good)(should I have a lawyer to help me read this? oh look the bill of rights....lets just skip to that eh), and so on.

now I'm not saying that our govt system is all that bad cuz its not, but its not that hard to control the masses with a well wrighten pile of mass confusion! What the real problem with specificalty modern society is the monitary system in general. Go google "Fractional reserve banking" and tell me what you come up with! I think you will be a little angry,

I need to go find a link to a 2 hr documentary and I think you guys should watch it!:horse:kneelsuckers::horse

 

[Strauss]

The post now are starting to get redundant. Time to move on to a new subject.

 

[Destroyer Dave]

ok one more thing, just shut up!!! and take a look, I think most of us can respect this
YouTube - Ani DiFranco at the 92nd Street Y

 

[Fox Mulder]

What?! If there was nothing wrong, why would there need to be changes? You're getting sloppy now

Because EVERY LAW OF ANY SIGNIFICANCE IN HISTORY REQUIRES(D) CHANGES--EVERY SINGLE ONE. The Patriot Act is no different. It is one of the most important if not the most important Act in history. The reality is you liberals will stop sqauking about it after Obama takes office because the reality is the only reason anything was ever said in the first place was simply to attack Bush.

Gbrumb and me have explained this a 1000 times--that the act did nothing new--simply codified what was already the law and in some cases what was in conflict among Districts. Liberals were asked countless times to point out what was unconstitutional in the act and no one ever could.

 

[Fox Mulder]

I said the Patriot Act infringes on personal liberties... which it does

Which personal liberties does it "infringe" and how? And where how did you decide it does? Is this a court that said that? If so, why is the Patriot Act still law?

Also what do you mean by "infringe on personal liberties?" The government infringes on your personal liberties every day of your life. Are you saying that it is unconstitutional to infringe on personal liberties? If so, how?

 

[Strauss]

Because EVERY LAW OF ANY SIGNIFICANCE IN HISTORY REQUIRES(D) CHANGES--EVERY SINGLE ONE. The Patriot Act is no different. It is one of the most important if not the most important Act in history. The reality is you liberals will stop sqauking about it after Obama takes office because the reality is the only reason anything was ever said in the first place was simply to attack Bush.

Gbrumb and me have explained this a 1000 times--that the act did nothing new--simply codified what was already the law and in some cases what was in conflict among Districts. Liberals were asked countless times to point out what was unconstitutional in the act and no one ever could.

You enjoyed Thanksgiving up on Bear Mountain (or what the hell its called) didn't you? I've been dealing with an obstinate liberal that when asked a straight forward question accuses me of name calling and being a bully. In other words, typical liberal behavior. You missed the fun but I'm sure something of equal intelligence will get posted; I'll let you deal with it this time.

 

[Strauss]

Which personal liberties does it "infringe" and how? And where how did you decide it does? Is this a court that said that? If so, why is the Patriot Act still law?

Also what do you mean by "infringe on personal liberties?" The government infringes on your personal liberties every day of your life. Are you saying that it is unconstitutional to infringe on personal liberties? If so, how?

Ah, we been through this. You won't get an answer just obfuscation. It's Bush's fault.

 

[All Else Failed]

Which personal liberties does it "infringe" and how? And where how did you decide it does? Is this a court that said that? If so, why is the Patriot Act still law?

Also what do you mean by "infringe on personal liberties?" The government infringes on your personal liberties every day of your life. Are you saying that it is unconstitutional to infringe on personal liberties? If so, how?

well, I sort of like not being kidnapped and held indefinitely without a trial.

 

[Strauss]

well, I sort of like not being kidnapped and held indefinitely without a trial.

Really, when did that happen to you? When did you get out, how'd the trial go?

 

[Alien Allen]

Really, when did that happen to you? When did you get out, how'd the trial go?

he was part of a large group of liberals that Bush swept up and shipped off to GTMO

 

[Fox Mulder]

well, I sort of like not being kidnapped and held indefinitely without a trial.

Uhhhh--I think you are confusing factually devoid Liberal Bush Bashing theories. The one you are proposing is another interesting bit of propoganda. What I find so funny is that you liberals are big on not having the government push propoganda yet you buy virtually everything the media feeds you without EVER actually making an intelligent and informed analysis of it.

You are probably referring to Guantanamo Bay. I will clue you in on something. No one has been held there by the US indefinitely without a trial EXCEPT prisoners who are being held for their own benefit:

BBC NEWS | Americas | Why US is 'stuck' with Guantanamo Bay

Gates is admitting they have a problem we all knew about," said Andy Worthington of the British group Reprieve, which monitors and offers legal advice to Guantanamo Bay prisoners.

"These are the 50-70 who have been cleared for release but who cannot be returned. They come from China, Uzbekistan, Tunisia, Libya and Algeria mainly. "The US tried last year to agree memoranda of understanding with some countries, including Tunisia and two prisoners were sent back there. They have been jailed for three and seven years after an unsatisfactory trial. A US court has blocked a third return.

