McCain and Palin for President!

[BadBoy@TheWheel]

Ya know, that's the dumbest defense I keep hearing put out by the media. Who gives a damn how old he was? I wasn't born when Hitler was "getting into trouble", but I certainly wouldn't want any association with him. Let me guess, Hitler isn't a fair comparison to what Bill Ayers did? Ok, how about this: I was 8 when Ramzi Yousef bombed the WTC in 1993. I wouldn't accept an invitation to his house under any circumstances.

Well stated:clap

 

[Alien Allen]

Ya know, that's the dumbest defense I keep hearing put out by the media. Who gives a damn how old he was? I wasn't born when Hitler was "getting into trouble", but I certainly wouldn't want any association with him. Let me guess, Hitler isn't a fair comparison to what Bill Ayers did? Ok, how about this: I was 8 when Ramzi Yousef bombed the WTC in 1993. I wouldn't accept an invitation to his house under any circumstances.

has Obama ever come out and said he made a mistake for ever having any involvement with the guy?

looks like he kind of forgot he kicked off his political career in the guys living room also.

who we associate with does mean something. unless of course one has blinders on.

Frankly if it was an isolated instance I could dismiss it but lets face it Obama also sat in a racist church for 20 years and found nothing troubling being said there.

 

[Minor Axis]

Ya know, that's the dumbest defense I keep hearing put out by the media. Who gives a damn how old he was? I wasn't born when Hitler was "getting into trouble", but I certainly wouldn't want any association with him. Let me guess, Hitler isn't a fair comparison to what Bill Ayers did? Ok, how about this: I was 8 when Ramzi Yousef bombed the WTC in 1993. I wouldn't accept an invitation to his house under any circumstances.

All that defense does is add some perspective. They, the Republican Party are trying to desperately connect Obama to Ayers like they are close buds and close philosophical soul mates. It's just another attempt at character assassination right out of the Republican play book. See the link if your interested.

No comment on McCain's honor?

And stopping the mudslinging would be nice too. I want to hear about issues.

Maybe tonight?

 

[Tim]

I just don't see what the big issue is with Bill Ayers... Yeah he was a convicted "terrorist" in the 60's that only succeeded in blowing up their own members. Not someone you want to pal around.

Obama served on Woods Fund Board that Ayers was on, so what. He was friendly towards him, so what. So there was contact between the two, so what. It's not like he was going to radical underground meetings with him to figure out how to overthrow the government. Now that would be a deal breaker for me. But guilt by association? Might as well get rid of them all.
How about McCain and Gordon Liddy?
Palin's husband wanting to succeed from the US?
Anyone associated with Oliver North?
Palin being exorcised of witches???

I'm sure the list could be long and pointless for both sides.
Sean Hannity has been chomping at this bit for over 2 years and he has yet to come up with anything of substance. It's nothing but more fear mongering.

 

[Tim]

Connection to Barack Obama

Main article: Obama–Ayers controversy
Bill Ayers and Barack Obama were loosely linked during their time in the city of Chicago, where they lived three blocks apart and led charges for education reform in the state of Illinois. The two met "at a luncheon meeting about school reform in a Chicago skyscraper."[40] Obama was then named to the Chicago Annenberg Project board to oversee the distribution of grants in Chicago. Later in 1995, Ayers hosted "a coffee" for "Mr. Obama's first run for office."[41] The two served together on a community anti-poverty group, the Woods Fund of Chicago, between 2000 and 2002, during which time the board met twelve times.[41] Ayers also contributed $200 to Obama's re-election fund to the Illinois State Senate in April 2001."[40] Since 2002, there has been little linking Obama and Ayers.[41] Obama says he has not visited Ayers during the presidential campaign. The senator said in September 2008 that he hadn't "seen him in a year-and-a-half."[42] In February 2008, Obama spokesman Bill Burton released a statement from the senator about the relationship between the two: "Senator Obama strongly condemns the violent actions of the Weathermen group, as he does all acts of violence. But he was an eight-year-old child when Ayers and the Weathermen were active, and any attempt to connect Obama with events of almost forty years ago is ridiculous."[40] CNN's review of project records found nothing to suggest anything inappropriate in the volunteer projects in which the two men were involved.[43] Internal reviews by The New York Times, The Washington Post, Time magazine, The Chicago Sun-Times, The New Yorker and The New Republic "have said that their reporting doesn't support the idea that Obama and Ayers had a close relationship."[44]

 

