Auto bailout

[Alien Allen]

I am thinking maybe a bailout will be a waste. Unless somebody can control Henry Waxman. He wants to put in more regulations and at the top is to allow each state to set higher than the fed emission standards. that is the stupidest fucking idea I have ever heard. it is gonna cost billions to comply. and what is to be done that drive into the commie bullshit state CA if they came from lest say Utah. You gonna have to check the friggin car at the border. This decision to put Waxman in charge is gonna be doom and gloom. the idiots who voted for Obama are gonna wish there was a check and balance to the liberal bullshit.

 

[SgtSpike]

no argument with me about the ludicrous wages management makes. GM head makes $20 Million. No friggin way he deserves that. and there are a bunch more making that. Mulder thinks it is ok but not me. the whole thing is totally screwed up from top to bottom.

If he doesn't deserve it, why hasn't he been fired or his wages been reduced? The board of directors (usually large shareholders) would have fired him already if they thought he wasn't doing the best job he could and deserved the pay they were giving him...

 

[Alien Allen]

If he doesn't deserve it, why hasn't he been fired or his wages been reduced? The board of directors (usually large shareholders) would have fired him already if they thought he wasn't doing the best job he could and deserved the pay they were giving him...

I do not buy that argument

I have seen some large corps in this state go into bankruptcy led by idiots. Hell we re elected an idiot to the white house and we are shareholders to what does that tell ya.

Only an idiot would answer as he did about a pay cut. No way congress is going to give the money out if concessions don't include all involved sacrificing. that is probably why they want a plan in writing. it will be interesting to see what they come up with.

we probably hear a lot more than most where I live which is in the suburbs of Detroit. The auto bailout is always in the headlines. in todays paper there was most of the front page along with the full second and third pages about it. nightly news leads off with it in detail

 

[Hoffa]

Exactly right on that point . Its a complex thing that would take time , maybe too much time too work out , but hopefully something before too late .
This whole thing would be a contract with America , the taxpayer , and they{GOVT } have every right to call the shots .
We all learned as youth" beggars can't be choosers ".
If the industry makes it on its own , the Union can get fair share for employees , thats fine , but when loans are required from taxpayer --- you dance to the lenders tune . >f

 

[SgtSpike]

Exactly right on that point . Its a complex thing that would take time , maybe too much time too work out , but hopefully something before too late .
This whole thing would be a contract with America , the taxpayer , and they{GOVT } have every right to call the shots .
We all learned as youth" beggars can't be choosers ".
If the industry makes it on its own , the Union can get fair share for employees , thats fine , but when loans are required from taxpayer --- you dance to the lenders tune . >f

Yeah... I'm just wondering, if he's doing such a terrible job at being a CEO that he drove the company down, why did the board of directors not see it? I understand that it would take time to switch CEO's, and that they're often given second or third chances to make things right, but I guess I can only see so much blame being laid on him.

Regardless, if this whole loan from the government thing goes through, I would want to make sure that these guys would pay back the loan before putting a penny in shareholder's or their own banks. No dividends, no bonuses, no paychecks even for the CEO's until they have paid back the loan in it's entirety. If they have that much belief they can turn the companies around, they should have no problem with this. They can still get money from their stock options in the meantime anyway.

 

[Strauss]

The Democrats have themselves a conundrum. If they bailout the Big 3, they look like the socialists they are. If they allow them to go belly up they further tank the economy. They also run a substantial risk, should they allow the the Big 3 to seek bankruptcy protection in Chapter 11, of alienating the unions (and their votes) when the bankruptcy court, in essence, busts the UAW which, be there no doubt, the Court will. The sales job is coming, we will be told how necessary this is to save America and the political stooges, otherwise known as the media, will go along and sing the tune.

 

[Alien Allen]

The Democrats have themselves a conundrum. If they bailout the Big 3, they look like the socialists they are. If they allow them to go belly up they further tank the economy. They also run a substantial risk, should they allow the the Big 3 to seek bankruptcy protection in Chapter 11, of alienating the unions (and their votes) when the bankruptcy court, in essence, busts the UAW which, be there no doubt, the Court will. The sales job is coming, we will be told how necessary this is to save America and the political stooges, otherwise known as the media, will go along and sing the tune.

Pelosi and Reid are just playing a game.

They want to look like they are new age Democrats that are gonna be tough and manage everything to our benefit.

They will not throw the unions under the bus when push comes to shove.

Not in an overt way.

They will do it out of stupidity by letting the likes of Waxaman screw the Big 3

 

[Strauss]

Pelosi and Reid are just playing a game.

They want to look like they are new age Democrats that are gonna be tough and manage everything to our benefit.

They will not throw the unions under the bus when push comes to shove.

Not in an overt way.

They will do it out of stupidity by letting the likes of Waxaman screw the Big 3

I have met Waxman and he is an idiot.

Pelosi and her minions will allow the Big 3 to go into bankruptcy so that they can wash their hands of the mess without having to suffer the wrath of the unions.