What you liberals hear from the media is that there are prisoners being held with no charges brought against them, which is true, but what you don't fucking hear is that it is for their own protection they are being held. In some cases, those with lawyers, their fucking lawyers have blocked their release because they know if they are sent back to their own countries, they will be executed or treated inhumanely. This is what is so fucking amazing about these ludicrous cries from liberals about these poor prisoners held without being charged. These same liberals would be screaming bloody murder if the US simply sent the prisoners back to their own countries--claiming violation of human rights (you can't simply release them outside the doors of the prison! ). Honestly, its a fucking joke how much misinformation is out there and how much people are willing to just believe whatever stupid "attention grabbing" headline they read. You know why these headlines are written this way? Because no would care if they simply printed the truth! :rolleyes

How does it feel to be duped by propoganda???

 

[Fox Mulder]

well, I sort of like not being kidnapped and held indefinitely without a trial.

Another point--I assume you know the manner in the Nazis fooled the German people? They took over the press and controlled what people heard and read. That's what's happening to you except you are too naive to realize it. You are spoon fed what the media wants you to know--this should bother you even if you agree with the propoganda.

 

[All Else Failed]

No see they can actually do what I said. They can arrest anyone, at anytime. You should be very worried that the executive branch of OUR country has expanded to such great lengths. The executive should have no such power. This isn't Bush bashing, this is just common sense that one branch shouldn't have such powers.

Plus I do not consider myself "liberal" anymore. I've cut off all identity with either party. They're both jokes and one side of the same coin.


Plus I think its rather funny that you think I buy into propaganda when you literally sound like a FOX news buzz word factory.

 

[Alien Allen]

No see they can actually do what I said. They can arrest anyone, at anytime. You should be very worried that the executive branch of OUR country has expanded to such great lengths. The executive should have no such power. This isn't Bush bashing, this is just common sense that one branch shouldn't have such powers.

Plus I do not consider myself "liberal" anymore. I've cut off all identity with either party. They're both jokes and one side of the same coin.


Plus I think its rather funny that you think I buy into propaganda when you literally sound like a FOX news buzz word factory.

got some examples??

 

[Destroyer Dave]

yeah...liberls are terorrists

 

[Fox Mulder]

No see they can actually do what I said. They can arrest anyone, at anytime. You should be very worried that the executive branch of OUR country has expanded to such great lengths. The executive should have no such power. This isn't Bush bashing, this is just common sense that one branch shouldn't have such powers.

No its not common sense its utter bullshit. Of course the police can arrest anyone at anytime--they ALWAYS HAVE BEEN ABLE TO DO SO. However, in order to legally do so they need to do within the parameters of the Constitution--they needed that before the Bush Administration and they still need it. I have no idea where you get the idea that somehow that has changed. Seriously---do you wear a tinfoil hat so the government cannot control your mind?

Plus I do not consider myself "liberal" anymore. I've cut off all identity with either party. They're both jokes and one side of the same coin.

You are either a liberal or mentally or emotionally disturbed because those are the only conditions of which I am aware that causes people to become irrationally paranoid.

Plus I think its rather funny that you think I buy into propaganda when you literally sound like a FOX news buzz word factory.

Funny--the link I provided you was the BBC, not FOX. But I'm not surprised you made that comment because that's what people do when they have nothing to support their opinion--claim the opposing opinion is Fox news. I can support what I say by evidence--you can't--you simply spout what you hear--repeat the same lies, mistruths, and half-truths until the point where it becomes the truth as far as you are concerned. I would bet my house you've never once attempted to research to determine whether what you are saying has any degree of truth or credibility to it.

 

[Strauss]

I would bet my house you've never once attempted to research to determine whether what you are saying has any degree of truth or credibility to it.

There are several who have posted here to whom this would apply.

I'm more tempted to ask them what the flavor of the koolaid is because, obviously, they have been chugging it by the gallons.

 

[All Else Failed]

No its not common sense its utter bullshit. Of course the police can arrest anyone at anytime--they ALWAYS HAVE BEEN ABLE TO DO SO. However, in order to legally do so they need to do within the parameters of the Constitution--they needed that before the Bush Administration and they still need it. I have no idea where you get the idea that somehow that has changed. Seriously---do you wear a tinfoil hat so the government cannot control your mind?



You are either a liberal or mentally or emotionally disturbed because those are the only conditions of which I am aware that causes people to become irrationally paranoid.



Funny--the link I provided you was the BBC, not FOX. But I'm not surprised you made that comment because that's what people do when they have nothing to support their opinion--claim the opposing opinion is Fox news. I can support what I say by evidence--you can't--you simply spout what you hear--repeat the same lies, mistruths, and half-truths until the point where it becomes the truth as far as you are concerned. I would bet my house you've never once attempted to research to determine whether what you are saying has any degree of truth or credibility to it.

this is where we stop talking. once you insult my well being theres nothing more to be said. Have a nice night.