Unions WIN!!

[Johnfromokc]

How were the hostess workers being fucked john

Are you really that dense TM?

 

[The Man]

Are you really that dense TM?

Explain to me john how they were being fucked.
Unfair wages?...unfair conditions?...come on John should be easy for you.

 

[Johnfromokc]

Explain to me john how they were being fucked.
Unfair wages?...unfair conditions?...come on John should be easy for you.

It's already been explained numerous times TM. You don't want to see it. You enjoy seeing working class Americans getting fucked - you are a sick, deluded little man hoping to make it into the 1%. Good luck with that.

 

[The Man]

It's already been explained numerous times TM. You don't want to see it. You enjoy seeing working class Americans getting fucked - you are a sick, deluded little man hoping to make it into the 1%. Good luck with that.

How were they getting fucked john?
They were receiving more than an appropriate wage plus benefits for the labor.
Let me ask you this john...how much should they have got?
Before you respond...remember there is only a dime an hour to play with.
Well actually less as there is building and equipment upkeep.
How much john...for you to classify them as not getting fucked?
Who are you fucking John with your high salary?
Students John...students that want to better themselves. at 100k plus a year john you make it difficult to afford tuition.
You are fucking the lower middle class with the outrageous price of your service as being a professor.
How about lets level the playing field and make a dime an hour on each student then divide that up nine ways....you know like hostess did with its workers....we will just forget building maintenance and equipment.
Yes john you are fucking people worse than hostess.....we need a union for students...to fight the price of tuition and the outrageous profits schools and professors make....its no damn wonder hostess is going under..damn college kids cant afford them after paying tuition

:tooth

 

[Francis]

lets take 18000 employees times 40 hours a week times 52 weeks in a year
this comes out to

37440000 man hours a years
These big salaries you quoted comes out to pennies averaged per hour per employee going toward these large salaries.
To be honest I would be pissed if I was making about a dime an hour off of each employee.
lets see the local grocery store make it on that.
Just goes to show...the union wants to take all and keep it within pennies an hour of folding a company.

The ceos salaries is a drop in the bucket to save the companies.
Lets give the workers another dime an hour and see if they will come back while we work for free lol.
Meanwhile all the equipment is getting older...and we really need new buildings to..if we could drop benefits a buck an hour....we could put almost 37 million a year back into the company...which may slowly start replacing buildings and equipment.


I think they made 18 to 20 bucks an hour with wage and benefits...now when you start adding the costs of those that are receiving pensions..its anybodys guess how much the stinking unions cost them.
One thing for sure if the pensions weren't there and labor costs were at about 15 bucks an hour {with benefits} .

I will just toss out a figure of 11 bucks an hour savings to stay on to low side.
This comes out to 411,840,000 bucks a year saved...enough to perhaps save and maintain the company...and lower the price of the junkfood at the same time.

The CEO money is a drop in the bucket, I doubt that, but the greater question is why did they give it to themselves during Chapter 11 filing ? I would love to get a jump in salary like that at the expense of the creditors ( those owed money ) and past workers that will lose pensions ( who did nothing wrong )..

Hostess Brands Inc. filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection Wednesday to confront burdensome debt and labor costs that the Twinkies and Wonder Bread baker says have left it fighting to compete.

Twinkies and Wonder Bread maker Hostess Brands Inc has filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection, struggling under the weight of debt and soaring labor force expenses. (Photo: Getty Images)

The privately held Irving, Texas, company's move marks the second significant court restructuring in the past several years. In a statement, Hostess said the current cost structure "is not competitive, primarily due to legacy pension and medical benefit obligations and restrictive work rules." It said it would be able to maintain operations thanks to a $75 million financing commitment from a group of lenders.
Hostess Bankruptcy Document

In bankruptcy, Hostess said it plans to continue negotiating with 12 unions to modify the collective-bargaining agreements governing the employment of its union workers, who comprise 83% of its approximately 19,000 employees.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204257504577154402317896574.html


Also you don't address the bankruptcy filing in 2004 and it's resurrection from the ashes to the company today that was the longest pull out of chapter 11 in history. Their own claims they were not ready is a sure sign they should never have come out of that unless something smelling not quite right is in play here.