 

[GoldDust Woman]

Pelosi and her minions will allow the Big 3 to go into bankruptcy so that they can wash their hands of the mess without having to suffer the wrath of the unions.

Really? :ninja

I'm all for letting them go belly up. :willy_nilly:

They need to reorganize. Get rid of the fatted calves and start anew!

 

[Alien Allen]

I have met Waxman and he is an idiot.

Pelosi and her minions will allow the Big 3 to go into bankruptcy so that they can wash their hands of the mess without having to suffer the wrath of the unions.

That makes no sense

The unions will be pissed off if the Big 3 go bankrupt.

They will have nobody to blame other than the Democrats for it happening and their losing their clout along with the financial losses.

I admit I am biased because bankruptcy will destroy my state. I hope you all will enjoy giving your taxes to bail us out. because make no mistake. MI will go bankrupt.

 

[Strauss]

That makes no sense

The unions will be pissed off if the Big 3 go bankrupt.

They will have nobody to blame other than the Democrats for it happening and their losing their clout along with the financial losses.

I admit I am biased because bankruptcy will destroy my state. I hope you all will enjoy giving your taxes to bail us out. because make no mistake. MI will go bankrupt.

Makes all the sense in the world. Pelsoi will claim she stood up to the very bad men at GM, Ford et al who ran the companies into the ground and she, unfortunately, can't do anything about the bankruptcy court because the law is the law so sorry unions.

Bankruptcy will not destroy your state. GM et al will keep going along and you'll never notice the difference, except the the 25 billion will come a private group of lenders rather than the fed government.

 

[Hoffa]

That makes no sense

The unions will be pissed off if the Big 3 go bankrupt.

They will have nobody to blame other than the Democrats for it happening and their losing their clout along with the financial losses.

I admit I am biased because bankruptcy will destroy my state. I hope you all will enjoy giving your taxes to bail us out. because make no mistake. MI will go bankrupt.

Thats the problem . I am not biased because FLA is not a big issue , but we are all in this together .
Time to start thinking so .
Time to start thinking about the nation as whole .
I can live with the outcome personally --either way , but a loan under strict conditions is the best way .
Here's hoping ! >f

 

[GoldDust Woman]

Selling the corporate jets would be a good start, don't you all agree? :cool

 

[Hoffa]

Selling the corporate jets would be a good start, don't you all agree? :cool

For political purpose yes . Not the problem at all , but it would show sincerity in fixing what must be fixed . You obviously should never go to taxpayers in corporate jets to beg loans :mad>f

 

[Alien Allen]

Selling the corporate jets would be a good start, don't you all agree? :cool

that is being done

i am not sure but according to todays papers several leases were being dropped

 

[Strauss]

Selling the corporate jets would be a good start, don't you all agree? :cool

Not really, corporate jets can be a cost method of doing business. The problem is perception and from a perception standpoint corporate jets are seen as excess. Don't recall anyone suggesting that Speaker Pelsoi get rid of that jet she uses to fly back and forth to her district. Remember the big stink last year because her jets was one of the newest jets? You and I are paying for her fat ass to fly back and forth. At least with GM and the like we aren't paying for it.

 

[GoldDust Woman]

For political purpose yes . Not the problem at all , but it would show sincerity in fixing what must be fixed . You obviously should never go to taxpayers in corporate jets to beg loans :mad>f

Precisely! :mad

Let 'em stew in their own juices for awhile. :thumbdown

 

[Alien Allen]

Thats the problem . I am not biased because FLA is not a big issue , but we are all in this together .
Time to start thinking so .
Time to start thinking about the nation as whole .
I can live with the outcome personally --either way , but a loan under strict conditions is the best way .
Here's hoping ! >f

What is FLA??

?? Labor Agreement??

I fully agree with the strict conditions. :thumbup

And this is supposed to be a loan. Is there not a way the Govt can not be put on the top of the list of those that get paid off in the event of a complete failure??

 

[GoldDust Woman]

Not really, corporate jets can be a cost method of doing business. The problem is perception and from a perception standpoint corporate jets are seen as excess. Don't recall anyone suggesting that Speaker Pelsoi get rid of that jet she uses to fly back and forth to her district. Remember the big stink last year because her jets was one of the newest jets? You and I are paying for her fat ass to fly back and forth. At least with GM and the like we aren't paying for it.

And the voice of reason chimes in... again.

"Cost method of doing business"? With one CEO on board? C'mon Darlin', you can do better than that.

Let all of the fat cats fly coach. :nod:

 

[Alien Allen]

Not really, corporate jets can be a cost method of doing business. The problem is perception and from a perception standpoint corporate jets are seen as excess. Don't recall anyone suggesting that Speaker Pelsoi get rid of that jet she uses to fly back and forth to her district. Remember the big stink last year because her jets was one of the newest jets? You and I are paying for her fat ass to fly back and forth. At least with GM and the like we aren't paying for it.

no need for owning or leasing jets

one can get a charter

tis a bit different than than Pelosi needing one too.

apples and oranges