Did You Serve ?

[Minor Axis]

Why did you post this thread?

 

[Stone]

Well so far we have several thousand chicken hawks using Johns logic...as we dont have many responses

Only one accusation that I'm aware of, TM.

We....you, I and the forum have a problem....IMO.
And it comes down to credibility.
A recent event occurred that stood out to me.

Let me explain to the forum......you and I were in some of the most controversial debates concerning waterboarding and legalizing torture at another debate forum.....to the extent the stuff at this site pales in comparison and in order to not be banned we came to a truce to stop stalking each other and when in agreement, note it.....and that has continued here.
But I did tell you I would comment if I felt strongly and no one else commented.
Here we are.

Those arguments on legalizing torture were so intense I can not believe you've changed your mind and are posing in front of this debate forum out of convenience in order to make present arguments pass easier.
This is incredibly dishonest.

Further, at that other debate forum, your arguments for military action were all encompassing around the globe...pax americana.....a neo conservative goal that was essentially empire building through the use of military persuasion shrouded by the imagery 'war on terrorism'.

I've got a pretty good idea of why you didn't serve and it's actually irrelevant.......the point is, you argue to put the lives of others at risk knowing yours wouldn't be......
You refused to debate the issue at hand and defend your self point by point.
Now you're stuck with imagery of your own making.

I'm pretty sure this ends our truce.
I'm still here to argue the points and issues of the threads posted just as I have......but I'm not here to help you promote a false image of yourself.

 

[Stone]

BTW.......we both got banned at that other forum anyway......just different times and reasons

 

[The Man]

its your choice ...I am on the road at the moment and quoting is difficult on the phone.
I will be back on this evening

 

[The Man]

read your rep.....private btw. which explains my position for the thread

 

[Stone]

its your choice ...I am on the road at the moment and quoting is difficult on the phone.
I will be back on this evening

Of course it's my choice.....everything I post is my choice.
You appear to have chosen unwisely.


Any one interested in those arguments can PM me for linkage to that other forum and the screen names to search under.

 

[Stone]

read your rep.....private btw. which explains my position for the thread

Read it.

I was on the bus to induction with several guys that had that problem ......they were scheduled for re-testing at later dates.
The draft didn't care so long as the test could eventually be passed .

 

[The Man]

your reading failed you as that was not the reason
so much for private by the way hey stone.
what's funny is while you are trying to throw me under the bus....you are already there by your very posts

 

[Stone]

your reading failed you as that was not the reason
so much for private by the way hey stone.
what's funny is while you are trying to throw me under the bus....you are already there by your very posts

You posted a reason that wasn't the reason?
Sweet.

so much for private by the way hey stone.

You really think you can manipulate me?
Go complain to a moderator.

what's funny is while you are trying to throw me under the bus....you are already there by your very posts

I think you need a reality check.

 

[Alien Allen]

and the gloves are off

now we are talking

 

[Stone]

and the gloves are off

now we are talking

It's about debate, credibility and honesty.
TM is starting off with a tremendous disadvantage.
In a way, I feel sorry for him, but he's built a facade he can't back up and wound up making it worse by starting this thread.

I expect to see a lot of desperation in rehabilitating his image, but I think he's done more damage than I can.

His arguments in the past to extend military action globally and the promotion of legalized torture were just too intense.

 

[The Man]

Only one accusation that I'm aware of, TM.

We....you, I and the forum have a problem....IMO.
And it comes down to credibility.
A recent event occurred that stood out to me.

Let me explain to the forum......you and I were in some of the most controversial debates concerning waterboarding and legalizing torture at another debate forum.....to the extent the stuff at this site pales in comparison and in order to not be banned we came to a truce to stop stalking each other and when in agreement, note it.....and that has continued here.
But I did tell you I would comment if I felt strongly and no one else commented.
Here we are.

Those arguments on legalizing torture were so intense I can not believe you've changed your mind and are posing in front of this debate forum out of convenience in order to make present arguments pass easier.
This is incredibly dishonest.

Further, at that other debate forum, your arguments for military action were all encompassing around the globe...pax americana.....a neo conservative goal that was essentially empire building through the use of military persuasion shrouded by the imagery 'war on terrorism'.

