Alcoholics Anonymous

[Panacea]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

Couldn't the higher power also be a higher belief in yourself?

It can't be yourself. It has to be something greater than yourself because the point is to admit you are powerless to your addiction. Kind of a Jesus take the wheel thing

There's plenty of work on personal responsibility, but the higher power is necessary in these programs to help people ease the anxiety associated with recovery.

For someone like myself, I don't think there's a higher power at all concerned with my fate. For that reason, my attempts at getting involved with Al-Anon have been frustrating. I try to glean from it what I can, but I hit the wall every time. It's not that I fear I'd get sucked into religion, or that I feel resentment towards the program for that reason, but I just don't believe what is needed to believe.

I'm a small minority though, the program works for many. It's about transferring addictions in my semi-professional opinion, and being honest with yourself. That's the best any addict can do, and I relate to that having had weight issues I consider to be a form of addiction. Be honest, and find something healthy to be impulsive about!

 

[Panacea]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

It will only work if a person really wants to be there IMO, people who go to 'court ordered' AA meetings are wasting everyone's time.

I do agree with this. Court ordered participants tend to not give two shits unless their probation officer makes them track details. They just lurk around looking for signatures otherwise.

 

[Pumpkin]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

I don't know anything about AA.

But just wanted to ask something about the effectiveness...Don't people go to AA AFTER they have been to rehab. Its to help keep them clean rather than get them off it?

 

[Niamh]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

I don't know anything about AA.

But just wanted to ask something about the effectiveness...Don't people go to AA AFTER they have been to rehab. Its to help keep them clean rather than get them off it?

Yeah, I think so, most alcoholics will continue going there all their lives

 

[Panacea]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

I don't know anything about AA.

But just wanted to ask something about the effectiveness...Don't people go to AA AFTER they have been to rehab. Its to help keep them clean rather than get them off it?

A person can go to AA any time in their recovery process, the only thing that isn't tolerated is active use. Show up to a meeting high or drunk and you're likely to get the boot, depending on the group and who runs it.

Our clients go to AA meetings while in rehab, but you're right, AA is really a maintenance program, since it offers no real therapy, just moral support and structure (which is great).

 

[Alexis]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

As far as a "Higher Power" in the AA model, it doesn't have to mean God in the Biblical sense. Those who have chosen that path have gone with a God of their understanding, or nothing to do with God. It could mean another person or something the person likes. I don't understand it, but for a few people, it works.

 

[Pumpkin]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

A person can go to AA any time in their recovery process, the only thing that isn't tolerated is active use. Show up to a meeting high or drunk and you're likely to get the boot, depending on the group and who runs it.

Our clients go to AA meetings while in rehab, but you're right, AA is really a maintenance program, since it offers no real therapy, just moral support and structure (which is great).

Thanks, from a few comments in here it sounded like it was used to actually get people off it So I wasn't sure and couldn't figure out how that could possibly work

 

[Panacea]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

As far as a "Higher Power" in the AA model, it doesn't have to mean God in the Biblical sense. Those who have chosen that path have gone with a God of their understanding, or nothing to do with God. It could mean another person or something the person likes. I don't understand it, but for a few people, it works.

It doesn't have to be an Abrahamic god or any of the main gods we know of, but it does have to be a spiritual entity of some sort. Here are the 12 steps of AA. It's hard to insert NHL hockey or my boyfriend into the God slot for a lot of that. :surrender


Step 1 - We admitted we were powerless over our addiction - that our lives had become unmanageable
Step 2 - Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity
Step 3 - Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood God
Step 4 - Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves
Step 5 - Admitted to God, to ourselves and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs
Step 6 - Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character
Step 7 - Humbly asked God to remove our shortcomings
Step 8 - Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all
Step 9 - Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others
Step 10 - Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it
Step 11 - Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood God, praying only for knowledge of God's will for us and the power to carry that out
Step 12 - Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to other addicts, and to practice these principles in all our affairs

 

[Panacea]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

Thanks, from a few comments in here it sounded like it was used to actually get people off it So I wasn't sure and couldn't figure out how that could possibly work

The groups usually consist of a bunch of n00bs and a handful of veterans in long-term recovery who run the meetings. The veterans offer to be sponsors for those in new recovery, basically a support. They work the Steps using the "Big Book" in meetings, and discuss things they can all relate to.

