Should the Peoria Diocese Catholic churches forfeit their tax-exempt status?

Users who are viewing this thread

Accountable

Well-Known Member
Messages
6,962
Reaction score
1
Tokenz
0.00z
We essentially have pacs and super pacs already ..and yes that includes churches.
I haven't heard of any. I'd love to see evidence of churches making political contributions or ads.

I am against lobbying in general.
I'm for accosting a legislator in the lobby to plead your case. I'm definitely against this profession of salesmen who bribe legislators to vote their way.

Isnt that a stretch?
If threatening parishioners with eternal damnation if they vote "wrong," making political contributions and creating church-sponsored PACs are all okay, then no, I don't think it is a stretch. Would you oppose the chartering of such a political party?
 
  • 50
    Replies
  • 625
    Views
  • 0
    Participant count
    Participants list

Alien Allen

Froggy the Prick
Messages
16,633
Reaction score
22
Tokenz
1,206.36z
I haven't heard of any. I'd love to see evidence of churches making political contributions or ads.

I'm for accosting a legislator in the lobby to plead your case. I'm definitely against this profession of salesmen who bribe legislators to vote their way.


If threatening parishioners with eternal damnation if they vote "wrong," making political contributions and creating church-sponsored PACs are all okay, then no, I don't think it is a stretch. Would you oppose the chartering of such a political party?

Thus the reason why it is a fantasy to think term limits would do anything as long as staffers keep recycling and you have lobbyists.

But to keep back on topic don't you think the church has built in lobbying in reality given how the far right Christians control one party lock stock and barrel.
 

Accountable

Well-Known Member
Messages
6,962
Reaction score
1
Tokenz
0.00z
Thus the reason why it is a fantasy to think term limits would do anything as long as staffers keep recycling and you have lobbyists.

But to keep back on topic don't you think the church has built in lobbying in reality given how the far right Christians control one party lock stock and barrel.
There's a difference between voting citizens making their wishes known by phone calls, letters, and financial contributions, and a church leader doing the same thing using his position & title and the money their people donated in the name of charity. And it's a whole different thing when anyone uses their position to force other citizens to vote in a certain way.

There's no doubt in my mind that Jerry Falwell calls legislators ... or has his staff do it, more likely. When clergy use their holy pulpit as a bully pulpit, I have a problem. As I said before, special status comes with special strings. A religious organization that wants to get into politics ought to be ethical enough to give up their tax-exempt status if they're not willing to hold up their end of the bargain.
 

The Man

Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Messages
11,798
Reaction score
623
Tokenz
176.84z
I haven't heard of any. I'd love to see evidence of churches making political contributions or ads.

I'm for accosting a legislator in the lobby to plead your case. I'm definitely against this profession of salesmen who bribe legislators to vote their way.


If threatening parishioners with eternal damnation if they vote "wrong," making political contributions and creating church-sponsored PACs are all okay, then no, I don't think it is a stretch. Would you oppose the chartering of such a political party?
http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/indus.php?ind=W05++
 

The Man

Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Messages
11,798
Reaction score
623
Tokenz
176.84z
Back to the PC as it is easier

If threatening parishioners with eternal damnation if they vote "wrong," making political contributions and creating church-sponsored PACs are all okay, then no, I don't think it is a stretch. Would you oppose the chartering of such a political party?

What is different form that threat verses other threats>
Vote for X ...threat of raised taxes
Vote for Z ..threat of no gay marriage.

But from a religion standpoint.
"Life is gods will" vote accordingly.

The topic is funded abortions etc.... the religion wants to have nothing to do with.
To vote for Obama is to vote for "satin"

What gets me is people are saying its ok if he said that if they were not tax exempt..but since they are on the tit he should keep quiet.
 

Francis

Sarcasm is me :)
Messages
8,367
Reaction score
1
Tokenz
2.08z
If threatening parishioners with eternal damnation if they vote "wrong," making political contributions and creating church-sponsored PACs are all okay, then no, I don't think it is a stretch. Would you oppose the chartering of such a political party?

According to some, there is no such thing as a Threat. You will waste your time on that topic here no matter how valid the subject..
 

