stop using the word 'islamists'!!!!!!

[ardath]

as a form of description we often use the term 'fanatical muslim terrorist' but the fact is that the adjective 'fanatical' and the noun 'terrorist' are incompatible with the word 'muslim', just as i believe that 'far right christian fundamentalist' is completely incorrect and misleading. The word 'terrorist' works just fine, and 'nazi' would cover anyone belonging to a far right group.
let us get out of the habit of lending such extremists the justification they crave, and encourage all religions and humanists around the world to unite in their call for 'peace'.

 

[TheOriginalJames]

Islamic terrorist is easier to type than say... that crazy group of people blowing themselves up in the name of some sort of perceived deity.

 

[GraceAbounds]

as a form of description we often use the term 'fanatical muslim terrorist' but the fact is that the adjective 'fanatical' and the noun 'terrorist' are incompatible with the word 'muslim', just as i believe that 'far right christian fundamentalist' is completely incorrect and misleading. The word 'terrorist' works just fine, and 'nazi' would cover anyone belonging to a far right group.
let us get out of the habit of lending such extremists the justification they crave, and encourage all religions and humanists around the world to unite in their call for 'peace'.

Many religions and humanists DO live side by side in peace, harmony, and love with one another. More than the ones that don't.

What you are spewing is politically correct crap. I will call a spade a spade if that is what it is. Changing a few words isn't going to bring about world peace. There are things much deeper, like the HEART and MIND of men, that need to be changed for all folks to live in harmony.

The situation is much more complex than your idealistic ideology implies. So, respectfully, put that in your sophisticated pipe and smoke on that for awhile.

 

[ardath]

ok, so will try to be politically incorrect from now on!!!!
so where should we draw the line, i mean shall i now refer to you as an egotistical yank, or if you are black, an egotistical nigger!
then maybe you could return the favour by calling me a stuck up british prig!
or worse!
you know i have nothing against americans, or at least i didn't, but from now on will be returning to my british chat forum, so you can keep this forum strictly for the stars and stripes.
sorry you are so narrow minded - oh is that too politically correct for you!
right, sorrry you are so bloody rude and up yourself!!!!!:yuk

 

[GraceAbounds]

ok, so will try to be politically incorrect from now on!!!!
so where should we draw the line, i mean shall i now refer to you as an egotistical yank, or if you are black, an egotistical nigger!
then maybe you could return the favour by calling me a stuck up british prig!
or worse!
you know i have nothing against americans, or at least i didn't, but from now on will be returning to my british chat forum, so you can keep this forum strictly for the stars and stripes.
sorry you are so narrow minded - oh is that too politically correct for you!
right, sorrry you are so bloody rude and up yourself!!!!!:yuk

Calling a spade a spade is not rude. Your words are purposely insulting. You obviously fail to see a huge difference here. You are purposely being insulting and what you just spewed is hate. When I am having a logical conversation about a certain issue, there is nothing insulting about using the words Fanatical Islamic Muslim Terrorist, if that is indeed what they are. Saying that is being specific to not paint with broad strokes. So if you think that speaking the truth is rude, then I believe it is you brother that has the problem. What you are describing in your above post is not describing being politically incorrect, what you are describing is racism. I believe you have let your emotions get away from you here and have responded in an irrational manner. Don't get so angry and realize what is realistically being said to you here.

 

[ardath]

ok, so here's the background info.
i work for a victims charity in inner london, in a mainly muslim community, dealing with the victims of your so called political incorrectness. only last week a young man was blinded by a stabbing incident when passers by attacked him, shouting 'f....g muslim terrorist!' and that is not uncommon. families are afraid to leave their homes for fear of reprisals.
and i am not a brother.
happily the british forum i belong to welcomes all nationalities and we have many open minded debates and discussions.
am not sure what they would make of your comments though!

 

[AUDRAA]

Im warning you both to settle just a bit please, name calling and insulting isnt necessary to get your point across.

 

[GraceAbounds]

ok, so here's the background info.
i work for a victims charity in inner london, in a mainly muslim community, dealing with the victims of your so called political incorrectness. only last week a young man was blinded by a stabbing incident when passers by attacked him, shouting 'f....g muslim terrorist!' and that is not uncommon. families are afraid to leave their homes for fear of reprisals.

What you speak of is hate against innocent people. That is not what I am speaking of. It sounds like you are so emotionally close to the situation that it is hard for you to be objective as to what I am actually saying.

and i am not a brother.

I meant this in kindness. I am sorry you are feeling so hostile.

happily the british forum i belong to welcomes all nationalities and we have many open minded debates and discussions.
am not sure what they would make of your comments though!

No one has made you unwelcome here. If you are feeling that way, you may want to look inward for that reason. If you are implying that a Muslim would be made to feel unwelcome here or an Islamic person, I disagree with you. Now if you are wondering if a Muslim/Christian/Black/White/Islamic/Iranian - Terrorist would be unwelcome here, then you'd probably be right.

 

[GraceAbounds]

Im warning you both to settle just a bit please, name calling and insulting isnt necessary to get your point across.