I've got a pretty good idea of why you didn't serve and it's actually irrelevant.......the point is, you argue to put the lives of others at risk knowing yours wouldn't be......
You refused to debate the issue at hand and defend your self point by point.
Now you're stuck with imagery of your own making.

I'm pretty sure this ends our truce.
I'm still here to argue the points and issues of the threads posted just as I have......but I'm not here to help you promote a false image of yourself.

Your shit doesnt work with me stone.

I start this thread in regard to squash the chicken hawk label made by john.
To back up the claim or shut the fuck up.
A non response to a question of someone served or not doesnt make them a chicken hawk.
If I asked you stone if you were gay and you didnt respond and later said its none of my business.
I can very well start posting "Stone is gay" in all the threads.
You would ask me to back it or shut the fuck up....Simple.

I've got a pretty good idea of why you didn't serve and it's actually irrelevant

Its would be very relevant stone...as it would be the base for the opinion formed.

We....you, I and the forum have a problem....IMO.

You have the problem...there is no expanded logic here stone.

Let me explain to the forum......you and I were in some of the most controversial debates concerning waterboarding and legalizing torture at another debate forum.....to the extent the stuff at this site pales in comparison and in order to not be banned we came to a truce to stop stalking each other and when in agreement, note it.....and that has continued here.

Here you attempt to drag up topic from years ago from another forum and create drama.
Essentially going against the rules here of not dragging in drama from another forum...what happens in vegas stay in vegas...There was a recent thread closing falling very much along the lines similar to your actions in this thread.
Ok...you have already posted it so now I have to defend it.

Those arguments on legalizing torture were so intense I can not believe you've changed your mind and are posing in front of this debate forum out of convenience in order to make present arguments pass easier.
This is incredibly dishonest.

Lets recap.
The water boarding was done under bush policy.
It was legal at the time...therefore there was no argument to legalize torture.
Bush was already gone.

My beef was and still is Obama coming in and throwing everyone under the bus...Bush the CIA and other officials...as part of his apology tour.

The rule needed to quietly change with an executive order ...its really that simple.
But No Obama had to shine the spotlight on himself as the do good humanitarian at the expense of anyone and everyone.
You fell for it line hook and sinker...as well as many others.
Several hundred detainees at gitmo..3 were boarded that uncovered information to another planned attack.


To further you would torture if it involved you or your family.
Very hypocritical statements.
But yet you want to come here to this thread and play character cop, assassinate my character while you have already assassinated your own.....with your chickenshit debate strategy.

Further, at that other debate forum, your arguments for military action were all encompassing around the globe...pax americana.....a neo conservative goal that was essentially empire building through the use of military persuasion shrouded by the imagery 'war on terrorism'.

Bullshit stone..An embarrassing strawman.

I have no problem with rational nations...I do have problems with radicals.
Drone em snipe em bomb em...I just dont give a shit...whether the fruitcake is in a parking lot or watching tv..I just dont care.

The option is to set back and do nothing....remember stone this is not conventional...they hide and mix among the population which is what makes it so difficult.
Its not meet on a hill and have at it...if that were the case we could stomp em rather fast.
AQ and the Taliban are not concentrated to one location...And the host nations just havent made any progress on elimination stone ...so either the effort isnt there or they are not capable.
A mix of both actually.

You refused to debate the issue at hand and defend your self point by point.

No refusal.....Laughable stone.
I CREATED this thread for debate in the debate section...to debate whether or not I am a chicken hawk.
John hasnt produced anything to back his claim.
Provide some documentation and we will debate it point by point.
Neither you or john have produced anything.

I'm still here to argue the points and issues of the threads posted just as I have

Of which you have done very poorly in this thread.....Hell stone...your posts were of such illogical proportion the site went down for several hours...thus requiring me to respond today as a result.

I'm pretty sure this ends our truce.

If thats what you want stone....its your call.
I defend myself from being called a chicken hawk.....equates to you choosing to end a truce.
Doesnt follow...just like the rest of your post...whatever your issue you will have to work it out on your own....If that includes attempting to toss me under the bus in an effort to badge yourself "character cop" of the year then go right ahead....Its a long road ole friend.

but I'm not here to help you promote a false image of yourself

I am here to protect my image....If you have documentation to show I am a chicken hawk...then provide it by all means.

 

[The Man]

It's about debate, credibility and honesty.
TM is starting off with a tremendous disadvantage.
In a way, I feel sorry for him, but he's built a facade he can't back up and wound up making it worse by starting this thread.

