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Carthage

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problem is mate ..the pattern continues if you give funds to people like the taliban ,and nice weapons to saddam in the first place..and sadly both your government and mine do this continuously

If you're referring to Reagan, I'd rather we took the risk and armed fanatics, then took any chance that would have let the USSR or it's allies survive. If it weren't for Reagan, I'd have never believed there was another solution to dealing with f**king commie b*stards then bombing them. Which is why Reagan is my hero - he did it without resorting to war.
If not Reagan - we don't fund that Taliban! Aren't we at War with them?
 
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Tim

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If you're referring to Reagan, I'd rather we took the risk and armed fanatics, then took any chance that would have let the USSR or it's allies survive. If it weren't for Reagan, I'd have never believed there was another solution to dealing with f**king commie b*stards then bombing them. Which is why Reagan is my hero - he did it without resorting to war.
If not Reagan - we don't fund that Taliban! Aren't we at War with them?

Let me guess... you are one of the cool-aid drinkers that actually believe that Reagan had something to do with the fall of the Soviet Union.

:24:
 

BadBoy@TheWheel

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If you're referring to Reagan, I'd rather we took the risk and armed fanatics, then took any chance that would have let the USSR or it's allies survive. If it weren't for Reagan, I'd have never believed there was another solution to dealing with f**king commie b*stards then bombing them. Which is why Reagan is my hero - he did it without resorting to war.
If not Reagan - we don't fund that Taliban! Aren't we at War with them?


No offense, but you weren't alive during the Regan administration. And to say that "he did it without resorting to war".

That's a little idealistic, he did it BUY funding warlords. And for your information, we did in fact fight side by side with soldiers in Afghanistan against the Soviets.;)

Regan was not a hero, he was a movie star. He was flawed in policy as well, and btw, while you are sending Christmas cards to his family this year, thank him for gutting the power of the unions here, and all but eliminating the middle class.
 

Carthage

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Let me guess... you are one of the cool-aid drinkers that actually believe that Reagan had something to do with the fall of the Soviet Union.

:24:

Reagan's dangerously approaching the level of God Appointed Prophet in my book.

Well, not really, but still - yeah, I am.
But think - he took advantage of having a reformist president and made deal after deal that kept weakening it and weakening it until it feel. If we hadn't done what Reagan did, they could have pulled through the Garbochev reforms and eventually put in another hard liner that would have undone everything Garbochev did. Reagan acted quickly enough to stop any chance of this and killed it.
Metaphorically, he beat a deathly sick man for a few hours then let him die.
 

debbie t

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so ..youre now fighting the people you put in power to remove the russians ..and all this over a piece of scrappy land which weve all been fighting over for about 170 years now...mmm?

incidentally ,a good friend of mine has just returned from afghanistan ,safe and well:nod:

oh well round and round we go :)
 

BadBoy@TheWheel

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Reagan's dangerously approaching the level of God Appointed Prophet in my book.

Well, not really, but still - yeah, I am.
But think - he took advantage of having a reformist president and made deal after deal that kept weakening it and weakening it until it feel. If we hadn't done what Reagan did, they could have pulled through the Garbochev reforms and eventually put in another hard liner that would have undone everything Garbochev did. Reagan acted quickly enough to stop any chance of this and killed it.
Metaphorically, he beat a deathly sick man for a few hours then let him die.


My God, they are raising y'all young aren't they:unsure:

You have got to be kidding me, I know for certain you are way too young to have lived through that, so you have to be reading it from somewhere.

What happened with Iran/Contra in my minds eye (having watched the congressional hearings on TV every day;)) over shadowed anything that he accomplished with the Soviets.

The Soviets fell because the system didn't work, and the people wanted to be free, not because Bedtime For Bonzo said so.
 

Carthage

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No offense, but you weren't alive during the Regan administration. And to say that "he did it without resorting to war".

That's a little idealistic, he did it BUY funding warlords. And for your information, we did in fact fight side by side with soldiers in Afghanistan against the Soviets.;)

I meant actual declared war with the bombing of Moscow and our flag entering Russian soil.

Regan was not a hero, he was a movie star. He was flawed in policy as well, and btw, while you are sending Christmas cards to his family this year, thank him for gutting the power of the unions here, and all but eliminating the middle class.

:wtf:
How was he not a hero? He managed to scrape America back up from the liberal trench of the 60's and 70's, restored some amount of a free market, helped (at least) with the fall of the USSR, restored the economy, won 2 landslide votes, reinstated conservative principles, and reinstated American Pride.
I don't agree with his labor union policies - I think that, in a Capitalist society, Unions are a REALLY good alternative to gov't intervention, but despite his flaws, he was a genius.
 

BadBoy@TheWheel

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I meant actual declared war with the bombing of Moscow and our flag entering Russian soil.



