What are your thoughts on torture?

[Minor Axis]

Obama knows that if he pushes this issue any further he will loose the rest of his military support- folks will bail out of the military whoelsale the minute he squeezes thier nuts one more time. The guys I ran with are all putting in packets to retire as soon as they possibly can now that Obama has taken over- Senior NCO's will turn over 100% in the next 4 years.

I believe it's the truth according to Bovis you are seeking.

Really, how many times has Obama squeezed their nuts all ready? You seem to be suffering from wild illusions or like to exaggerate. I know several active duty people and nothing of the sort has been mentioned from one veteran to another (me). With this worry about Obama squeezing balls, I also find it high amusing that you apparently don't give a damn (or did not feel it was worth mentioning) about the former administrations greater concern with enriching contractors than making sure U.S. Military personnel were properly equipped. I suppose according to you Bush did a great job prosecuting the Iraq war.

 

[Minor Axis]

Yer nuts-

You're scary...:thumbdown

 

[Valde Bovis]

I believe it's the truth according to Bovis you are seeking.

Really, how many times has Obama squeezed their nuts all ready? You seem to be suffering from wild illusions or like to exaggerate. I know several active duty people and nothing of the sort has been mentioned from one veteran to another (me). With this worry about Obama squeezing balls, I also find it high amusing that you apparently don't give a damn (or did not feel it was worth mentioning) about the former administrations greater concern with enriching contractors than making sure U.S. Military personnel were properly equipped. I suppose according to you Bush did a great job prosecuting the Iraq war.

My last deployment ended in early January 2009. That was my 4th recall since my retirement. Since I seperated, 20 senior NCO's in my former circles have left the service and retired, they refused to serve under Obama.

The ball squeezing comes with the change in the emphasis on the rules of engagement- its been made very clear that non violent resolutions are prefered.

I have not even had the opportunity to comment on the other issues you brought up. I think your making assumptions again.

 

[Minor Axis]

The ball squeezing comes with the change in the emphasis on the rules of engagement- its been made very clear that non violent resolutions are prefered.

Your friends prefer going to war over "non violent" resolutions, really, that is the nut squeezing? My gosh, they get "belows in head work" imo.

 

[Valde Bovis]

Your friends prefer going to war over "non violent" resolutions, really, that is the nut squeezing? My gosh, they get "belows in head work" imo.

My buds all pretty much say the same thing- which is to give us an objective, tell us under what rules you want us to engage and let us operate, but dont tell us we can engage then tell us at the same time you better not hurt anyone.

 

[Minor Axis]

My buds all pretty much say the same thing- which is to give us an objective, tell us under what rules you want us to engage and let us operate, but dont tell us we can engage then tell us at the same time you better not hurt anyone.

And you are saying Obama single handedly has turned that all up side down?

 

[Valde Bovis]

And you are saying Obama single handedly has turned that all up side down?

You need to give some serious thought as to why it took 5 days for the worlds finest Navy to dispatch less than a handful of somali pirates, holding a single american hostage, especially considering the assests were on board the first US warship that arrived on scene less than 3 hours following the initial incident.

From the top down, in a chain of command as long as the US Navy's- you cannot operate from the top on every decision to use force- the CiC sets the tone and we are back to a million guesses on a plan before its executed-

Under Bush, the pirates would have been killed 20 minutes after the Bainbridge was on scene.

On a side note, them squids didnt do a bad job for SEALs. (grin)

 

[Minor Axis]

Under Bush, the pirates would have been killed 20 minutes after the Bainbridge was on scene.

You got me there as Bush is known for his great decisions...

 

[satinbutterfly]

you got me there as bush is known for his great decisions...

:24::24::24:

 

[mazHur]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4EfufBl1cU&feature=related

 

[Minor Axis]

Torture is defined by the UN as anything capable of causing permanent physical damage.

Waterboarding doesn't do that...

I know this, it's been happening since early times, just seems like the polyannas don't want to deal with it once they see it on TV.

