Government Repair

[Accountable]

*When it's a volunteer force, just the volunteers are dieing and for the most part, the attitude is "it's some unknown them". The general populace is detached from the people who are suffering. If you want more involvement by our citizens, institute a no-loophole draft. That will get them involved in the decision to go to war.

Dropping the magnet of military as a jobs program would be better. People join the military because it's huge even in (relative) peacetime. It takes care of your family, provides job training, guarantees employment for at least four years, pays 100% of college education ... We need to stop touting the military as a lifelong career move.

*If you believe in fiscal responsibility taxes have to pay for our wars, not credit.

Agreed.

*National service is not slavery. I think you are in the minority in this opinion.

Why? What else is it when you force someone to perform under penalty of imprisonment or death? You think tossing a little money into the mix pays off the immorality of it?
To quote a fairly smart guy I know, I don't think you have an answer for this other than objecting.

 

[Tim]

Why not just abolish the military altogether?

Meaning no standing military

 

[Minor Axis]

Dropping the magnet of military as a jobs program would be better. People join the military because it's huge even in (relative) peacetime. It takes care of your family, provides job training, guarantees employment for at least four years, pays 100% of college education ... We need to stop touting the military as a lifelong career move.

Agreed.

Why? What else is it when you force someone to perform under penalty of imprisonment or death? You think tossing a little money into the mix pays off the immorality of it?
To quote a fairly smart guy I know, I don't think you have an answer for this other than objecting.

I think you have a minority view of morality.

Why not just abolish the military altogether?

Meaning no standing military

Why? Are you stirring or serious? I admit our military is too large, too expensive, but I don't think abolishing the military is a good idea for all the reasons you know about without me having to explain it.

 

[Accountable]

Why not just abolish the military altogether?

Meaning no standing military

I like it. We still have Guard & Reserves for actual defense. At the very least we should close our bases on foreign soil.

 

[Accountable]

I think you have a minority view of morality.

Why are you afraid to think? Come on, put your opinions in writing. You might find you really don't believe what you've always accepted.

 

[Minor Axis]

Why are you afraid to think? Come on, put your opinions in writing. You might find you really don't believe what you've always accepted.

I all ready have... you've never been accused of being condescending have you.

 

[Accountable]

I all ready have.

Where? You only say you think I'm in the minority without once explaining your position.

What is your rationale that conscription is not slavery? What else is it when you force someone to perform under penalty of imprisonment or death? You think tossing a little money into the mix pays off the immorality of it?

 

[Accountable]

You've never been accused of being condescending have you.

If you could see my face you'd understand that I wasn't coming from a position of condescension but encouragement. I used to teach leadership, and it's a hard, hard thing to get people to really examine the beliefs they were raised with. The vast majority of the time the leader finds that (s)he really does believe that way, except that now (s)he knows why, and it now becomes her/his principle rather than just the way (s)he was raised.

The rest of the time it's fascinating to watch someone realize they really don't agree with the way their parents/communities raised them. The reaction is never the same, but it always results in a stronger, more confident adult.

 

[Minor Axis]

Where? You only say you think I'm in the minority without once explaining your position.

What is your rationale that conscription is not slavery? What else is it when you force someone to perform under penalty of imprisonment or death? You think tossing a little money into the mix pays off the immorality of it?

At this point I'm wondering if I should bother. You said you thought the draft was slavery. I said required National Service is not slavery. Why don't you look up the definition of "slavery" before you make a ridiculous argument?

Here is one easy one:

Slavery is a system under which people are treated as property to be bought and sold, and are forced to work.[SUP][1][/SUP] Slaves can be held against their will from the time of their capture, purchase or birth, and deprived of the right to leave, to refuse to work, or to demand compensation.

 

[darkcgi]

at one point during High School I realized I really was smarter than my parents just because of age and lack of education they had and the hard life they had
I knew I had to be me on my own as one being brand new and I made the effort count

 

[Accountable]

At this point I'm wondering if I should bother. You said you thought the draft was slavery. I said required National Service is not slavery. Why don't you look up the definition of "slavery" before you make a ridiculous argument?

Here is one easy one:

Here's a definition of slave that applies: a person entirely under the domination of some influence or person

BTW Wikipedia isn't a dictionary.

Go on and hide. I won't chase you anymore.

 

[Minor Axis]

Go on and hide. I won't chase you anymore.

I wish I could feel as superior as you do.

 

[Accountable]

I wish I could feel as superior as you do.

I don't. That's why I don't find slavery an institution to justify for my own convenience.

 

[Kyle B]

Compolsery military service is unnecessary. We have a volunteer force that meets the defensive goals of America. China also has a volunteer force. Interestingly, Russia has mandatory military service and experiences rampant hazing and draft dodging.

I can't help but to wonder if you guys are offering these extreme solutions that would never be implemented purely for the sake of debate and getting a reaction.

 

[Accountable]

I can't help but to wonder if you guys are offering these extreme solutions that would never be implemented purely for the sake of debate and getting a reaction.

Of course they'll never happen. It'd mean Washington giving up power.

eta: To be fair, several of Minor's suggestion have been floated in Congress, such as reinstating slavery, erm, the draft.

 

[Jezzebelle]

I'd also suggest that the medical coverage that Congress gets be no better than what medicare provides, they must use the same providers, and that the Reps must pay into it just like everyone else? As Reps, they should be equal to what average citizens enjoy, not above them.

I'm assuming you mean Medicaid, not Medicare? It's easy to remember like this: "Care for the elderly, Aid for the poor." Anyway, I don't know where people get this idea that Medicaid coverage is so awful and the Drs all suck. I was on Medicaid for a couple years and it was the best care I've ever had. I kept all my same Drs from my regular insurance, never ever saw a bill. And didn't have to fight with any insurance company over the phone. I had to call them once, about an ambulance bill I received from the county when my daughter almost died... they took care of it that day. I would love to have an insurance company treat me they way they treated me over that time!

 

[Accountable]

Medicaid varies by state. These guys should get medicare.

 

[Jezzebelle]

Medicaid varies by state. These guys should get medicare.

That doesn't make any sense. Medicare is for the elderly and the disabled. Medicaid is the general gov't assistant medical coverage.

 

[Minor Axis]

I'm assuming you mean Medicaid, not Medicare? It's easy to remember like this: "Care for the elderly, Aid for the poor." Anyway, I don't know where people get this idea that Medicaid coverage is so awful and the Drs all suck. I was on Medicaid for a couple years and it was the best care I've ever had. I kept all my same Drs from my regular insurance, never ever saw a bill. And didn't have to fight with any insurance company over the phone. I had to call them once, about an ambulance bill I received from the county when my daughter almost died... they took care of it that day. I would love to have an insurance company treat me they way they treated me over that time!

I admit that I don't know which coverage is better, although I do know Medicare is for 65 and older. I'm just saying that if you look at one or either of these programs, this is what our gov reps should get, not the equivalent to tri-care which military people have and is among the best coverage in the country.

 

[Accountable]

That doesn't make any sense. Medicare is for the elderly and the disabled. Medicaid is the general gov't assistant medical coverage.

If it's good enough for our elderly it's good enough for our representatives, don't ya think? It would be a simple pen stroke to include Congress and the president to Medicare's list.