I expect to see a lot of desperation in rehabilitating his image, but I think he's done more damage than I can.

His arguments in the past to extend military action globally and the promotion of legalized torture were just too intense.

It's about debate, credibility and honesty.

Something you obviously need to acquire.

TM is starting off with a tremendous disadvantage.

Where?

but he's built a facade he can't back up and wound up making it worse by starting this thread.

The thread is actually "serving" me well ...thanks buddy...you steered I drove.

 

[Stone]

Your shit doesnt work with me stone.


(edited for brevity )

...........................

Your shit doesnt work with me stone.

And yet, here you are trying to defend yourself.
I am forcing you to respond.
Let's see how well you do.

( to the readers......skip to the last sentence, this is the typical TM BS I'm used to from a past experience )

I start this thread in regard to squash the chicken hawk label made by john.
To back up the claim or shut the fuck up.

Looks to me like you decided to shut the fuck up about your military service.

A non response to a question of someone served or not doesnt make them a chicken hawk.

Indeed....so why look so guilty?

If I asked you stone if you were gay and you didnt respond and later said its none of my business.

I'm not gay. Nor a homophobe.
I don't care if you are or not.

I can very well start posting "Stone is gay" in all the threads.

You could, but I doubt anyone would believe you, especially now.

You would ask me to back it or shut the fuck up....Simple.

Right now I'd be more inclined to make fun of you since your credibly is in the toilet.

Its would be very relevant stone...as it would be the base for the opinion formed.

It could be. Think anyone is going to believe you now after all that's been posted?

You have the problem...there is no expanded logic here stone.

You might want to review this thread.......I have no problem and you've made your own.

Here you attempt to drag up topic from years ago from another forum and create drama.
Essentially going against the rules here of not dragging in drama from another forum..

I don't play by your rules or your interpretations, TM.

There was a recent thread closing falling very much along the lines similar to your actions in this thread.

Anyone wanting the info I can provide on your claims can contact me in private as I suggested.
ie...tough shit, slick.

Ok...you have already posted it so now I have to defend it.

Where to start?....

The water boarding was done under bush policy.
It was legal at the time...therefore there was no argument to legalize torture.

Anyone doubt me about TM rationalizing waterboarding?
If so, PM me and I'll give you the link to a collection of interesting comments.

My beef was and still is Obama coming in and throwing everyone under the bus...Bush the CIA and other officials...as part of his apology tour.

Irrelevant to the discussion of your views on torture and militarism.

The rule needed to quietly change with an executive order ...its really that simple.
But No Obama had to shine the spotlight on himself as the do good humanitarian at the expense of anyone and everyone.

Irrelevant to the discussion of your views on torture and militarism.

Several hundred detainees at gitmo..3 were boarded that uncovered information to another planned attack.

Anyone see any denial of supporting legalized torture?

To further you would torture if it involved you or your family.

Irrelevant.......the issue isn't what I'd do illegally, it's what you advocate as a legal act......you do and have advocated legalized torture, in this thread.
And it's counter to previous clames made in this forum.
You just proved yourself a liar.

You just proved yourself a liar.

Do you bother to proof read the logic of your statements?

But yet you want to come here to this thread and play character cop, assassinate my character while you have already assassinated your own.....with your chickenshit debate strategy.

Dude...you killed your own credibility with your own words so stop whining like a little bitch and own up to it.

Bullshit stone..An embarrassing strawman.

Damn embarassing for you. Should have thought about as I gave you fair warning to come clean and explain yourself.....kinda late now and I don't see any explanations from you.

I have no problem with rational nations...I do have problems with radicals.

So?

Drone em snipe em bomb em...I just dont give a shit...whether the fruitcake is in a parking lot or watching tv..I just dont care.

Anyone having read that get a sense of a lack of diplomacy?
That's what I'm talking about....
Irrational behavior :eek
Hard core militarism.

Add that to the fact you refuse to post your military service, servive members and vets are going to be suspicious about your sincerety.
It's unavoidable, TM.
And now you persist further in making a fool of yourself.

The option is to set back and do nothing....remember stone this is not conventional...they hide and mix among the population which is what makes it so difficult.
Its not meet on a hill and have at it...if that were the case we could stomp em rather fast.
AQ and the Taliban are not concentrated to one location...And the host nations just havent made any progress on elimination stone ...so either the effort isnt there or they are not capable.
A mix of both actually.