[BadBoy@TheWheel]

Connection to Barack Obama

Main article: Obama–Ayers controversy
Bill Ayers and Barack Obama were loosely linked during their time in the city of Chicago, where they lived three blocks apart and led charges for education reform in the state of Illinois. The two met "at a luncheon meeting about school reform in a Chicago skyscraper."[40] Obama was then named to the Chicago Annenberg Project board to oversee the distribution of grants in Chicago. Later in 1995, Ayers hosted "a coffee" for "Mr. Obama's first run for office."[41] The two served together on a community anti-poverty group, the Woods Fund of Chicago, between 2000 and 2002, during which time the board met twelve times.[41] Ayers also contributed $200 to Obama's re-election fund to the Illinois State Senate in April 2001."[40] Since 2002, there has been little linking Obama and Ayers.[41] Obama says he has not visited Ayers during the presidential campaign. The senator said in September 2008 that he hadn't "seen him in a year-and-a-half."[42] In February 2008, Obama spokesman Bill Burton released a statement from the senator about the relationship between the two: "Senator Obama strongly condemns the violent actions of the Weathermen group, as he does all acts of violence. But he was an eight-year-old child when Ayers and the Weathermen were active, and any attempt to connect Obama with events of almost forty years ago is ridiculous."[40] CNN's review of project records found nothing to suggest anything inappropriate in the volunteer projects in which the two men were involved.[43] Internal reviews by The New York Times, The Washington Post, Time magazine, The Chicago Sun-Times, The New Yorker and The New Republic "have said that their reporting doesn't support the idea that Obama and Ayers had a close relationship."[44]

I agree that affiliation and relationship are two very different things.

Still, the media has determined who they like, in fact they have what I consider such a dangerous passion for Obama, that is clouds the issues. Let's face it, they have already decided who they think we should vote for.

The mass media so far as I'm concerned is finished.:thumbdown

 

[Tim]

I agree that affiliation and relationship are two very different things.

Still, the media has determined who they like, in fact they have what I consider such a dangerous passion for Obama, that is clouds the issues. Let's face it, they have already decided who they think we should vote for.

The mass media so far as I'm concerned is finished.:thumbdown

It's funny that media would be for Obama when under his plan they will be paying millions more in taxes... :smiley24:

 

[BadBoy@TheWheel]

It's funny that media would be for Obama when under his plan they will be paying millions more in taxes... :smiley24:

You don't see the extreme media bias? The only network NOT kissing his ass is Fox

 

[Wookiegirl]

how about Mrs. Palin's association with joe volger?
golly gee guys

 

[Minor Axis]

You don't see the extreme media bias? The only network NOT kissing his ass is Fox

Fox is an extreme right wing psycho network.

I was listening to Palin today on a stump speech in a white dress and the crap that she spews is downright scary. They will say anything to reach their goal.

 

[Tim]

You don't see the extreme media bias? The only network NOT kissing his ass is Fox

No I don't see it... then again I don't watch the news for any credible information.

Don't you understand the news has been canceled long ago. You cannot get unbiased news on the TV anymore. It's nothing but commentary and punditry. So I wouldn't know if they are being biased. My TV only gets the Discovery channel

 

[dt3]

All that defense does is add some perspective. They, the Republican Party are trying to desperately connect Obama to Ayers like they are close buds and close philosophical soul mates. It's just another attempt at character assassination right out of the Republican play book. See the link if your interested.

No comment on McCain's honor?

That link does nothing for me. Sure, it shows they weren't best friends. But my point still stands. A man of principle, in my opinion, should have never even had a passing association with a person such as Ayers. Plain and simple. Obama, if he truly believes Ayers acts were "detestable" as he has said should have refused to have any dealings with him! If I find somebody detestable, I avoid any association with them. How can you seriously have a working relationship with somebody if they bombed the Pentagon and the Capitol? What would somebody have to do for Obama to say "I'm not going to associate with him!"???

As far as McCain's honor, if you're willing to give Obama a pass for his associations, why doesn't McCain get that same benefit of the doubt?

 

[Tim]

That link does nothing for me. Sure, it shows they weren't best friends. But my point still stands. A man of principle, in my opinion, should have never even had a passing association with a person such as Ayers. Plain and simple. Obama, if he truly believes Ayers acts were "detestable" as he has said should have refused to have any dealings with him! If I find somebody detestable, I avoid any association with them. How can you seriously have a working relationship with somebody if they bombed the Pentagon and the Capitol? What would somebody have to do for Obama to say "I'm not going to associate with him!"???

