Pro Abortion = Anti Death Penalty

[Meirionnydd]

Yes it makes a huge difference when people are yelling that innocent people are being executed.

We'll just have to agree to disagree then.

The website I just looked at says 130 have been exonerated since 1973...sounds like a couple of different statistics are being pulled out of a couple of different asses to me. *shrugs*

I think the article I used was written awhile ago or something (around 1999). Suffice to say, statistics do change over time

 

[Natasha]

Statistics DO change...a 3rd article states 88. I can agree to disagree.

 

[Makedde]

I am against assisted suicide because of all the loopholes it presents. I dont want to see terminally ill people suffer but legallising it opens the way for people bumping off relatives for their inheritance and putting pressure on them for being a burden ect.

There would be ways around it. Let the person decide for themselves, and if they cannot, a loved one can decide, provided it is proven that the person will never recover from whatever illness they suffer from.

 

[Goat Whisperer]

Depends. The article doesn't say...does he admit to setting the fire but deny that he did it to kill the little girl??? If he set the fire and the little girl died in it, then he is guilty of what we call a capital offense and, yes, he should die. If he denies even setting the fire and the state is conceding that he may not be at fault, then I'm glad they got it sorted out and I think he should OWN that county.

I just don't believe that there are hundreds of innocent people being executed all the time in a society where any smidge of reasonable doubt requires a not guilty verdict and I'll never change my mind on that one no matter what statistics you throw at me.

There is a difference between murder with intent and man slaughter.

 

[Goat Whisperer]

That's fine in theory...but the overcrowding in jails is bad enough w/o housing people for life.

We can't allow for 1/8th of the people on death row to be innocent. Maybe we should stop making things like jaywalking a felony? That might help with the 'over-crowding.' Or maybe we should stop buying them big screen tv's and make jail a hell again, so people aren't happy with going there?

 

[Goat Whisperer]

Peter--lot's of things can be changed by peer pressure. Like for instance, smoking. Kids use peer pressure to get other kids to smoke right?So we should make it illegal so they can't do that anymore?

When it comes down to it, it is your choice. An old women isn't just going to give up her life because her son tells her too. Granted, if the son made her hate her life to a point, I would call that harassment, and have THAT against the law. But as far as telling her that it is going to be painful, hard, and pointless... that's not going to FORCE her to make the decision, it will help her make it, by realizing what the natural death will be like.

Just as the first cigarette you smoke, if your friends are forcing you to smoke by surrounding you and shoving it in your face, that can be called harassment, and is illegal. But if they tell you it's fun, it is YOUR choice to try it. They helped you make the decision, but they can't be blamed. You made it.

You can't prevent everything from happening by taking away rights, because that is unconstitutional. And it won't work anyways.

The mother's son will have her son kill her, probably sending her son to prison on man slaughter charges for a few years in the process.

The teenager will still try smoking, get addicted, and end up in jail for illegal tobacco use.

 

[Natasha]

There is a difference between murder with intent and man slaughter.

Not to be rude, but DUH. BUT when you commit a felony and someone dies in the commission of that felony, that makes it a capital offense. When you set an occupied building on fire it's a reasonable possibility that someone could be hurt or killed. Maybe you didn't MEAN for them to die (you don't mean to kill someone driving drunk, either, ya know) but your actions still caused it.

As for your jaywalking example, I would LOVE for you to provide me w/ statistics on the number of people in jail on felony jaywalking charges. In eight years (EIGHT YEARS!!!) I have never once seen ANYBODY in my county arrested solely on a jaywalking charge. Jaywalking is a bullshit charge reserved for loudmouths w/ foul attitudes...it's like "failure to signal while changing lanes" tickets during high speed pursuits, LOL!!!

 

[Goat Whisperer]

Not to be rude, but DUH. BUT when you commit a felony and someone dies in the commission of that felony, that makes it a capital offense. When you set an occupied building on fire it's a reasonable possibility that someone could be hurt or killed. Maybe you didn't MEAN for them to die (you don't mean to kill someone driving drunk, either, ya know) but your actions still caused it.

Yeah, but should you be put to death for it?

Or even life in prison?

As for your jaywalking example, I would LOVE for you to provide me w/ statistics on the number of people in jail on felony jaywalking charges. In eight years (EIGHT YEARS!!!) I have never once seen ANYBODY in my county arrested solely on a jaywalking charge. Jaywalking is a bullshit charge reserved for loudmouths w/ foul attitudes...it's like "failure to signal while changing lanes" tickets during high speed pursuits, LOL!!!

lol I dunno, I just do not that it IS a felony in california and florida.

 

[Natasha]

Yeah, but should you be put to death for it?

Or even life in prison?

Umm, YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!! Have you read anything I've said??? LOL

Yes, if you burn down a building and it kills someone, you should be punished for it. It's homicide whether you meant for it to be or not.

lol I dunno, I just do not that it IS a felony in california and florida.

I don't dispute that it is a felony in some states...what I'm saying is that you'd be hard pressed to find any overcrowding problem due to jaywalking charges or b/c jail is so comfy cozy.

Oy vey...I think I've lost my mind this week or something. I never come into this section b/c I *know* what it's like. :24:

 

[Goat Whisperer]

Umm, YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!! Have you read anything I've said??? LOL

Yes, if you burn down a building and it kills someone, you should be punished for it. It's homicide whether you meant for it to be or not.

We put horrible people to death for horrible crimes. The fire was on purpose, the death was accidental. An accidental death is man slaughter, and arson in a felony.

But generally arson is 10 years and man slaughter is 10 more.