Irrelevant to the thread topic.
It looks like you are trying to rationalize your chickenhawkness.

I posted I didn't serve, why not you?
What do you fear with a 'yes' or 'no' answer?

No refusal.....Laughable stone.
I CREATED this thread for debate in the debate section...to debate whether or not I am a chicken hawk.

The opening post:

Did You Serve ?

A simple yes or no
Beware however that not responding may label you as a chicken hawk ,chicken shit, coward or fucking coward by select members...Also there is possibility that threads may be started in the general forum in relation to not responding to this question as well.​

Nope, no such claim or challenge in the opening post.
You simply warned that not responding could label a person a chickenhawk.
Well.....that did happen .....but it's only been you.
You've proven nothing other than admitting to supporting legalized torture and a bent for killing.

John hasnt produced anything to back his claim.

So?
Haven't you done enough?

Neither you or john have produced anything.

I don't have to.......I didn't call you a 'chickenhawk'......really.....go back and read my words.....but this post of yours definitely shows you tilting in that direction using words and images that support my claims....now I don't even hace to link to your comments elsewhere.
I'd say you out thought yourself.....but that seems a contradiction to start with

If thats what you want stone....its your call.

I think I'll pay more attention to your future posts

I defend myself from being called a chicken hawk.....

But you haven't.......reread this post.

Did you serve in the military?.......your question in the poll, central to this thread, and you wound up refusing to answer.......I did caution you that you were likely to get the shit kicked out of you.
Why didn't you listen?

I am here to protect my image

Of course..........read the thread again----------->fail.

 

[Stone]

Something you obviously need to acquire.

Where?

The thread is actually "serving" me well ...thanks buddy...you steered I drove.

And denial sets in....

 

[The Man]

And yet, here you are trying to defend yourself.
I am forcing you to respond.
Let's see how well you do.


*bullshit edited out by the man*








Irrelevant.......the issue isn't what I'd do illegally, it's what you advocate as a legal act......you do and have advocated legalized torture, in this thread.
And it's counter to previous clames made in this forum.
You just proved yourself a liar.






And yet, here you are trying to defend yourself.
I am forcing you to respond.
Let's see how well you do.

And yet, here you are trying to defend yourself.

Easy enough

Irrelevant.......the issue isn't what I'd do illegally, it's what you advocate as a legal act.

You approve of torture by yourself...illegal or not you approve stone...makes you a hypocrite.

it's what you advocate as a legal act

I have stated it needed to become illegal.{Again just the other day in a direct response to you}.
You are openly being dishonest to the forum again.
Here is the post below {to you} which clearly showed my position..you responded to that post...proof that you also read it

Credit goes to you stone :thumbup
While it legally may have not been torture at the time....it needs to be illegal now.

You have just discredited yourself in front of the forum again.

it's what you advocate as a legal act......you do and have advocated legalized torture, in this thread.

More dishonest posting from you again.

And it's counter to previous clames made in this forum.

Back those claims Stone...I insist
More dishonesty....the only character you are destroying is your own.

 

[The Man]

You may want to perhaps seek council for the path of self destruction you are on.
Whatever the reason for your behavior professional help is available.

 

[The Man]

and the gloves are off

now we are talking

I hope it doesnt come to that as wound healing comes slow at his age.

 

[Stone]

Easy enough

You approve of torture by yourself...illegal or not you approve stone...makes you a hypocrite.


I have stated it needed to become illegal.{Again just the other day in a direct response to you}.
You are openly being dishonest to the forum again.
Here is the post below {to you} which clearly showed my position..you responded to that post...proof that you also read it



You have just discredited yourself in front of the forum again.



More dishonest posting from you again.


Back those claims Stone...I insist
More dishonesty....the only character you are destroying is your own.

You can insist all you want, make further claims all you want......but you made this thread about you... YOU.

Your own words have betrayed you in your previous post. No matter how you try to restate your position, it was quite clear the first time.

There's nothing left for me to prove....you did it for me.

Think not?....Go back and read your own words.

Don't like it......go whine to a moderator.

 

[Stone]

BTW......I'm printing these web pages to my hard drive so that any editing you do isn't lost like it was at that other forum......