:wtf:
How was he not a hero? He managed to scrape America back up from the liberal trench of the 60's and 70's, restored some amount of a free market, helped (at least) with the fall of the USSR, restored the economy, won 2 landslide votes, reinstated conservative principles, and reinstated American Pride.
I don't agree with his labor union policies - I think that, in a Capitalist society, Unions are a REALLY good alternative to gov't intervention, but despite his flaws, he was a genius.

:24::24:

The liberal trench....You are aware that before the Civil Rights Movement, the Democrats were the Conservative party right?

I am assuming you know the true meaning of Conservative....Not the Hannity version.

OMG, the hippies wanted to bring our troops back from a war that MADE NO SENSE, they wanted to limit the influence of government in our personal lives, they wanted to allow blacks to go to public schools and drink out of the same water fountains.

What a horrible place the 60's were:smiley24:

Get a grip on yourself, seriously, and don't give me this Liberal Trench crap. Be original;)
 

NicAuf

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Personally I don't think you have to put your hand over your heart when saying the pledge to the flag or when hearing the national anthem. Just because you don't do doesn't make you any less patriotic.
 

All Else Failed

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No, but when diplomacy doesn't work, then it's really the only solution.
And yes, because a country wants to teach a kid that if he blows himself up and 50 other "unter-mensch" with him, then I think that's pretty justified.
So you want to bomb every country you don't like...
 

All Else Failed

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If you're referring to Reagan, I'd rather we took the risk and armed fanatics, then took any chance that would have let the USSR or it's allies survive. If it weren't for Reagan, I'd have never believed there was another solution to dealing with f**king commie b*stards then bombing them. Which is why Reagan is my hero - he did it without resorting to war.
If not Reagan - we don't fund that Taliban! Aren't we at War with them?
Reagan was a mass murderer.
 

debbie t

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No, but when diplomacy doesn't work, then it's really the only solution.
And yes, because a country wants to teach a kid that if he blows himself up and 50 other "unter-mensch" with him, then I think that's pretty justified.


[edit] The "Untermensch" in Nazi propaganda and policy

Nazis believed that Jews, Slavic people, Gypsies or Africans, and asocial element, as well as people with a mental or physical disability, homosexuals, criminals, prostitutes, beggars, tramps, political dissidents, and so-called morally degenerates were subhuman.
The term "Untermensch" was utilized repeatedly in writings and speeches directed against the Jews, the most notorious example being a 1935 SS publication with the title "Der Untermensch" which contains an antisemitic tirade sometimes considered to be an extract from a speech held by Heinrich Himmler. In the pamphlet The SS as an Anti-bolshevist Fighting Organization, Himmler wrote in 1936: We shall take care that never again in Germany, the heart of Europe, will the Jewish-Bolshevistic revolution of subhumans be able to be kindled either from within or through emissaries from without.[1]
Another example for using the term "Untermensch," this time in connection with anti-Soviet propaganda, is another brochure, again titled "Der Untermensch" and edited by Himmler. Published in 1942 after the start of Operation Barbarossa, it is around fifty pages long and consists for the most part of photos casting an extremely negative light on the enemy (see link below for the title page). Historian Robert Jan van Pelt writes that for the Nazis, "it was only a small step to a rhetoric pitting the European Mensch against the Soviet Untermensch, which had come to mean a Russian in the clutches of Judeo-Bolshevism."[4]
The Race and Settlement Head Office in 1942 distributed a pamphlet "The Sub-Human" to those responsible for that selection of which 3,860,995 copies were printed in German language. It was also translated into Greek, French, Dutch, Danish, Bulgarian, Hungarian and Czech and seven other languages. The pamphlet states the following:
The sub-human, that biologically seemingly complete similar creation of nature with hands, feet and a kind of brain, with eyes and a mouth, is nevertheless a completely different, dreadful creature. He is only a rough copy of a human being, with human-like facial traits but nonetheless morally and mentally lower than any animal. Within this creature there is a fearful chaos of wild, uninhibited passions, nameless destructiveness, the most primitive desires, the nakedest vulgarity. Sub-human, otherwise nothing. For all that bear a human face are not equal. Woe to him who forgets it.

This concept by RuSHA included Jews, Gypsies, and some of the Slavic peoples.[2] The Nazis acknowledged that some of sub-humans have had ancestors of Aryan-Nordic descent-such people were to be exterminated to eliminate the leadership class among "inferior races", and children if suitable racially were to be kidnapped for Germanisation.
The concept of the Slavic people being "Untermensch" in particular served the Nazis as justification for their genocidal policies and especially their aggression against Poland and the Soviet Union in order to conquer Lebensraum. Early plans of the German Reich (summarized as Generalplan Ost) envisaged the displacement, enslavement, and elimination of no less than 50 million people who were not considered fit for Germanization from territories it wanted to conquer in Eastern Europe.[3] See also Genocides in Nazi Germany and occupied Europe.


nice use of language there carthage:(
 

Sparkey Duck

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I actually have gone from thinking this was a debate, then a shit slinging match... now it seems to be actually freighting. If there are actually people being brought up believing the tripe that's on governmental sale, then we ladies and gentlemen a fucked...
 