As far as McCain's honor, if you're willing to give Obama a pass for his associations, why doesn't McCain get that same benefit of the doubt?

First, he was responsible for bombing a statue, twice. He was not part of the pentagon and capital bombings.
Second, he was on the run for 10 years then when he turned himself in he was never convicted of anything.
Third, he was forgotten about and made himself a home in academic circles. People who knew him through associations and friends may not have even known about his past. I'm sure his friends and close associates knew, but people who served with him on boards?
The whole argument of guilt through association doesn't pass the smell test.

NEXT

 

[dt3]

First, he was responsible for bombing a statue, twice. He was not part of the pentagon and capital bombings.
Second, he was on the run for 10 years then when he turned himself in he was never convicted of anything.
Third, he was forgotten about and made himself a home in academic circles. People who knew him through associations and friends may not have even known about his past. I'm sure his friends and close associates knew, but people who served with him on boards?
The whole argument of guilt through association doesn't pass the smell test.

NEXT

Okay, let's say all he bombed was a statue. He still co-founded and led the group that carried out the other attacks. To absolve him of the groups actions is asinine. Bin Laden didn't personally execute 9/11, but I doubt you'd grant him a pardon.

And, according to Wikipedia (which you cited earlier also) he was involved with both the Capitol and the Pentagon bombings: "Ayers participated in the bombings of New York City Police Headquarters in 1970, the United States Capitol building in 1971, and The Pentagon in 1972, as he noted in his 2001 book, Fugitive Days." Bill Ayers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Now, I don't have a copy of his book with me to verify it, but I'll believe it until proven otherwise.

You're right, he was never convicted due to gross "prosecutorial misconduct". But that sure as hell doesn't mean he's innocent, especially when he confesses to it and wishes he had done more!

And saying Barack Obama didn't know who he was is about as likely as him not hearing a racist sermon from Jeremiah Wright. Sure, it's possible. But I doubt it.

 

[Tim]

And again I will say... the connections are tenuous at best. Guilt by association will remove all the candidates from play, not just Obama.

The worst that can be said is that he should have had better judgment in who he could be associated with. Yet the right makes it seem as though he is a radical and the far right as though he were a terrorists. And if you truly believe this, then you are being dishonest with yourself since there is nothing showing he is.

This argument is nothing more than a distraction. There is nothing to it and they know it.

 

[dt3]

And again I will say... the connections are tenuous at best. Guilt by association will remove all the candidates from play, not just Obama.

The worst that can be said is that he should have had better judgment in who he could be associated with. Yet the right makes it seem as though he is a radical and the far right as though he were a terrorists. And if you truly believe this, then you are being dishonest with yourself since there is nothing showing he is.

This argument is nothing more than a distraction. There is nothing to it and they know it.

Tim, I take great consolation in the fact that at least my vote will cancel out yours

 

[BadBoy@TheWheel]

Tim, I take great consolation in the fact that at least my vote will cancel out yours

:24::24::24:


Debate/closed

 

[Minor Axis]

As far as McCain's honor, if you're willing to give Obama a pass for his associations, why doesn't McCain get that same benefit of the doubt?

Ok, so Obama has been painted by the Republican machine as the friend of terrorists and you've bought into it. Not much I can say to change your mind. :smiley24:

McCain's lack of honor has to do with his vow to run a clean campaign which has all turned to shit, his campaign that is.

 

[valley]

well I am voting for McCain/Palin. This country needs reform and McCain will do what is necessary to put America back on the right track. I think Sarah Palin is totally awesome.

 

[valley]

McCain's lack of honor....

Lack of honor? You've got to be kidding me. Have you forgotten that this man was a POW and that he had the chance to go home and refused, citing the military code requiring prisoners to be released in order of how they were captured? He could have left a POW camp and didnt, giving someone else the chance to leave instead. It takes a deep-seated sense of honor and integrity for any person to do something like that. He has a record of going up against his own party when his conscience does not agree with what they are doing. We need more people in office with a strong sense of wrong and right. I believe McCain/Palin are going to make this country better if they are elected.

If Obama wins...well, I will be praying for him to do the best job that he caqn do for the good of the country as well. I've got nothing against him..I just feel like he is trying to win the election by trying to buy off Americans with promises of money. We dont need to have money thrown at us so we can run out and buy more, more, more. We need REAL changes over time that will actually make a difference in the overall economy.