New Jersey to Ban Death Penalty

[IntruderLS1]

You make it sound as though because I am against the death penalty, that I am for letting them out to wander the streets... well I'm far from that mindset. I think we should be very hard on them, I think the jails need to be rethought and some of their freedoms removed. I think that a life sentence should mean just that, a life sentence... but to put a person to death is wrong, we are behind the rest of the civilized world in that. Once he is dead, that's it, there is no turning back. You cannot reverse what you have done if he is found to be innocent later. That is something that I do not want on my hands.

I understand you don't simply want everybody set free. I tried to make that clear with the blood thirsty point.

 

[Tim]

How many things in life are absolute Tim? Some kids don't learn in school... Should school be revamped or eliminated? Some people get speeding tickets because the cop is having a bad day or is a racist... Should police forces stop issuing citations?

Obviously I don't think you believe this, but that what I feel like you are accusing me of by saying things like the blood thirsty line up there.

Our level of proof is ever moving up. I think photographic evidence, in combination of DNA would be pretty damn bullet proof.

I'm sorry, but if they found my child's semen inside of a murdered / raped girl, I would have to let him go. Would it sadden me? Of course!! Pulling on heartstrings is almost never the best way to make rational decisions.

That's my whole point... if you get a speeding ticket because a cop is having a bad day, it can be reversed. If he shot you dead, that cannot be reversed... Nothing is absolute or 100%, that's why you don't make it absolute or 100% with the penalty. Because that cannot be reversed. So tell me why they MUST die. Why do you feel the need to kill them instead of putting them away for life.

 

[Tim]

I'll ask this once again...

You support the death penalty knowing full well that with our current system there will be innocent people put to death... So how many is an acceptable number to you? Would you still feel the same if it were your child and he was innocent?

 

[IntruderLS1]

That's my whole point... if you get a speeding ticket because a cop is having a bad day, it can be reversed. If he shot you dead, that cannot be reversed... Nothing is absolute or 100%, that's why you don't make it absolute or 100% with the penalty. Because that cannot be reversed. So tell me why they MUST die. Why do you feel the need to kill them instead of putting them away for life.

Your strongest argument by far. ...

If said 99.999995% sure guilty person were 100% sure to spend the rest of his natural life behind bars that didn't have the creature comforts of modern American prison, I would be good with that.

 

[Tim]

Your strongest argument by far. ...

If said 99.999995% sure guilty person were 100% sure to spend the rest of his natural life behind bars that didn't have the creature comforts of modern American prison, I would be good with that.

And that is 100% exactly where I stand on this argument.

:clap

 

[All Else Failed]

Mmmm too much agreement, I'll think of something later.


MWAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

[GraceAbounds]

What kind of society are we bringing in here? We teach people that they can do whatever they want, say whatever they want, act however they want, and the consequences should never be more severe than the feeling of personal guilt. What the hell are we teaching our kids. It's okay to kill babies, but it's not okay to kill bad guys? It's okay to spit on a burn the flag, but it isn't okay to say the pledge of allegiance in school. It's okay to teach a kid right from wrong, but it's not okay to correct them through punishment... What a crock of spineless, aimless crap. What positive can come of this?

When you write down the reality of where some elements of society are trying to drive us, it's terrifying to read. I'd wager in fact that a solid 90% of the die hards haven't actually thought it through all the way to the end game.

How can it be right that if poor Megan's father were to lose control and take that animals life, he would receive the same punishment? (Yes, I said animal. No, I won't take it back.)

... What are we doing to ourselves as a society... **shakes head in sad frustration**

Props Scott. :clap

 

[debbie t]

mr intruder ,
to kill a child IS an abomination,but to kill anyone(even a bad guy) is also an abomination.

this is going around and around ,some say yes ,some say no,but all arguaments seem valid when read in an appropriate manner ie without hatred and revenge in mind.

as you all know im against,my reasons are here for all to see

 

[skyblue]

debbie debbie debbie........put it like this.......given that our prisons sentences are a mere slap on the wrist......a prick decides to rape an 8 year old girl.....he gets caught and gets sentenced to 5 years say....then put on the register.....this little girl is still mind fucked due to what happened to her.......when the prick gets out he starts looking again.......so he spots a potential victim........its a vicious circle.......the death penalty should be there in cases such as these

 

[debbie t]

i know skyblue i know
but

 

[All Else Failed]

debbie debbie debbie........put it like this.......given that our prisons sentences are a mere slap on the wrist......a prick decides to rape an 8 year old girl.....he gets caught and gets sentenced to 5 years say....then put on the register.....this little girl is still mind fucked due to what happened to her.......when the prick gets out he starts looking again.......so he spots a potential victim........its a vicious circle.......the death penalty should be there in cases such as these

Then the problem is with the system, and how long they sentence the criminal, is it not?

