I do not believe in socialized medicine.

[cam elle toe]

I dont have private insurance either....and I STILL dont pay through the public health system.
If I want to go to a private hospital, or have elective surgery, or be covered for dental or whatever, THEN I would get private insurance.

People who are unemployed or on a low wage here get a health care card,....us middle of the roaders pay a small percentage to the government at tax time as a Medicare levy....but can choose to "top up" with private insurance if we like.

 

[Accountable]

How many times does it have to be stated that no one is proposing socialized medicine?

As far as doing it without breaking the nation... the CBO said that this bill will reduce the deficit by $1,300,000,000,000.00 over the next 20 years. Yes, they are most likely wrong on the numbers, but it was the best non partisan guess that could be made today.
The reconciliation bill removes those sweetheart deals.

And make no doubt about it, it IS a game of beat the clock. The insurance industry has billions of dollars they are willing to use to beat any sort of reform. The longer the debate goes on, the greater the chance they will be able to spread enough fear and lies to win.

Keep drinking that koolaid. Zero calories. No nutrition at all.

http://www.ktsa.com/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=4508546

 

[PoopaSwoof]

Keep drinking that koolaid. Zero calories. No nutrition at all.

http://www.ktsa.com/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=4508546

So, what flavor is yours?

 

[Peter Parka]

I've never in my 42 years ever encountered one single person who ever had any of these experiences.

I know PLENTY of people who choose not to go to a doctor because they SAY they "can't afford it." But usually they aren't that sick to begin with. On the other hand, I also know plenty of people who have fantastic insurance coverage and go to the doctor every time they get a sniffle and rack up thousands in insurance payments that are likely unnecessary and cost the system far too much.

Really? Because I've lost count of the amount of Americans on just this forum moaning about something they have wrong with them and the pain the're in but they couldn't afford to go to the doctors. I guess every single one of them is just a big, fat liar?

 

[Guyzerr]

Really? Because I've lost count of the amount of Americans on just this forum moaning about something they have wrong with them and the pain the're in but they couldn't afford to go to the doctors. I guess every single one of them is just a big, fat liar?

I think he was meaning if a person gave up buying the necessities of life.. ie: food, clothing etc, they could afford health care insurance.

 

[Peter Parka]

I think he was meaning if a person gave up buying the necessities of life.. ie: food, clothing etc, they could afford health care insurance.

Yeah, that makes sense, no one should complain that they cant afford health care if the're not walking around in rags and living on bread and water.

 

[PoopaSwoof]

I think he was meaning if a person gave up buying the necessities of life.. ie: food, clothing etc, they could afford health care insurance.

That would be me.

 

[Alien Allen]

If anybody thinks the garbage passed known as Obamacare is going to control costs or make health care accessible to all they are dreaming.

This was such an crisis it had to be passed at all costs yet 20 million give or take are left out in the cold.

If a decent family plan costs 10k or more and you get even half of it subsidized what fucking good is that since you don't have 5k to buy a catastrophic plan to begin with??

Thus far I heard one major manufacturer state it will cost them 500 million for the first quarter this year. That has not been met with anything but silence from the left. So I take it that it must be true. Anybody honestly think that company will just rollover and absorb it in this economy? Say good riddance to a lot of jobs.

They should have given everybody medicare and just taxed us all 15%. Including those on minimum wage. I bet more would have bought into that.

 

[Guyzerr]

I am fucking tired of all the bullshit being spewed from both sides of this arguement.
In the meantime, myself and my family cannot afford and do not currently have any health insurance coverage. We simply cant afford it.
So keep on spewing partisan bullshit at each other while my family and millions of others play russian roulette with our health vs financial survival. The current plan looks to be a government subsidy for the health insurance industry and I doubt very much if it will do a damn thing to help get us covered in any meaningful or affordable way.

What the fuck is so horrible with something like a medicare buy in option?

It amazes me that your country is so divided on this issue and I doubt you'll ever change that. I keep hearing it's not constitutional, I don't want to be forced into spending my money on something I don't need etc., etc.. Why can't they just work out a program that would be good for everyone like many other countries have done? Surely they all can't be wrong and the US being the only right one.

In my province a single person pays $56.00 per month and a family of two or more pays $106.00 for coverage. That covers the majority of issues one could face but there is private insurance on can top up if they desire. Those rates are also very affordable and usually offered through ones employer.

