Islam-Aren't there some verses of the Qur'an that condone "killing the infidel"?

[gLing]

Also it doesn't really matter what verses say in any religion. People will twist them and use them as rallying cry to do great harm. Christians on a wide scale did that before and now you have entire islamic theocratic nations that do it now.

It could say plain as day be nice to everybody but it will be spin doctored to mean only be nice to those who believe exactly as you do.

 

[groundpounder]

I thought the crusades were about taking back land the muslims took.

sort of....

 

[valley]

[FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif]There are some specific verses that are very often "snipped" out of context, either by those trying to malign the faith, or by misguided Muslims (terrorists) themselves who wish to justify their aggressive tactics.[/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif]

I have a question. Does the word "misguided" here imply that terrorists are true Muslims or not? [/FONT]
[FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif]
[/FONT]


[FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif]
[/FONT]

 

[Zorak]

sort of....

Yeah, originally the Crusades were given this mission.

But there's no doubt that organisations like the Knights Templar had a large say on the actions of the Crusades, and as such their wars extended far beyond the Holy Land and against Islam

 

[valley]

Question: Aren't there some verses of the Qur'an that condone "killing the infidel"?

Answer: [FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif]The Qur'an commands Muslims to stick up for themselves in a defensive battle -- i.e. if an enemy army attacks, then Muslims are to fight against that army until they stop their aggression. All of the verses that speak about fighting/war in the Qur'an are in this context.[/FONT][FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif][/FONT]

[FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif] It is clear from the context that these verses are discussing a defensive war, when a Muslim community is attacked without reason, oppressed and prevented from practicing their faith. In these circumstances, permission is given to fight back -- but even then Muslims are instructed not to transgress limits, and to cease fighting as soon as the attacker gives up. Even in these circumstances, Muslim are only to fight directly against those who are attacking them, not innocent bystanders or non-combatants.[/FONT]

One more question....can you tell me how the Battle of Badr fits in with this teaching? Wasnt it Muhammad who planned and ordered the attack on his enemies? If what you say is true...that Muslims cant fight unless they are attacked first...then how do you explain Muhammad telling his army to go and make war like that?

 

[Dana]

Also it doesn't really matter what verses say in any religion. People will twist them and use them as rallying cry to do great harm. Christians on a wide scale did that before and now you have entire islamic theocratic nations that do it now.

It could say plain as day be nice to everybody but it will be spin doctored to mean only be nice to those who believe exactly as you do.

:homo:

 

[Minor Axis]

Why do most Muslim countries oppress others that are in their same culture? (the oppression of women is one example) Yet they claim to fight oppression?

Suppression of women could be a cultural issue, you know the cave men in charge?

 

[valley]

Suppression of women could be a cultural issue, you know the cave men in charge?

The extent of the suppression is unique to Islam.

 

[Godsloveapples]

It is clear from the context that these verses are discussing a defensive war, when a Muslim community is attacked without reason, oppressed and prevented from practicing their faith. In these circumstances, permission is given to fight back -- but even then Muslims are instructed not to transgress limits, and to cease fighting as soon as the attacker gives up. Even in these circumstances, Muslim are only to fight directly against those who are attacking them, not innocent bystanders or non-combatants.

Very good ...can you explain to me this passage?..."muslim are only to fight directly against those who are attacking them, not innocent bystanders or non combatants?

Im a lil confused...you see, i could produce a list of deaths caused by muslims, and they where all innocent bystanders...many children?

Maybe im wrong? *coughs*

Those are Muslim terrorists who misinterpret the Quran.I think this will explain it further: (link) Islam Denounces Terrorism

 

[Godsloveapples]

One more question....can you tell me how the Battle of Badr fits in with this teaching? Wasnt it Muhammad who planned and ordered the attack on his enemies? If what you say is true...that Muslims cant fight unless they are attacked first...then how do you explain Muhammad telling his army to go and make war like that?

It was a defensive battle. This explains it all:
The Battle of Badr - a battle between Truth and falsehood

 

[Godsloveapples]

[FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif]

I have a question. Does the word "misguided" here imply that terrorists are true Muslims or not? [/FONT]
[FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif]
[/FONT]


[FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif]
[/FONT]

No, they are not true Muslims. A true Muslim would follow the Qurans teachings.

 

[Sylviane88]

One more question....can you tell me how the Battle of Badr fits in with this teaching? Wasnt it Muhammad who planned and ordered the attack on his enemies? If what you say is true...that Muslims cant fight unless they are attacked first...then how do you explain Muhammad telling his army to go and make war like that?

Hi valley, here you again call misleading propaganda about Islam !!!

The Battle of Badr was not ordered by Muhammad. He (and muslims) just decided to recover their money taken (stolen) by the infidels of Qureish. by objecting the route of a commercial convoy of these infidels (Qureish) ... Qureish infidels decided to prevent Muhammad from doing so by sending their "army" ... But the convoy had changed its way ... and Muhammad (and muslims) decided to retreat ...However, the army of infidels wanted to attack Muslims in their city "Medina" ... therefore, Muslims decided to defend themselves ... the Battle happened in "Badr" and the muslims won (with less than 300 man ! ... against more than 1000 man from the infidels of Qureish)

Valley ! from your posts, I saw that you hate Islam for nothing!!! Try to save yourself from the brain-washing operations before it will be too late !!