Carthage

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[edit] The "Untermensch" in Nazi propaganda and policy

Nazis believed that Jews, Slavic people, Gypsies or Africans, and asocial element, as well as people with a mental or physical disability, homosexuals, criminals, prostitutes, beggars, tramps, political dissidents, and so-called morally degenerates were subhuman.
The term "Untermensch" was utilized repeatedly in writings and speeches directed against the Jews, the most notorious example being a 1935 SS publication with the title "Der Untermensch" which contains an antisemitic tirade sometimes considered to be an extract from a speech held by Heinrich Himmler. In the pamphlet The SS as an Anti-bolshevist Fighting Organization, Himmler wrote in 1936: We shall take care that never again in Germany, the heart of Europe, will the Jewish-Bolshevistic revolution of subhumans be able to be kindled either from within or through emissaries from without.[1]
Another example for using the term "Untermensch," this time in connection with anti-Soviet propaganda, is another brochure, again titled "Der Untermensch" and edited by Himmler. Published in 1942 after the start of Operation Barbarossa, it is around fifty pages long and consists for the most part of photos casting an extremely negative light on the enemy (see link below for the title page). Historian Robert Jan van Pelt writes that for the Nazis, "it was only a small step to a rhetoric pitting the European Mensch against the Soviet Untermensch, which had come to mean a Russian in the clutches of Judeo-Bolshevism."[4]

The Race and Settlement Head Office in 1942 distributed a pamphlet "The Sub-Human" to those responsible for that selection of which 3,860,995 copies were printed in German language. It was also translated into Greek, French, Dutch, Danish, Bulgarian, Hungarian and Czech and seven other languages. The pamphlet states the following:
The sub-human, that biologically seemingly complete similar creation of nature with hands, feet and a kind of brain, with eyes and a mouth, is nevertheless a completely different, dreadful creature. He is only a rough copy of a human being, with human-like facial traits but nonetheless morally and mentally lower than any animal. Within this creature there is a fearful chaos of wild, uninhibited passions, nameless destructiveness, the most primitive desires, the nakedest vulgarity. Sub-human, otherwise nothing. For all that bear a human face are not equal. Woe to him who forgets it.

This concept by RuSHA included Jews, Gypsies, and some of the Slavic peoples.[2] The Nazis acknowledged that some of sub-humans have had ancestors of Aryan-Nordic descent-such people were to be exterminated to eliminate the leadership class among "inferior races", and children if suitable racially were to be kidnapped for Germanisation.
The concept of the Slavic people being "Untermensch" in particular served the Nazis as justification for their genocidal policies and especially their aggression against Poland and the Soviet Union in order to conquer Lebensraum. Early plans of the German Reich (summarized as Generalplan Ost) envisaged the displacement, enslavement, and elimination of no less than 50 million people who were not considered fit for Germanization from territories it wanted to conquer in Eastern Europe.[3] See also Genocides in Nazi Germany and occupied Europe.


nice use of language there carthage:(

Who do Islamofascists hate? Jews, Gypsys, some african non-ethnic Arabs, Americans, non-Muslim Whites, non-Muslim Russians, as well as people with down syndrome, people who are women (socially deficient in their eyes), and more non-Muslims.
They are willing to commit Genocide because of that hate.

Nazis hate: Jews, gypsys, africans in general, non-ethnic germans all around, Americans, English, Rusians, as well as people who are socially deficient.
They are willing to commit genocide because of that hate.

Seems to me the only real difference is who they hate, and why. So I think the term sub-human can be used when talking about the ideas in Islamofascism as well as in Naziism.
 

debbie t

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Who do Islamofascists hate? Jews, Gypsys, some african non-ethnic Arabs, Americans, non-Muslim Whites, non-Muslim Russians, as well as people with down syndrome, people who are women (socially deficient in their eyes), and more non-Muslims.
They are willing to commit Genocide because of that hate.

Nazis hate: Jews, gypsys, africans in general, non-ethnic germans all around, Americans, English, Rusians, as well as people who are socially deficient.
They are willing to commit genocide because of that hate.

Seems to me the only real difference is who they hate, and why. So I think the term sub-human can be used when talking about the ideas in Islamofascism as well as in Naziism.


i find the term offensive due to my family history and my humanity ,which young man you show less of (humanity that is ) all the time ..you are hater and hate monger in your statements ..to quote the duck ..if you are the future then we are all fucked.
you really need to learn a little more and see the bigger picture..where on earth have you developed these views from at such an early age?
and to think that it is acceptable to use nazi terms to describe a general population you know nothing about nor understand???
 

Cotton

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Carthage you're wasting your finger strength... You're talking to someone who is proud to call themself a socialist..
 
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