Sure our taxes are higher but I don't know one person that is willing to replace our current medical system for one such as yours, not one. Why? Because they know that ultimately everyone will need to use it to a major degree and they don't want it to bankrupt them.

Using myself as an example... I have had three major surgeries with extended hospital stays but because of our system I never had the worry of " how the fuck am I ever going to pay for this". I couldn't imagine the stress associated with that. Despite all the horror stories your media paints of our system I have nothing but rave reviews for it. The service has always been top notched and I'm still alive because of it.

Getting back to " everyone will need it some day " lets look at this..

My mother will be 87 this year and she needs a hip replacement. My father-in-law is 74 and he also needs a new hip. Both will be getting their new parts in the very near future and ALL the costs associated with it will be covered. That includes not only the hospital charges but the ones for their stay in a rehabilitation home. I couldn't fathom what that would cost in your country because I doubt an insurance company wouldn't write a policy for someone in that age group. The financial risks are just to high.

Us your head people and give it a chance so regular hard working people like The Family can get on with their life.

 

[Guyzerr]

They should have given everybody medicare and just taxed us all 15%. Including those on minimum wage. I bet more would have bought into that.

The well to do in your country would never allow that to happen... ever. The Golden Rule applies... " He who has the gold rules. "

 

[Guyzerr]

That would be me.

I know and that's why I said it. It's sad and I feel for you, I really do.

 

[Zorak]

From what I understand, this is about as far from socialised medicine as you can get.

Instead of taking power away from the partisan HMO's, they've been given a God given right to force everyone into buying insurance...

 

[Alien Allen]

You guys miss the point

It is a system doomed to failure so that it will lead to socialized medicine.

The democrats know it won't work and fully admit this is a first step towards a single payer

 

[Tim]

You guys miss the point

It is a system doomed to failure so that it will lead to socialized medicine.

The democrats know it won't work and fully admit this is a first step towards a single payer

I get your point and I agree with allowing everyone to buy into medicare. I would have preferred that over this bill.

The way we deal with health insurance was doomed to fail from the beginning. The second people realized that they could make a profit from basic health care, it was the beginning of the end.

 

[Alien Allen]

I get your point and I agree with allowing everyone to buy into medicare. I would have preferred that over this bill.

The way we deal with health insurance was doomed to fail from the beginning. The second people realized that they could make a profit from basic health care, it was the beginning of the end.

It was doomed when insurance became a birthright to employment in exchange for higher wages.

A good friend said 30 years ago the worst thing to happen to health care was insurance. When people get it thru their job their is no incentive to look around to see what is the best fit for you.

Some like my son would be better off with a bare bones plan like was standard Blue Cross up til the 80's. Basically it covered tests and hospitalization. You were stuck with paying for your own medicine and office visits. There is no incentive with the current system for a person to be proactive health wise nor to limit their abuse of the system going to the doctor or hospital for every minor ailment.

I am not in favor of medicare for everybody. I think that system is doomed for ruination of the country as it will bankrupt us along with social security. I however think it would be better than this pile of garbage the liberals shut shit on us with. The Swiss system is a better model that would drive down costs because people would get the policy they want based on what they can afford.

 

[Accountable]

The well to do in your country would never allow that to happen... ever. The Golden Rule applies... " He who has the gold rules. "

Here's the prize for least thought-out post. The well to do would never allow for everyone to pay 15%; instead they prefer a scheme in which only the rich are taxed. :willy_nilly:

 

[Guyzerr]

Here's the prize for least thought-out post. The well to do would never allow for everyone to pay 15%; instead they prefer a scheme in which only the rich are taxed. :willy_nilly:

Rich... well to do... same difference.

 

[Accountable]

Rich... well to do... same difference.

:24::24: 15% for everybody ... 20%+ only for the rich, same difference. :24::24::surrender

 

[Guyzerr]

:24::24: 15% for everybody ... 20%+ only for the rich, same difference. :24::24::surrender

Don't twist what he was saying. You are a teacher so I'm sure you know the difference betwix 15 & 20%. If you want to explain yourself then by all means please feel free. Other than that I'll see your 5% and raise you 3.2.

 

[Accountable]

My point was that you were claiming that the well-to-do were blocking an across-the-board tax increase, preferring the well-to-do-only tax increase instead.



Can't believe I really had to explain that.