Who is rushing home to listen to President Obama.

[retro]

so did maccain and is he president?

So? I'm curious... if you think Obama has the right to talk down to us because he's the President; would you have thought the same when Bush was the President?

 

[Peter Parka]

Thank god the president is making another speech. Its been two whole days now. I was starting to have obamagasm withdrawal...

Oh no! Your president is making another speech, that's not his job, he should just fade into the background so you dont know what the fuck he wants to do in his job.:sarcasm

 

[nova]

Oh no! Your president is making another speech, that's not his job, he should just fade into the background so you dont know what the fuck he wants to do in his job.:sarcasm

You may have been sarcastic, but you're absolutely right, its NOT his job to be making prime time TV speeches every other week, especially when he's not actually saying anything of substance.

 

[Peter Parka]

You may have been sarcastic, but you're absolutely right, its NOT his job to be making prime time TV speeches every other week, especially when he's not actually saying anything of substance.

You dont think its your presidents job to keep you informed of what he's up to? How will you be able to moan about him telling kids to study hard at school then?

 

[JanieDough]

So? I'm curious... if you think Obama has the right to talk down to us because he's the President; would you have thought the same when Bush was the President?

I don't think he has the right. I just don't think he is talking down to us. He is just talking from the office of the president.

I am not all about Obama. I hated Bush because I thought he made really bad choices and he was kind of dumb.

 

[Meirionnydd]

No but McCain lacked one thing Obama had an abundance of, mindless followers.....

I'm pretty sure that McCain also had an abundance of mindless followers.

 

[nova]

I'm pretty sure that McCain also had an abundance of mindless followers.

Funny I don't remember McCain rally's with thousands chanting "yes we can" like drooling retards...

Its also kinda funny that all the Big O supporters have done a complete 180 on what the biggest problems are to exactly what Dear Leader is telling them the biggest problems are...

For the Left, war without Bush is not war at all | Washington Examiner

The only thing thats changed in the last 12 months is the letter after the guy's name in the White House and yet suddenly, Iraq and Afghanistan aren't all that big of problems anymore.

 

[Meirionnydd]

Funny I don't remember McCain rally's with thousands chanting "yes we can" like drooling retards...

I guess all the old white people at the McCain rallies had problems with projecting their voices.

 

[Minor Axis]

No but McCain lacked one thing Obama had an abundance of, mindless followers.....

No more mindless than the way you and many of the "conservatives" in this forum mindlessly defend a party whose complete interest is in defending big business at the expense of average citizens. This is a good example where big business is hurting you and me by way of skyrocketing insurance premiums, denial and/or lack of coverage. You will never, ever, see the Republican Party or Conservatives willingly support programs that help people, because... "well, we just can't afford such nonsense". It's been that way as long as there have been conservatives. The Republican's only intent is to tweak the system just enough to call it reform while protecting these huge corporations and their profits, huge increases in profits, and lavishly compensated officers.

Good speech and completely predictable Republican rebuttal.

The Survive and Thrive Boomer Guide.

While the 10 biggest health insurance companies were seeing their profits rise by more than 400 percent between 2000 and 2007, the number of Americans without health insurance grew by 19 percent, reports the article “Rachel Maddow Show: Wendell Potter on the Health Care Industry Putting Soaring Profits Before People.

 

[Minor Axis]

As far as Reagan goes... I count 20 addresses "to the nation' and State of the Union addresses in his first term. That number includes radio addresses, and I haven't been able to tell how many of them were prime time speeches. What's Obama up to now? 7-8 prime time addresses to the nation?

When it comes down to it, I really doubt you'd be critiquing this if it was "your man" addressing the country.

 

[BadBoy@TheWheel]

You dont think its your presidents job to keep you informed of what he's up to? How will you be able to moan about him telling kids to study hard at school then?

There was not on clear message in his talk last night. He made no commitments, and defined no clear path as to what he was actually going to do. And it is clear that there is a huge gap, in what he wants, and what is written in the bill he's trying to push.
He's the one that ran on the transparency stance
Let's not hold him accountable....He's the chosen one!

 

[Tim]

Obama is talking down to us? Really? I never once felt like he was talking down to me, not at all. Is this a new talking point I need to add to the list? I need to know, is this the latest and greatest talking point that's going to make the rounds? It's so damn hard to keep up with them all. I can't keep up with them all... He's either talking down to us, taking up too much prime time TV time, a fascist, a communist, Hitleresque, a socialist or just a plain old "elitist".