When all said is done, no companies pop back working at a loss for almost 8 years, under similar name with most of the plants and same workers and products.

Personally I think they should have entered Chapter 7 not 11 if they truly are in that bad a situation, but guarantee they don't want ANYONE to see the real financial books..

But listed below are the reasons.. Bolded are the main focus reasons why most use or avoid the various Chapters..

When a business is unable to service its debt or pay its creditors, the business or its creditors can file with a federal bankruptcy court for protection under either Chapter 7 or Chapter 11.

In Chapter 7, the business ceases operations, a trustee sells all of its assets, and then distributes the proceeds to its creditors. Any residual amount is returned to the owners of the company. In Chapter 11, in most instances the debtor remains in control of its business operations as a debtor in possession, and is subject to the oversight and jurisdiction of the court.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Some contracts, known as executory contracts, may be rejected if canceling them would be financially favorable to the company and its creditors. Such contracts may include labor union contracts, supply or operating contracts (with both vendors and customers), and real estate leases. The standard feature of executory contracts is that each party to the contract has duties remaining under the contract. In the event of a rejection, the remaining parties to the contract become unsecured creditors of the debtor. For example, in some districts a contract for deed is an executory contract, while in others it is not.

In the new millennium airlines have fallen under intense scrutiny for what many see as abusing Chapter 11 Bankruptcy as a simple tool for escaping labor contracts, usually 30-35% of an airline's operating cost.[5] Every major US. airline has filed for Chapter 11 since 2002. In the space of 2 years (2002 - 2004) US. Airways filed for bankruptcy twice leaving the AFL-CIO, pilot unions and other airline employees claiming the rules of Chapter 11 have helped turn the USA into a corporatocracy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chapter_11,_Title_11,_United_States_Code

When a troubled business is badly in debt and unable to service that debt or pay its creditors, it may file (or be forced by its creditors to file) for bankruptcy in a federal court under Chapter 7. A Chapter 7 filing means that the business ceases operations unless continued by the Chapter 7 Trustee. A Chapter 7 Trustee is appointed almost immediately, with broad powers to examine the business's financial affairs. The Trustee generally sells all the assets and distributes the proceeds to the creditors. This may or may not mean that all employees will lose their jobs. When a very large company enters Chapter 7 bankruptcy, entire divisions of the company may be sold intact to other companies during the liquidation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chapter_7,_Title_11,_United_States_Code

 

[The Man]

The CEO money is a drop in the bucket, I doubt that, but the greater question is why did they give it to themselves during Chapter 11 filing ? I would love to get a jump in salary like that at the expense of the creditors ( those owed money ) and past workers that will lose pensions ( who did nothing wrong )..



http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204257504577154402317896574.html


Also you don't address the bankruptcy filing in 2004 and it's resurrection from the ashes to the company today that was the longest pull out of chapter 11 in history. Their own claims they were not ready is a sure sign they should never have come out of that unless something smelling not quite right is in play here.

When all said is done, no companies pop back working at a loss for almost 8 years, under similar name with most of the plants and same workers and products.

Personally I think they should have entered Chapter 7 not 11 if they truly are in that bad a situation, but guarantee they don't want ANYONE to see the real financial books..

But listed below are the reasons.. Bolded are the main focus reasons why most use or avoid the various Chapters..



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chapter_11,_Title_11,_United_States_Code



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chapter_7,_Title_11,_United_States_Code

I just ran the math the ceo was making 2 cents an hour per employee....thats disgusting.
The old guy was obviously hanging onto the end.
A lousy 750 thousand a year for the ceo who has 18k employees throughout several states.
That is pathetic...
Anyway....he did the raise thing before going bankrupt...well yeah you have to have a little something to live off of while the proceedings happen. ...to 2 and a quarter million I think.
Again...its pennies to such a huge company....fucking pennies and equates to much less than a dime an hour per employee.

How anyone figures 750 k with 18k plus employees to be greedy is beyond me.

The fact is they sacrificed until they could not sacrifice anymore.
All the ceo salaries added together comes to about a dime an hour per employee.
As I said prior...they could have gave it all up and gave everyone a dime raise to keep em happy...then they could live in tents.

