Did You Serve ?

[Stone]

If you dont like the laws,,,that your problem.
I do not support condemning those that water boarded those three as they were doing their job according to law
If you want to go track em down and hang em by the nuts then go ahead.
All your fucking bitching and moaning does nothing....I didnt make the laws.

I do not support condemning.....

I believe you there......you are pro torture, afterall.

All your fucking bitching and moaning does nothing....I didnt make the laws

But you are pro torture......





.

 

[The Man]

I believe you there......you are pro torture, afterall.

But you are pro torture......





.

No pro torture here....my position
However you are if it involves you or your family and you are the one dishing out the torture.
Again you are willing to disregard the the law and torture...but condemn those that performed legal boardings...which was not torture according to law.
You have claimed I advocated legalized torture....A fallacious statement.
Torture is not legal...there is no legalized torture caveman,

Although you do approve of the use of torture for personal reasons by yourself

 

[The Man]

It could be said...You are not only a liar you are also a hypocrite.

 

[Tim]

and I will state as I am sure as I did at the other site

I don't see how it could be called torture if it is legal

maybe I am wrong but I don't believe a court or a legislature has ruled or made law outlawing it.

until then it I believe would be considered legal.

A technicality but those that know me are aware I thrive on such stuff

Torture wasn't considered legal under the Bush administration, they just changed what was considered torture so that water boarding wasn't classified under the heading of torture.

But does the AG have the power to do so when we hung Japanese soldiers for water boarding US captives? Water boarding was very clearly established as torture by US and international law. So what gives the deputy assistant attorney general the legal power to change existing law?
There are checks and balances in the US and there is nothing giving the AG power to change laws as they see fit at the time. It's not like water boarding was something new and hadn't been addressed before. There were clear laws on the books about the use of water boarding, that it WAS considered torture and that it's use can be punishable by death.

Just because the AG redefines a law doesn't make it legal. Please show me where he has this power.

 

[Stone]

No pro torture here....my position
However you are if it involves you or your family and you are the one dishing out the torture.
Again you are willing to disregard the the law and torture...but condemn those that performed legal boardings...which was not torture according to law.
You have claimed I advocated legalized torture....A fallacious statement.
Torture is not legal...there is no legalized torture caveman,

Although you do approve of the use of torture for personal reasons by yourself

No pro torture here.

You've just committed your self to it several posts ago.

However you are if it involves you or your family and you are the one dishing out the torture.

But that isn't the issue.....it's about you supporting legalized torture.

You have claimed I advocated legalized torture....A fallacious statement.
Torture is not legal...there is no legalized torture

I'm calling fallacy by way of catywompass logic


That's a pathetic dodge

 

[Stone]

It could be said...You are not only a liar you are also a hypocrite.

You've said that before

 

[Stone]

Just a thought.......at the rate this is going,
there won't be much left for John to have to..... prove.















.

 

[The Man]

Torture wasn't considered legal under the Bush administration, they just changed what was considered torture so that water boarding wasn't classified under the heading of torture.

But does the AG have the power to do so when we hung Japanese soldiers for water boarding US captives? Water boarding was very clearly established as torture by US and international law. So what gives the deputy assistant attorney general the legal power to change existing law?
There are checks and balances in the US and there is nothing giving the AG power to change laws as they see fit at the time. It's not like water boarding was something new and hadn't been addressed before. There were clear laws on the books about the use of water boarding, that it WAS considered torture and that it's use can be punishable by death.

Just because the AG redefines a law doesn't make it legal. Please show me where he has this power.

Sadly you appear to have more sense than stone and have constructed a reasonable question.

Torture wasn't considered legal under the Bush administration, they just changed what was considered torture so that water boarding wasn't classified under the heading of torture.

Possibly may have been the reason...all I know is it was legal....either by a lack of law or a law that changed while he was in office.

But does the AG have the power to do so when we hung Japanese soldiers for water boarding US captives? Water boarding was very clearly established as torture by US and international law. So what gives the deputy assistant attorney general the legal power to change existing law?

Laws change all the time....whether changed or not we follow the law.
We may not agree with all the laws but are bound to the laws at the current time and location.
By all means if they did something illegal lets prosecute.

There are checks and balances in the US and there is nothing giving the AG power to change laws as they see fit at the time.

Then perhaps these checks and balances do not work properly....I have no control over such matters.

It's not like water boarding was something new and hadn't been addressed before

Doesn't matter...times change...laws and regulations change all the time.
Next week there may have to have a mattress and a pillow...next month just a mattress.
2 meals a day....maybe 3 next year....hell maybe one.
The point is I cant condemn the guy that is only taking a prisoner one meal....if that is the current law.