There is a huge difference between 20 years in prison and put to death.

But IMO all that man could be charged with is arson and man slaughter.

I don't dispute that it is a felony in some states...what I'm saying is that you'd be hard pressed to find any overcrowding problem due to jaywalking charges or b/c jail is so comfy cozy.

Oy vey...I think I've lost my mind this week or something. I never come into this section b/c I *know* what it's like. :24:

I think jail IS to comfy and cozy, it's comfier then a bad neighborhood with no food or electricity.

 

[Peter Parka]

Peter--lot's of things can be changed by peer pressure. Like for instance, smoking. Kids use peer pressure to get other kids to smoke right?So we should make it illegal so they can't do that anymore?

Of course you cant do that which is why I dont believe in making assisted suicide legal.

 

[Natasha]

We put horrible people to death for horrible crimes. The fire was on purpose, the death was accidental. An accidental death is man slaughter, and arson in a felony.

But generally arson is 10 years and man slaughter is 10 more.

There is a huge difference between 20 years in prison and put to death.

But IMO all that man could be charged with is arson and man slaughter.

You need to brush up on your law b/c that is NOT manslaughter. By your reasoning Tim McVeigh could've been out walking the streets in ten years if he simply "didn't mean to kill anyone." A death that occurs in the commission of a felony is what is called a capital offense. Lemme explain it this way...say you gag someone during a home invasion and, when you leave, you don't untie them. That person suffocates and dies...that is NOT manslaughter just b/c you didn't mean for them to die. To be considered manslaughter there has to be no malice intent and no premeditation of the act during which the person was killed...setting a building on fire requires both of those.

 

[SgtSpike]

I think jail IS to comfy and cozy, it's comfier then a bad neighborhood with no food or electricity.

I completely agree with you there. People in jail should be stuck in 4x4 cells that stink with nothing but concrete and a toilet, no electricity and gruel for breakfast and dinner. And the sound of dripping water constantly playing, just for good measure.

Maybe if we made jail back into the punishment it is supposed to be instead of a community house, people would think twice about committing crimes that would put them there.

 

[Peter Parka]

Got to love how people who have never set foot in a jail seem to know exactly what it's like to live in there.

 

[Makedde]

Got to love how people who have never set foot in a jail seem to know exactly what it's like to live in there.

I have been to a jail before. Haven't actually looked around at the cells, but have spoken to people serving time. It's not a nice place to be. You don't have a name. As soon as you walk through the gates you cease to be a person, you are nothing but a number, and you will be refered to that number, dehumanised, for as long as your sentence.

You go in with nothing, instead, you earn your priviledges - a television, a radio, etc. Misbehave and these are taken away. Prisoners want a television to relieve their boredom. Working for it encourages good behavior.

Most of the people I spoke to regretted their choices in life and would have made a different choice had they known where they would end up.

 

[Meirionnydd]

I completely agree with you there. People in jail should be stuck in 4x4 cells that stink with nothing but concrete and a toilet, no electricity and gruel for breakfast and dinner. And the sound of dripping water constantly playing, just for good measure.

Maybe if we made jail back into the punishment it is supposed to be instead of a community house, people would think twice about committing crimes that would put them there.

Focus solely on punishment instead of rehabilitating the prisoner and its highly likely that they are going to re-offend and be back there again.

Recidivism in the United States is over 60%, primarily because the criminal justice system there is based on deterrence and punishment of the criminal.

 

[Goat Whisperer]

You need to brush up on your law b/c that is NOT manslaughter. By your reasoning Tim McVeigh could've been out walking the streets in ten years if he simply "didn't mean to kill anyone." A death that occurs in the commission of a felony is what is called a capital offense. Lemme explain it this way...say you gag someone during a home invasion and, when you leave, you don't untie them. That person suffocates and dies...that is NOT manslaughter just b/c you didn't mean for them to die. To be considered manslaughter there has to be no malice intent and no premeditation of the act during which the person was killed...setting a building on fire requires both of those.

No it doesn't. It was premeditated ARSON not premeditated MURDER. There is a BIG difference.

Which means the death should be counted as murder in the second degree.Which is never a death sentence and rarely life.

 

[Natasha]

No it doesn't. It was premeditated ARSON not premeditated MURDER. There is a BIG difference.

Which means the death should be counted as murder in the second degree.Which is never a death sentence and rarely life.

I didn't say it was premeditated murder!!! I said that arson requires malice and aforethought and the crime of MANSLAUGHTER requires that there was NO malice and aforethought. For God's sake, pick up a law book and actually READ it sometime.

 

[All Else Failed]

I completely agree with you there. People in jail should be stuck in 4x4 cells that stink with nothing but concrete and a toilet, no electricity and gruel for breakfast and dinner. And the sound of dripping water constantly playing, just for good measure.

Maybe if we made jail back into the punishment it is supposed to be instead of a community house, people would think twice about committing crimes that would put them there.

yeah lets revert back to the living conditions of the Spanish Inquisition, fuck progress! If you seriously want this you're no better than Saddam Hussein. Something tells me you're not against torture either.


If the death penalty doesn't deter crime, bad living conditions won't either.

 

[daniellllleee]

There's a huge amount of people who get arrested after having served. It's like that all over the world, and it's simply because they become accustomed to life in prison, and once you do, it's not as awful as people like me or someone else who hasn't been to prison perceives it.

This and about abortion. If you illegalize it, you're creating huge problems. Pregnant women riding roller coasters, killing themselves, etc. Sometimes it's okay to abort a baby, but I believe it should be as soon as possible and not after the baby has had time to develop much.