I am an Obama supporter and I can guarantee you that I am not a mindless follower. There are things that I do not agree on with him, but overall I fully support the direction that he is taking this country. Actually I want him to push for universal health care and not pander to the corporations and special interests.
And for those of you that are dead set against universal health care in this country and continue to support our fucking greed and inhumanity when it comes to the health of our citizens, don't expect me to feel sorry for you when you lose a loved one or even your home when your insurance company fails to cover you in the name of profits.

And if you are too stupid to see that with the amount of money that flows through the health care system today we could ALL have top notch care. Every man women and child in the US could be covered with the amount of money wasted in the US... and with all that money we are spending, we are still lower that many countries when it comes to infant mortality and life span... Yeah, we got the best health care in the world :sarcasm

We are the only industrialized country on the face of the planet that allow corporations to make a profit on basic health care, we are the only ones that put out health care in the hands of the vultures and then stand behind them and call it patriotic/capitalism. I have never seen so many idiots listen to a few talking points and scare tactics that make them fight against their own interests.

 

[Tim]

There was not on clear message in his talk last night. He made no commitments, and defined no clear path as to what he was actually going to do. And it is clear that there is a huge gap, in what he wants, and what is written in the bill he's trying to push.
He's the one that ran on the transparency stance
Let's not hold him accountable....He's the chosen one!

No clear message? Did you even listen to the speech?

If You Have Health Insurance,
the President's Plan:

• Ends discrimination against people with pre-existing conditions.
• Limits premium discrimination based on gender and age.
• Prevents insurance companies from dropping coverage when people are sick and need it most.
• Caps out-of-pocket expenses so people don’t go broke when they get sick.
• Eliminates extra charges for preventive care like mammograms, flu shots and diabetes tests to improve health and save money.
• Protects Medicare for seniors.
• Eliminates the “donut-hole” gap in coverage for prescription drugs.

If You Don’t Have Insurance,
the President's Plan:

• Creates a new insurance marketplace — the Exchange — that allows people without insurance and small businesses to compare plans and buy insurance at competitive prices.
• Provides new tax credits to help people buy insurance.
• Provides small businesses tax credits and affordable options for covering employees.
• Offers a public health insurance option to provide the uninsured and those who can’t find affordable coverage with a real choice.
• Immediately offers new, low-cost coverage through a national “high risk” pool to protect people with preexisting conditions from financial ruin until the new Exchange is created.

For All Americans,
the President's Plan:

• Won’t add a dime to the deficit and is paid for upfront.
• Requires additional cuts if savings are not realized.
• Implements a number of delivery system reforms that begin to rein in health care costs and align incentives for hospitals, physicians, and others to improve quality.
• Creates an independent commission of doctors and medical experts to identify waste, fraud and abuse in the health care system.
• Orders immediate medical malpractice reform projects that could help doctors focus on putting their patients first, not on practicing defensive medicine.
• Requires large employers to cover their employees and individuals who can afford it to buy insurance so everyone shares in the responsibility of reform.

All these points were covered in his speech last night. He is not the one writing the Bills, he is stating his plan and how he wants to see it play out. Now it's up to congress and the senate to take this plan and work it into the bills they are writing. Would you prefer that he actually sit down and write the bill like Clinton did? Or would you rather he put forth an outline and let congress do their jobs and fill in the details???

 

[Minor Axis]

I have never seen so many idiots listen to a few talking points and scare tactics that make them fight against their own interests.

Gotta hand it to the Republican party for manipulation skills. :smiley24: The conservatives in this country want to see NO successes for this Administration and are working 24/7 to achieve that goal. Very bewildering are the people who support a party who don't give a damn about them personally.

 

[BadBoy@TheWheel]

Obama is talking down to us? Really? I never once felt like he was talking down to me, not at all. Is this a new talking point I need to add to the list? I need to know, is this the latest and greatest talking point that's going to make the rounds? It's so damn hard to keep up with them all. I can't keep up with them all... He's either talking down to us, taking up too much prime time TV time, a fascist, a communist, Hitleresque, a socialist or just a plain old "elitist".

I am an Obama supporter and I can guarantee you that I am not a mindless follower. There are things that I do not agree on with him, but overall I fully support the direction that he is taking this country. Actually I want him to push for universal health care and not pander to the corporations and special interests.
And for those of you that are dead set against universal health care in this country and continue to support our fucking greed and inhumanity when it comes to the health of our citizens, don't expect me to feel sorry for you when you lose a loved one or even your home when your insurance company fails to cover you in the name of profits.