There were clear laws on the books about the use of water boarding, that it WAS considered torture and that it's use can be punishable by death.

If that is the case...then lets put them to death according to law.
But I must ask tim would you condone putting those to death that did the boardings?

 

[Stone]

Sadly you appear to have more sense than stone and have constructed a reasonable question.


Possibly may have been the reason...all I know is it was legal....either by a lack of law or a law that changed while he was in office.



Laws change all the time....whether changed or not we follow the law.
We may not agree with all the laws but are bound to the laws at the current time and location.
By all means if they did something illegal lets prosecute.


Then perhaps these checks and balances do not work properly....I have no control over such matters.


Doesn't matter...times change...laws and regulations change all the time.
Next week there may have to have a mattress and a pillow...next month just a mattress.
2 meals a day....maybe 3 next year....hell maybe one.
The point is I cant condemn the guy that is only taking a prisoner one meal....if that is the current law.


If that is the case...then lets put them to death according to law.
But I must ask tim would you condone putting those to death that did the boardings?

Ask yourself.....what would a chickenhawk do?

 

[The Man]

Ask yourself.....what would a chickenhawk do?

As usual you make no sense...as a chicken hawk wouldn't be there...Tim is appearing to be the smarter one here.

 

[Stone]

Ask yourself.....what would a chickenhawk do?

Serious question.
Military Code of conduct doesn't allow waterboarding.
What would a chickenhawk do?

 

[The Man]

Just a thought.......at the rate this is going,
there won't be much left for John to have to..... prove.

.

Much has been gained....I am not a chickenhawk
You possess the character of a hypocrite and a liar....so far so good

 

[The Man]

Serious question.
Military Code of conduct doesn't allow waterboarding.
What would a chickenhawk do?

You have already openly shown that codes and laws are to be followed at your option.
The question is what would stone do

 

[Stone]

As usual you make no sense...as a chicken hawk wouldn't be there...Tim is appearing to be the smarter one here.

You've still got the issue of..... on one hand being pro torture and on the other hand denying to the forum you support torture.

As I posted long ago....you debate out of convenience and what you claim ....is oriented for positive imagery in debating.

Even at this late date, you claim both positions on torture.

TM...it's a credibility issue and you fail at it.

 

[Stone]

Much has been gained....I am not a chickenhawk
You possess the character of a hypocrite and a liar....so far so good

I am not a chickenhawk

Your word can not be trusted as I demonstrated long ago and you continue to waffle on up untill moments ago.

You possess the character of a hypocrite and a liar

This thread is about you....you made it so.
What I am is irrelevant in this thread.....only the validity of my posts are at issue....and I've easily brought out the worst in you......and as you might remember....I am quite good at that.

 

[The Man]

Stone

We know one thing for sure you advocate torture as long as you are the one doing the act.....{disregarding for law}
And condemns those that perform an act of boarding while it was legal.
Why dont you form a group stone.
You know perhaps going and torturing people that were doing their job at the current time /and at such time job was legal.
Should keep you busy...as death penalties have changed in various states throughout the years.

 

[The Man]

Can we say hypocrite and liar? mr stone
I mean after all.
You claimed I advocate legalized torture.
But wont provide the posts.
Torture isnt legal......you do not decide the laws or your own interpretation of what you think they should be.

You are not a judge

 

[The Man]

You are not a judge

And for obvious reasons.

 

[Stone]

Stone

We know one thing for sure you advocate torture as long as you are the one doing the act.....{disregarding for law}
And condemns those that perform an act of boarding while it was legal.
Why dont you form a group stone.
You know perhaps going and torturing people that were doing their job at the current time /and at such time job was legal.
Should keep you busy...as death penalties have changed in various states throughout the years.

We know one thing for sure you advocate torture as long as you are the one doing the act.....{disregarding for law}

No, the forum does not know I support violating the law.
And if anyone reads my posts at that other forum....they would realize that my position is every one should be accountable, even when circumstances dictate an illegal response as necessary.
So again, you've misrepresented a situation for your benefit.
That's debating out of convenience......exactly my claim against you.

And condemns those that perform an act of boarding while it was legal.

Indeed, because it's immoral and degrades the values system of a society.
Conversely, you argue for the destruction of social values by embracing the concept of legalizing torture.
It's what you do as a bully.

Why dont you form a group stone.
You know perhaps going and torturing people that were doing their job at the current time /and at such time job was legal.
Should keep you busy...as death penalties have changed in various states throughout the years.

Incredibly perverse logic

 

[Stone]

Can we say hypocrite and liar? mr stone
I mean after all.
You claimed I advocate legalized torture.
But wont provide the posts.
Torture isnt legal......you do not decide the laws or your own interpretation of what you think they should be.

You are not a judge

Quit whining