Stone

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,186
Reaction score
54
Tokenz
0.00z
According to some, there is no such thing as a Threat. You will waste your time on that topic here no matter how valid the subject..

And there are those that don't have a clue as to what constitutes a 'threat' and play on context to support sophistry.


There isn't anything in the Constitution that prevents a church from being involved in politics.
The issue isn't one about threats or coercion by church leaders.....it's about churches using their tax exempt status while involving themselves in elections.

The separation of church and state divorces the state from influencing the individual in religious matters, not the church from influencing the individual.

IMO.....if a church wants to play politics, it shouldn't have a tax exempt status as a religious entity.

However, this is the opening post:
I heard about this on the radio news so went online to verify. This Bishop sent this letter to all of his priests:

Peoria bishop orders Catholics to the polls | National Catholic Reporter


The separation of church and state is not law; it is tradition. Nevertheless, this letter certainly seems to go even further than the CEO's letter that caused such a fuss a few weeks ago.


Should the Peoria Diocese Catholic churches forfeit their tax-exempt status because of this letter?

From the perspective of the Catholic Church , Jenky is actually addressing the government's influence on many Catholic religious beliefs and institutions.
This is an issue of separation of church and state........the obvious intrusion of state involvement into their religious concerns.
Jenky is arguing for religious liberty:
Since the foundation of the American Republic and the adoption of the Bill of Rights, I do not think there has ever been a time more threatening to our religious liberty than the present.


Should the Peoria Diocese lose their tax exempt status on that letter?....I don't see any good argument for it in that letter.
 

Stone

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,186
Reaction score
54
Tokenz
0.00z
There's a difference between voting citizens making their wishes known by phone calls, letters, and financial contributions, and a church leader doing the same thing using his position & title and the money their people donated in the name of charity. And it's a whole different thing when anyone uses their position to force other citizens to vote in a certain way.

There's no doubt in my mind that Jerry Falwell calls legislators ... or has his staff do it, more likely. When clergy use their holy pulpit as a bully pulpit, I have a problem. As I said before, special status comes with special strings. A religious organization that wants to get into politics ought to be ethical enough to give up their tax-exempt status if they're not willing to hold up their end of the bargain.


There's a difference between voting citizens making their wishes known by phone calls, letters, and financial contributions, and a church leader doing the same thing using his position & title and the money their people donated in the name of charity. And it's a whole different thing when anyone uses their position to force other citizens to vote in a certain way.
Most of the time I would agree with you, but I think you used a wrong example to make your case.



There's no doubt in my mind that Jerry Falwell calls legislators ... or has his staff do it, more likely.
.:D

( I don't think so. He's no longer in the land of the living. ;) )
 
Last edited by a moderator:

The Man

Valued Contributor
Valued Contributor
Messages
11,798
Reaction score
623
Tokenz
176.84z
A family member went to church{christian} today then come to the house with the voter guide they handed out.
I thought of this thread immediately. I didnt ask what the preacher said but did read the voter guide
 

Stone

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,186
Reaction score
54
Tokenz
0.00z
A family member went to church{christian} today then come to the house with the voter guide they handed out.
I thought of this thread immediately. I didnt ask what the preacher said but did read the voter guide


There was a time when Catholics were seen to favor the Democrat Party.


Interesting article here on how politicians have recently been courting the church vote:
http://www.pewforum.org/PublicationPage.aspx?id=4320
 

Alien Allen

Froggy the Prick
Messages
16,633
Reaction score
22
Tokenz
1,206.36z
I could never understand how technically a person getting health care paid for by an employer is not considered income as far as tax purposes.

maybe if it had been things would not have gotten out of control as individuals would have been more aware of how bad costs were rising over the years
 

Stone

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,186
Reaction score
54
Tokenz
0.00z
Seriously if this is really what the US losses in tax money they should not, I can see why the uproar..

Tax+exemptions+in+US.jpg



Seriously if this is really what the US losses in tax money they should not, I can see why the uproar..

What is the relationship of the subject of this thread to your above post..... and 'they should not' what?
 
78,874Threads
2,185,387Messages
4,959Members
Back
Top