And if you are too stupid to see that with the amount of money that flows through the health care system today we could ALL have top notch care. Every man women and child in the US could be covered with the amount of money wasted in the US... and with all that money we are spending, we are still lower that many countries when it comes to infant mortality and life span... Yeah, we got the best health care in the world :sarcasm

We are the only industrialized country on the face of the planet that allow corporations to make a profit on basic health care, we are the only ones that put out health care in the hands of the vultures and then stand behind them and call it patriotic/capitalism. I have never seen so many idiots listen to a few talking points and scare tactics that make them fight against their own interests.

So Medicare/Medicaid and the VA are all shining examples of how well the government does healthcare?
The government cannot make a pot of coffee without 8,000 workers and fat government contracts
Let's call this what it is Tim, he doesn't want to fix anything, he simply thinks us normal folk are too stupid to be in control of anything
Remember, anyone working for the Government, is just as prone to greed and excess as anyone in the private sector
You're fooling yourself thinking the government can do a better job of providing a useful service to humanity.

 

[BadBoy@TheWheel]

No clear message? Did you even listen to the speech?

If You Have Health Insurance,
the President's Plan:

• Ends discrimination against people with pre-existing conditions.
• Limits premium discrimination based on gender and age.
• Prevents insurance companies from dropping coverage when people are sick and need it most.
• Caps out-of-pocket expenses so people don’t go broke when they get sick.
• Eliminates extra charges for preventive care like mammograms, flu shots and diabetes tests to improve health and save money.
• Protects Medicare for seniors.
• Eliminates the “donut-hole” gap in coverage for prescription drugs.

If You Don’t Have Insurance,
the President's Plan:

• Creates a new insurance marketplace — the Exchange — that allows people without insurance and small businesses to compare plans and buy insurance at competitive prices.
• Provides new tax credits to help people buy insurance.
• Provides small businesses tax credits and affordable options for covering employees.
• Offers a public health insurance option to provide the uninsured and those who can’t find affordable coverage with a real choice.
• Immediately offers new, low-cost coverage through a national “high risk” pool to protect people with preexisting conditions from financial ruin until the new Exchange is created.

For All Americans,
the President's Plan:

• Won’t add a dime to the deficit and is paid for upfront.
• Requires additional cuts if savings are not realized.
• Implements a number of delivery system reforms that begin to rein in health care costs and align incentives for hospitals, physicians, and others to improve quality.
• Creates an independent commission of doctors and medical experts to identify waste, fraud and abuse in the health care system.
• Orders immediate medical malpractice reform projects that could help doctors focus on putting their patients first, not on practicing defensive medicine.
• Requires large employers to cover their employees and individuals who can afford it to buy insurance so everyone shares in the responsibility of reform.

All these points were covered in his speech last night. He is not the one writing the Bills, he is stating his plan and how he wants to see it play out. Now it's up to congress and the senate to take this plan and work it into the bills they are writing. Would you prefer that he actually sit down and write the bill like Clinton did? Or would you rather he put forth an outline and let congress do their jobs and fill in the details???

I heard all of it. The $900 billion dollar front end expense comes at the cost of more taxpayer dollars, I know how un-patriotic of me to bitch about MORE taxation.
The additional load will come in the form of penalties to insurance companies, who of course will pass the screwing on to covered people in the form of higher premiums
Yeah I heard the fucking speech, and what I hear is either way, this plan is going to cost a fortune, be mis-managed and lost in the shuffle like all government programs, and raped by lobby and government profiteers
Your argument is that this fixes a gap, my argument is we are putting more in the hands of people who cannot be trusted to chew gum without fucking someone over.

 

[nova]

No more mindless than the way you and many of the "conservatives" in this forum mindlessly defend a party whose complete interest is in defending big business at the expense of average citizens.

Excuse you? Who the fuck are you calling a "conservative" and a follower of the Repubs, because I'm not one. I am a libertarian, have been one for quite a few years and don't like the guys with Rs after their name any more than I like the guys with Ds.

This is a good example where big business is hurting you and me by way of skyrocketing insurance premiums, denial and/or lack of coverage. You will never, ever, see the Republican Party or Conservatives willingly support programs that help people, because... "well, we just can't afford such nonsense". It's been that way as long as there have been conservatives. The Republican's only intent is to tweak the system just enough to call it reform while protecting these huge corporations and their profits, huge increases in profits, and lavishly compensated officers.