That's a good meeting lol I have heard some meetings are just chain smoking, cruising for chicks, or even swapping drug dealer information but that's usually associated with Narcotics Anonymous. We generally don't like our clients to go to those. :eek

 

[HK]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

Thanks for posting that Pan. I knew about the 12 steps, but I had no idea that the word God appeared so many times.

It's weird, I've read books that vaguely touch on AA to various degrees and no one ever seems to mention how thoroughly based in spirituality and God it is. It's an interesting discovery. I was considering whether something like NA would be suitable for a family member but if this is their approach, he'd never keep a straight face through it.

 

[Alexis]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

It still comes down to a God of our understanding. It's an individual thing. I prefer to think of a God that is traditional, but not everyone will.

 

[HK]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

I prefer to think of a God that is traditional, but not everyone will.

I think the problem is, some people have no desire for any God, traditional or otherwise. It's probably just about conceivable for people who are on the fence, but flat-out atheists would never be happy trying to force themselves to accept something they don't even believe in could take control of their life for them.

 

[Joe the meek]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

It's probably just about conceivable for people who are on the fence, but flat-out atheists would never be happy trying to force themselves to accept something they don't even believe in could take control of their life for them.

The question would be if people who have addictions can control their own lives?

I'd highly suggest reading "Alcoholics Anonymous" for a better understanding of the program and how it came to be. You have to remember, the "program" didn't start until the early 1900's, and up until that point, people may of knew what a "drunk" was, but few had the understanding of what an "alcoholic" was.

For Peter, I'd ask why he attended AA for a week? And that is a question he has to answer honestly.

 

[Dana]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

It doesn't have to be an Abrahamic god or any of the main gods we know of, but it does have to be a spiritual entity of some sort. Here are the 12 steps of AA. It's hard to insert NHL hockey or my boyfriend into the God slot for a lot of that. :surrender


Step 1 - We admitted we were powerless over our addiction - that our lives had become unmanageable
Step 2 - Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity
Step 3 - Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood God
Step 4 - Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves
Step 5 - Admitted to God, to ourselves and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs
Step 6 - Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character
Step 7 - Humbly asked God to remove our shortcomings
Step 8 - Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all
Step 9 - Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others
Step 10 - Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it
Step 11 - Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood God, praying only for knowledge of God's will for us and the power to carry that out
Step 12 - Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to other addicts, and to practice these principles in all our affairs

Ok i change my stance that is the definition of a religious zealot. I understand why my uncle joined a Baptist church now... It didn't work but I understand. :24: No one is powerless. To be powerless just shows a weak mind state.

 

[Natasha]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

No one is powerless. To be powerless just shows a weak mind state.

I disagree...I think people are absolutely powerless against addictions.

 

[Dana]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

I disagree...I think people are absolutely powerless against addictions.

I was addicted to, food and aspartame and i dropped aspartame and overeating. Prob not the same in some eyes but aspartame is an awful awful substance. It made me shake like crazy coming off it.

 

[Natasha]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

I was addicted to, food and aspartame and i dropped aspartame and overeating. Prob not the same in some eyes but aspartame is an awful awful substance. It made me shake like crazy coming off it.

Yeah...but you didn't do it just b/c you woke up one day and said "ehh, I'm addicted"...you had health problems that forced you to, no???

 

[Dana]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

Yeah...but you didn't do it just b/c you woke up one day and said "ehh, I'm addicted"...you had health problems that forced you to, no???

yeah but just because addicts have health issues doesn't mean they always quit. Sorry I didn't mean to get into a debate.

 

[Natasha]

Re: Alcoholiocs Anonymous

yeah but just because addicts have health issues doesn't mean they always quit. Sorry I didn't mean to get into a debate.

True...but most addicts don't quit just b/c they stop liking drinking or smoking rock, LOL

 

[darkcgi]

Ive tried it
I think it keeps people drunk
and that is my honest answer
makes them feel good while they are still doing it
I say keep it around though so the not so drunks will keep the really drunks alive