I have not insulted or name called him once and nor do I intend to. But if you would like me to just discontinue this conversation with him/her I will respectfully abide by your wishes.
~Grace

 

[AUDRAA]

Im not inferring that at all Grace, lets just keep it from becoming insulting towards one another

 

[Peter Parka]

by referring to the group of people behind the most recently planned wave of terror attacks in the uk as 'islamists', we are all lending such cold blooded murderers a certain amount of justification, as if they have a religious mandate to cause untold carnage on the streets.
it is about time we dropped the all too common use of this word by the media and politicians alike and told it like is, inasmuch as these people are cold blooded murderers, in the same league as harold shipman, fred west, philip huntley, and the yorkshire ripper.
their garbled alliegance to a holy text is only to be taken as seriously as the lunatic ramblings of the man who shot john lennon outside the dakota building in new york believing him to be an imposter!
not only is the use of this word lending these people justification for their heinous acts, but giving certain far right groups the ammunition they need in their crusade against muslims.
so lets start calling a spade a spade, and not an islamic tool for digging up the dirt!

Its Ian Huntley, at least have the respect of calling the cunt of a murderer who killed two little innocent girls I knew by the cunts real name! Sorry to anyone offended by this, but I knew Holly and Jessica mad:mad

 

[icecuban]

i think we forget that every one involved here is a human being. from the murderers, to the victims, to the people who feel so passionatly, or with some sort of pride in what they say. we all seek a good ending, to whatever bloodshed or discontent. no one needs to leave to another forum, or needs to feel that one person is more knowledgable then another. To our U.K. brothers, you are well seasoned, many years of trials and tribulations, a homeland to many here, and also know the wrongs of the world. And to you, brother citizens of the U.S., others just want to know that we think globally, which is where we came from.
too much, too much, lol. the real problem to the whole situation lies in this very thread. if we as "seekers of peace" cant resolve our own issues (peace) amongst ourselves with simple words, then how do we think we can overcome the violence that lies outside our door? how can we reason with these "terrorists" if we cant reason with ourselves? if we can just find a way here and now, to agree with each other, without any sort of pride, then i think we find the key to talking to the "terrorists", lol.

 

[Maritxu]

I agree, sad that a debate brings the worse out of very good people, who normaly would just want peace. There is no point on insulting each other for a small disagreement.

 

[ardath]

actually grace, was not name calling for the sake of it but to prove a point about political correctness, and i think you will see that in order to be fair i called myself a name as well. but apologise if you took it personally which was not my intention. and yes being close to london right now you could say that i am emotionally involved, as are all londoners, especially those of a muslim persuasion, or just the wrong colour.
and no i am not muslim, i do not subscribe to any faith, and i am not a man.
my anger was justified in that by calling coldblooded murderers muslims we are then endangering a whole ethnic group. as a point in fact we never call isrealis 'fundamentalist jews' when they massacre innocent palestinians, but do call palestinians 'fundamentalist muslims', when they kill innocent isrealis, see what i mean?
oh and just for the record i got my wrists slapped too!!!!

 

[GraceAbounds]

actually grace, was not name calling for the sake of it but to prove a point about political correctness, and i think you will see that in order to be fair i called myself a name as well. but apologise if you took it personally which was not my intention. and yes being close to london right now you could say that i am emotionally involved, as are all londoners, especially those of a muslim persuasion, or just the wrong colour.
and no i am not muslim, i do not subscribe to any faith, and i am not a man.
my anger was justified in that by calling coldblooded murderers muslims we are then endangering a whole ethnic group. as a point in fact we never call isrealis 'fundamentalist jews' when they massacre innocent palestinians, but do call palestinians 'fundamentalist muslims', when they kill innocent isrealis, see what i mean?
oh and just for the record i got my wrists slapped too!!!!

I've taken nothing you've said personally as I've known that your post were emotionally driven. It is good to realize you are a woman. No wonder you said you weren't my brother! heh! Sorry sister.

I understand and agree with you on many levels, but understand that when many people are having a conversation they are simply communitcating exactly what the facts are. And that is much different than the "stabbing incident when passers by attacked him, shouting 'f....g muslim terrorist!'" that you described. And for the record, if it were to be an Israeli terrorist or a Palestinean terrorist, I would say so. We need to know where terrorists come from and what drives them so that we can study it. If it is a sect of people twisting the word of their faith, we need to study it. If a particular country tends to be a breeding ground for terrorists we need to examine the reasons why.

It is no different than studying DNA. DNA is great right? But some parts are mutated. We give it a name. We study it. We try and cure it. It does not mean that all DNA is bad.

Just because an obvious racist used the term does not equate to everyone that is using the term in conversation is also racist. This is the only point I have been trying to make here. What you are doing (i work for a victims charity in inner london, in a mainly muslim community) makes a difference.

Personally, I would encourage the Muslim community to speak out against the sect of Muslims that are fanatics/terrorists. That is what Christians do against the sect that have twisted God's Word. It is really all you can do. What else can you do besides inform people. I have plenty of friends that are not Christian or are not practicing Christians, and they are not afraid of me, thinking that I am going to kill them because they heard about some farrrrrrrrrrrrrrr right wing fundamentalist Christian that killed an abortion doctor. We speak up.

Another thing that would help would be to teach world religions in high school and not waiting for it to be taught in college, make it a mandatory course.

I've rambled long enough. Hope you see we have more in common compassion wise than you had previously thought.

 

[ardath]

am happy to see that at least we can agree to differ on certain points grace, only wish that those trying to create division in our world could to the same!
as for the warning we both got from the forum, do not think that either of us ever stooped to uneducated and vindictive jabs at one another, but merely took part in a heated debate, suggest that they should watch the uk government's discussions in the house of commons some time, now those guys would definitely end up with a warning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

 

[GraceAbounds]

They are just trying to keep the peace as well. It's a thankless job, but they do their best.

Nice talking to you and hope you will continue to post here ardath. Hope you realize that you ARE welcome here.

Blessings to you,
Grace