I just ran the math on the ceo wages at the 750k per year..it comes to

0.001001602 of the wages for a year...damn him..that greedy ass.
As we can see it makes no difference...the ceo didnt bring down the company....he isnt greedy by any means.
So what brought it down.
More going out than coming in.

What do you guys want?,,,him to live in a trailer?
Still wouldn't save the company.

you still have to buy your supplies then pay people to make the stuff.
The supplies are going to be what they are going to be...cant really change that.
That leaves wages....well it appears as if 18 to 20 bucks an hour plus benefits was just to much along with whatever they were paying in pensions...I think I remember seeing about 100 or 160 million a year.
As we can see the cost is labor and pensions.
It appears to just be to much and be competitive.

 

[Johnfromokc]

Your sure use a lot of words to say nothing TM. That's quite a talent you have there.

 

[Francis]

I just ran the math the ceo was making 2 cents an hour per employee....thats disgusting.
The old guy was obviously hanging onto the end.
A lousy 750 thousand a year for the ceo who has 18k employees throughout several states.
That is pathetic...

If that was the case I should be bringing in 1 trillion a year... FUCK I need a raise..

Do you know how many CEOs have many more employees and in hard times live with much less..

What about Obama... The so called Hated guy you love to rag on so much.. He was elected fair and square and he is the boss of all the Army and Government Employees ? Should you pay him in the same fashion ?

 

[The Man]

If that was the case I should be bringing in 1 trillion a year... FUCK I need a raise..

Do you know how many CEOs have many more employees and in hard times live with much less..

What about Obama... The so called Hated guy you love to rag on so much.. He was elected fair and square and he is the boss of all the Army and Government Employees ? Should you pay him in the same fashion ?

Ok name some...name a ceo{owner} with more than 18 k employees that was writing himself a check for less then 750 k a year

As far as your self...be sure to give yourself 2 cents an hour per employee like the hostess man and see how far away u r from that trillion.
As far as Obama whatever he gets,,,its to much...its supposed to be a public service job

 

[Johnfromokc]

 

[Francis]

Ok name some...name a ceo{owner} with more than 18 k employees that was writing himself a check for less then 750 k a year

Apple‘s Steve Jobs use to have a salary of $1.00.

But if you want to read about real CEO's who understand what being in Chapter 11 is all about, read this..

http://www.forbes.com/sites/brendancoffey/2011/05/16/ceos-who-make-one-dollar-or-less-a-year/

 

[Catavenger]

Apple‘s Steve Jobs use to have a salary of $1.00.

Steve Jobs held 5.426 million shares in Apple and 138 million shares in Disney. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_much_apple_stock_odes_Steve_Jobs_have With the dividends on that he could afford the $1.00 Salary .

And no I wouldn't begrudge the dividends to Jobs (R.I.P.) because he was a man who used his brains, worked hard and made a product that people wanted.

 

[Johnfromokc]

Isn't it interesting a member of the despised 47% goes out of his way to defend the CEO class that despises him and considers him a leach?

 

[Catavenger]

Isn't it interesting a member of the despised 47%

Once again that was taken out of context. I wasn't there to here it (and neither were you John) but what I believe was said was that no matter what 47 percent would not vote Republican.

 

[Johnfromokc]

Once again that was taken out of context. I wasn't there to here it (and neither were you John) but what I believe was said was that no matter what 47 percent would not vote Republican.

I saw the video. He was disparaging people like you Cat. He was disparaging low wage workers.

 

[Johnfromokc]

As a matter of fact, this is exactly what he said:

There are 47% of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. All right, there are 47% who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. That that's an entitlement ... And they will vote for this president no matter what ... These are people who pay no income tax ... My job is not to worry about those people. I'll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives.

 

[The Man]

You need to watch the rest of the video john

 

[The Man]

One thing for sure though Obama doesnt care for 53 percent :tooth

 

[Catavenger]

One thing for sure though Obama doesnt care for 53 percent :tooth

Now that he has got the votes he needs and is staying in office I just wonder what percent Obama really does care for?

 

[Johnfromokc]

Now that he has got the votes he needs and is staying in office I just wonder what percent Obama really does care for?

100%. He even cares about you Cat. He's trying to convince Republicans to do what is right for the nation. He even cares for comprehension impaired Americans like TM.