I have a question. Does the word "misguided" here imply that terrorists are true Muslims or not?

Valley;
some of these terrorists are not muslims (althought they say they are muslims) ... most of them are zionists (for example Al-Quaida) ... The purpose of these Zionists is to make Islam seems to be a religion of terrorism only !!! Why bin laden was not caught till today ?!!! (however Seddam was caught in less than one year !!) ... The whole matter is an evil conspiracy against Islam.
sooner or later I will prove that the 9/11 events were made by Zionists (jews). I have all the proofs but when I'll have enough time I'll show you the full investigation about this conspiracy.

People are the problem I would say

100/100 true ...
-------
Temperamental, Thank you for this useful topic

Cordially - Sylviane

 

[GraceAbounds]

Why do most Muslim countries oppress others that are in their same culture? (the oppression of women is one example) Yet they claim to fight oppression?

*bump*

 

[valley]

Valley ! from your posts, I saw that you hate Islam for nothing!!!

I do not hate Muslims. I simply question the morality of your prophet Muhammad and I believe that Muslims have been deceived by his teachings. There is no hatred involved in that...just a ton of unanswered questions, is all.

 

[Sylviane88]

I believe that Muslims have been deceived by his teachings.

What teachnigs do you mean ?!!!

here are Muhammad's teachings:

The Religion of Islam - Category: Systems in Islam

The Religion of Islam - Category: Pearls from His Sayings

I've already said: save yourself from the brain-washing operations

 

[valley]

What teachnigs do you mean ?!!!

here are Muhammad's teachings:

The Religion of Islam - Category: Systems in Islam

The Religion of Islam - Category: Pearls from His Sayings

I've already said: save yourself from the brain-washing operations

Here are some other of Muhammad's teachings:

Satan farts
Satan pees in people's ears
Yawning is from Satan
Allah likes sneezing and hates yawning
Satan lives in your nose at night and you get rid of him by squirting water up your nose in the morning

Sorry but the Hadith speaks for itself and I cannot even begin to imagine how any of these teachings can be explained in a reasonable way.

1.582: Narrated Abu Huraira:

Allah's Apostle said, "When the Adhan is pronounced Satan takes to his heels and passes wind with noise during his flight in order not to hear the Adhan. When the Adhan is completed he comes back and again takes to his heels when the Iqama is pronounced and after its completion he returns again till he whispers into the heart of the person (to divert his attention from his prayer) and makes him remember things which he does not recall to his mind before the prayer and that causes him to forget how much he has prayed."

2.245: Narrated 'Abdullah :

A person was mentioned before the Prophet and he was told that he had kept on sleeping till morning and had not got up for the prayer. The Prophet said, "Satan urinated in his ears."

4.492: Narrated 'Abdullah:

It was mentioned before the Prophet that there was a man who slept the night till morning (after sunrise). The Prophet said, "He is a man in whose ears (or ear) Satan had urinated."

4.509: Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "Yawning is from Satan and if anyone of you yawns, he should check his yawning as much as possible, for if anyone of you (during the act of yawning) should say: 'Ha', Satan will laugh at him."

8.242: Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "Allah likes sneezing and dislikes yawning, so if someone sneezes and then praises Allah, then it is obligatory on every Muslim who heard him, to say: May Allah be merciful to you (Yar-hamuka-l-lah). But as regards yawning, it is from Satan, so one must try one's best to stop it, if one says 'Ha' when yawning, Satan will laugh at him."

4.516: Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "If anyone of you rouses from sleep and performs the ablution, he should wash his nose by putting water in it and then blowing it out thrice, because Satan has stayed in the upper part of his nose all the night."

 

[groundpounder]

Why do most Muslim countries oppress others that are in their same culture? (the oppression of women is one example) Yet they claim to fight oppression?

*bump*

*rebump*

 

[Sylviane88]

Valley, are you coptic ?

 

[valley]

Valley, are you coptic ?

I had to go look up the word "coptic" to figure out what you were asking. But the answer, based on my understanding of what I read, is a strong "no, I am not coptic".

Sylviane, 2 members have been asking you repeatedly to answer a question regarding issues of oppression in Islam. Will you please address their concerns?

 

[Godsloveapples]

Why do most Muslim countries oppress others that are in their same culture? (the oppression of women is one example) Yet they claim to fight oppression?

Among the many topics of interest to non-Muslims, the status of Muslim women and the theme of their rights -- or rather, the perceived lack of them – seems to be foremost. The media’s portrayal of Muslim women, usually outlining their “oppression and mystery” seems to contribute to this negative perception.


The main reason for this is that people often fail to distinguish between culture and religion -- two things that are completely different. In fact, Islam condemns oppression of any kind whether it is towards a woman or humankind in general.

Continued

(Link) IslamWeb - Are Muslim women oppressed?

(Link)
Oppression from an Islamic Perspective - IslamonLine.net - Ask The Scholar