If you want to look at vicious cycles, look no further than the hypocrisy known as capital punishment.

 

[debbie t]

debbie debbie debbie........put it like this.......given that our prisons sentences are a mere slap on the wrist......a prick decides to rape an 8 year old girl.....he gets caught and gets sentenced to 5 years say....then put on the register.....this little girl is still mind fucked due to what happened to her.......when the prick gets out he starts looking again.......so he spots a potential victim........its a vicious circle.......the death penalty should be there in cases such as these

right ,i understand ,and you know i have a daughter and given the circumstances with thank god i havent,i would hurt that person so bad

but i have to love all mankind ,even the shits out there.
this may sound blase and easy ,trust me it isnt.
and if one person is sentenced to death who turned out to be innocent ,i couldnt live with that.
i am thinking of this as a rational person with intellect and not revenge,who is not at the receiving end.

may i say that grace abounds who truly understands my point of view,but is totally opposed to it has been a star and is possibly the only person who could change my mind,and may well do with her compasion and understanding of the subject(from my perspective)

fuck me!change my mind ,thats a first

 

[dt3]

If you want to look at vicious cycles, look no further than the hypocrisy known as capital punishment.

Vicious cycle? They kill someone, we kill them. End of cycle.

 

[All Else Failed]

Vicious cycle? They kill someone, we kill them. End of cycle.

Thats looking at it from a 2D perspective.


It has to do with how the power structure of a government is presented to the masses it claims to serve. "If you don't follow our laws, we will kill you. BUT DON'T KILL ANYONE!" So if someone does murder, the state then has the power to murder them back. What kind of message is being sent to the public? If its ok for the government to do it, the great arbiter or laws, why can't I?

 

[dt3]

It has to do with how the power structure of a government is presented to the masses it claims to serve.

I highly doubt anybody has ever been murdered because of that. Examples?

 

[All Else Failed]

I highly doubt anybody has ever been murdered because of that. Examples?

No, I was talking about the image the government gives off to us when they kill someone, its somehow justice, but when us little people do it, its wrong.

Of course, all murder is wrong, but to me I just don't see how its ok when the government does it too.

 

[dt3]

No, I was talking about the image the government gives off to us when they kill someone, its somehow justice, but when us little people do it, its wrong.

Of course, all murder is wrong, but to me I just don't see how its ok when the government does it too.

And how does that effect the cycle?

They kill somebody, we kill them, someone else says that's not fair?

I can live with that.

 

[All Else Failed]

You're still looking at it through a physical viewpoint. it has to do with example, and psychology it gives off to the masses.

It perpetuates it through killing. You can't end something bad with something bad and say "every thing's ok now! We solved everything by doing the same thing the criminal did, but its ok because we wear black robes!". It gives the public the idea that killing someone to solve a problem is something thats ok, therefore furthering the violence that is inherently within our justice system and society.

 

[dt3]

You're still looking at it through a physical viewpoint. it has to do with example, and psychology it gives off to the masses.

It perpetuates it through killing. You can't end something bad with something bad and say "every thing's ok now! We solved everything by doing the same thing the criminal did, but its ok because we wear black robes!". It gives the public the idea that killing someone to solve a problem is something thats ok, therefore furthering the violence that is inherently within our justice system and society.

Take the words I bolded and substitute "me". Because you can only speak for yourself. Obviously "the masses" and "the public" aren't entirely affected, because I (and many others) disagree with your statements.

 

[debbie t]

i dont disagree with his statements at all ,and if i add the me where you suggested then it confirms it even more.

cheers donny now my mind is even more mashedaaaghh:jk
god this hurts my brain