We all want freedom, success and safety, but we aren't willing to do what's needed to keep it

Webster Dictionary (link) and wikipedia disagree with the U.N. Torture can be both physical and/or mental. I was waterboarded in the Navy. What is the difference between me and a terrorist? You can die or have a heart attack in addition to causing lung damage, if it is overdone. I happened to know when I was being water boarded as part of a pow camp, they were educating me. They weren't trying to kill me or bring me close to death in an effort to get info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterboarding:

Waterboarding can cause extreme pain, dry drowning, damage to lungs, brain damage from oxygen deprivation, other physical injuries including broken bones due to struggling against restraints, lasting psychological damage and, if uninterrupted, death.[4] Adverse physical consequences can manifest themselves months after the event, while psychological effects can last for years.[5] The term water board torture appears in press reports as early as 1976.[6]

 

[mazHur]

Webster Dictionary (link) and wikipedia disagree with the U.N. Torture can be both physical and/or mental. I was waterboarded in the Navy. What is the difference between me and a terrorist? You can die or have a heart attack in addition to causing lung damage, if it is overdone. I happened to know when I was being water boarded as part of a pow camp, they were educating me. They weren't trying to kill me or bring me close to death in an effort to get info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterboarding:

No need to be apologetic....I reject your flimsy attempt to justify on the face of facts on record by your own people and authorities...

No questions, no twisting, no side tracking, no evasion and avoidance from evidence on record.

 

[mazHur]

:24::24::24:

I am amused!!

 

[mazHur]

You need to give some serious thought as to why it took 5 days for the worlds finest Navy to dispatch less than a handful of somali pirates, holding a single american hostage, especially considering the assests were on board the first US warship that arrived on scene less than 3 hours following the initial incident.

From the top down, in a chain of command as long as the US Navy's- you cannot operate from the top on every decision to use force- the CiC sets the tone and we are back to a million guesses on a plan before its executed-

Under Bush, the pirates would have been killed 20 minutes after the Bainbridge was on scene.

On a side note, them squids didnt do a bad job for SEALs. (grin)

That's why the US couldn't rescue his hostages for eons from Iran's iron fist!!

 

[Minor Axis]

No need to be apologetic....I reject your flimsy attempt to justify on the face of facts on record by your own people and authorities...

No questions, no twisting, no side tracking, no evasion and avoidance from evidence on record.

Your response is without merit and idiotic. You have lost the ability to analyze objectively what you are reading in this forum and have reduced everyone to being your enemy. That is your failing.

 

[mazHur]

Your response is without merit and idiotic. You have lost the ability to analyze objectively what you are reading in this forum and have reduced everyone to being your enemy. That is your failing.

i have provided you enough 'proof'' and its now for you to admit or deny that with cogent reason rather than indulge in stupid remarks and idiotic trolliing!

 

[sannyhenry]

I also voted here.

 

[Minor Axis]

i have provided you enough 'proof'' and its now for you to admit or deny that with cogent reason rather than indulge in stupid remarks and idiotic trolliing!

My reply was in response to someone else's suggestion that water boarding is not torture. I said it was, and based on this you attacked me, and call me a troll? In the heat of battle you have lost your ability to analyze what you read. Anger is making you stupid. I'm not going to engage with someone who can't control their emotions in a debate.

 

[edgray]

wow, some sick sick puppies on this forum. Can't believe anyone would think torture is justified in this day and age. And it's not surprising that those with religious inclinations are more likely to support torture.

So, do those who support it accept that their belief justifies the torture of their own service men?

Sick sick sick. Disgustingly sick.

 

[mazHur]

My reply was in response to someone else's suggestion that water boarding is not torture. I said it was, and based on this you attacked me, and call me a troll? In the heat of battle you have lost your ability to analyze what you read. Anger is making you stupid. I'm not going to engage with someone who can't control their emotions in a debate.

i must have misunderstood then...please do not cry and aloha to mods for succor!:thumbdown