Good speech and completely predictable Republican rebuttal.

The Survive and Thrive Boomer Guide.

Oh please. How about you bring some real arguments to the table instead othe emotional "those poor people" arguments.

You wanna know the biggest reason insurance premiums are skyrocketing? Its called basic Econ 101, supply and demand.

Health care is a scarce resource with essentially unlimited demand. At the same time, insurance as we know it today, that covers everything under the sun, insulates people from the increasing cost of that supply/demand equation. The end result is no price signaling mechanism to let people know, that hey, maybe I really don't need to go to the Dr. with a case of the sniffles.

And on top of that, no virginia, in fact you do NOT have a right to insurance. Insurance is nothing more than a contractual assignment of risk and under NO legal or philosophical theory that exists does anybody have a right to assign their risk to someone else. Period. End of Discussion.

Right now, we have somewhere between 8 to 10 million hard core, poor and chronically uninsured. Thats a small portion of the population. Thats also a problem of MEDICAID reform, not a reason to tear down the whole system just to serve some statist agenda. If Dear Leader and come out and said he wanted to reform Medicaid to help the people that really need it, there would have been very little debate. I dare say it would have been passed in March or April. But this bullshit of rebuilding the entire system to claim some sort of entitled right to the fruits of other's labor just doesn't fly, especially when the end result will be detrimental to the population at large as they're forced into the system.

As I've told other people before, its the difference between providing public housing and forcing everyone into public housing. Is it any wonder that most people have no problems with the former but would go apeshit at the latter?

 

[Codrus]

I heard all of it. The $900 billion dollar front end expense comes at the cost of more taxpayer dollars, I know how un-patriotic of me to bitch about MORE taxation.
The additional load will come in the form of penalties to insurance companies, who of course will pass the screwing on to covered people in the form of higher premiums
Yeah I heard the fucking speech, and what I hear is either way, this plan is going to cost a fortune, be mis-managed and lost in the shuffle like all government programs, and raped by lobby and government profiteers
Your argument is that this fixes a gap, my argument is we are putting more in the hands of people who cannot be trusted to chew gum without fucking someone over.

...well said:thumbup

 

[Tim]

So Medicare/Medicaid and the VA are all shining examples of how well the government does healthcare?
The government cannot make a pot of coffee without 8,000 workers and fat government contracts
Let's call this what it is Tim, he doesn't want to fix anything, he simply thinks us normal folk are too stupid to be in control of anything
Remember, anyone working for the Government, is just as prone to greed and excess as anyone in the private sector
You're fooling yourself thinking the government can do a better job of providing a useful service to humanity.

Yes, they actually are shining examples of government health care. They are run much more efficiently than private insurance. They don't deny claim in the name of profits and you know damn well that your claim will be paid no matter how sick you get. Can they be improved upon? Absolutely! But since when do we just give up on something because it's hard or needs improvement? Instead of complaining about the problems medicaid and medicare have why don't we address them and fix them?
Why do you think Medicaid and medicare have these problems? Do you think it has anything to do with the passage of legislation designed to sink the program? Legislation designed to subsidize private health care and pharmaceuticals to the tune of hundreds of millions each year?

Once again I will say it, if we were to actually do what's right by these programs and not what's right by the corporations who write these laws, then we will actually see a positive change. The foxes need to be driven from the hen house before we can see ANY positive change in this country. And as long as our politicians are bought and paid for by them, we will never fix anything.

 

[Codrus]

Yes, they actually are shining examples of government health care. They are run much more efficiently than private insurance. They don't deny claim in the name of profits and you know damn well that your claim will be paid no matter how sick you get. Can they be improved upon? Absolutely! But since when do we just give up on something because it's hard or needs improvement? Instead of complaining about the problems medicaid and medicare have why don't we address them and fix them?
Why do you think Medicaid and medicare have these problems? Do you think it has anything to do with the passage of legislation designed to sink the program? Legislation designed to subsidize private health care and pharmaceuticals to the tune of hundreds of millions each year?

Once again I will say it, if we were to actually do what's right by these programs and not what's right by the corporations who write these laws, then we will actually see a positive change. The foxes need to be driven from the hen house before we can see ANY positive change in this country. And as long as our politicians are bought and paid for by them, we will never fix anything.

thats 2 in a row:thumbup.....my head would probably explode if i saw 3