Group Objects To Nativity Scene At Arkansas Capitol

[Mrs Behavin]

A nativity scene next to the state Capitol has caught the attention of a Wisconsin-based group that says the display violates the constitutional separation of church and state. An attorney for the Freedom From Religion Foundation is calling for Arkansas to, quote, "remove the offending symbol from the Capitol grounds and alleviate any constitutional violations," quote.

A copy of James A. Friedman's letter, addressed to Governor Beebe, was faxed to The Associated Press Monday. Matt DeCample, a spokesman for the governor, said Beebe does not agree that the nativity scene should be removed. DeCample said it is a simple and nonintrusive holiday display that's appropriate for the season.

The display just south of the Capitol includes carved wooden sculptures inside a wooden structure that is about 30 feet wide. It includes two signs on the front advertising an address where people can send contributions to the private foundation responsible for the display.

Friedman's letter cites County of Allegheny versus ACLU, a 1989 U.S. Supreme Court decision that prohibited the display of a crÇeche at a county courthouse. That display was in the center of the courthouse's front lobby. In 1993, Arkansas Attorney General Winston Bryant issued an opinion regarding nativity scenes on state property and cited the Allegheny case.

Bryant said the crucial determination in evaluating the constitutionality of a particular Christmas display is whether the display has the appearance or effect of endorsing religion.

Natasha Naragon, a spokeswoman for Arkansas Secretary of State Charlie Daniels, said there are no plans to remove the nativity display. She cited Bryant's opinion, and said that the display is on the periphery of the Capitol grounds, isn't a centerpiece of anything and isn't in the Capitol itself. She said that, for those reasons, Daniels believes it's appropriate.

Today's THV - KTHV Little Rock News Article

 

[Pudding Time]

I don't see how this is offensive. Though I do see how this goes against the constitution. Even though they have a case against this............. why? It's just some religious people celebrating their savior. Let them be.

 

[debbie t]

well christmas is about christ last time i looked.
the county(shropshire) i live in used winter festival on all documents now?????????
ramadan and eid are coinciding with christmas this year so the muslims may be gatting a bit uppity here about it

i think the world has gone bonkers

i dont understand your constitution,and you need a degree in cantonese and philoshy to unscrabble ours

 

[GraceAbounds]

Dear Children,

It has come to my attention that many of you are upset that folks are taking My name out of the season.


Maybe you've forgotten that I wasn't actually born during this time of the year. It was some of your predecessors who decided to celebrate My birthday on what was actually a time of pagan festival, although I do appreciate being remembered anytime.

How I personally feel about this celebration can probably be most easily understood by those of you who have been blessed with children and grandchildren of your own.

I don't care what you call the day. If you want to celebrate My birth, just GET ALONG AND LOVE ONE ANOTHER. ...Now, having said that...let Me go on...

If it bothers you that the town in which you live doesn't allow a scene depicting My birth, then just get rid of a couple of Santas and snowmen, and put in a small Nativity scene on your own front lawn. If all My followers did that, there wouldn't be any need for such a scene on the town square because there would be many of them all around town.

Stop worrying about the fact that people are calling the tree a holiday tree instead of a Christmas tree. It was I who made all trees; you can remember Me anytime you see any tree. Decorate a grape vine if you wish...I actually spoke of that one in a teaching, explaining who I am in relation to you and what each of our tasks were. If you have forgotten that one about the vine, look up John 15:1-8.

If you want to give Me a present in remembrance of My birth, here is my wish list; choose something from it:

1. Instead of writing protest letters objecting to the way My birthday is being celebrated, write letters of love and hope to soldiers away from home. They are terribly afraid and lonely this time of year. I know because they tell Me all the time.

2. Visit someone in a nursing home, not just during Christmas time, but all through the year. You don't have to know them personally. They just need to know that someone cares about them.

3. Instead of writing "George" complaining about the wording on the cards his staff sent out this year, why don't you write and tell him that you'll be praying for him and his family this year...then follow up. It will be nice hearing from you again.

4. Instead of giving your children a lot of gifts you can't afford and they don't need, spend time with them. Tell them the story of My birth and why I came to live with you down here. Hold them in your arms and remind them that I love them.

5. Pick someone that has hurt you in the past......and forgive him or her.

6. Did you know that someone in your town will attempt to take their own life this season because they feel so alone and hopeless? Since you don't know who that person is, try giving everyone you meet a warm smile; it could make the difference.

7. Instead of "nit-picking" about what the retailer in your town calls the holiday, be patient with the people who work there. Give them a warm smile and a kind word. Even if they aren't allowed to wish you a "Merry Christmas" ,that doesn't keep you from wishing them one. Then stop shopping there on Sunday. If the store didn't make so much money on that day, they'd close and let their employees spend the day at church and at home with their families

8. If you really want to make a difference, support a missionary -- especially one who takes My love and Good News to those who have never heard My name.

9. Here's a good one. There are individuals and whole families in your town who not only will have no "Christmas" tree, but neither will they have any presents to give or receive. If you don't know them, buy some food and a few gifts giving them to the Salvation Army or some other charity which believes in Me. They will even make the delivery for you.

10. Finally, if you want to make a statement about your belief in and loyalty to Me, then behave like a Christian. Don't do things in secret that you wouldn't do in My presence. Let people know by your actions and words that you are one of mine.

Don't forget; I am God and can take care of Myself. Just love Me and do what I have told you to do. I'll take care of all the rest. Check out the list above and get to work; time is short. I'll help you, but the ball is now in your court.

And do have a most blessed Christmas with all those whom you love...and
remember......I LOVE YOU!

JESUS

 

[debbie t]

bloody brilliant...i do love you

ive just slapped myself:jk

 

[GraceAbounds]

. . :winking: . .

 

[All Else Failed]

if its on public ground and not private, yes, it should not be put up. But hey, its Arkansas.

 

[Mrs Behavin]

if its on public ground and not private, yes, it should not be put up. But hey, its Arkansas.

what does that have to do with anything?

So are you saying that none of the public places can put up christmas decorations whatsoever? I dont see what the difference is.

 

[All Else Failed]

I was joking.

The yule tree is pretty much a universal sign that many cultures use to symbolize the NEW YEAR. It has nothing to do with religion, and therefore its ok. BUT, when you start putting blatant religious scenes on public property, which shouldn't be done, then you start to make it everyone's business, since the public isn't under one religion/culture.

 

[Mrs Behavin]

I guess just from my point of view that people out to mind their own business (Im talking about the Wisconsin people who are bringing this up). It seems as though they have nothing else better to do than to nitpick. I just think its a load of crap. But thats just my personal opinion on the matter. lol

 

[GraceAbounds]

I just think its a load of crap.

I think it is a load of crap too, but I can't let it take my focus from where the Lord wants it to be. (which isn't on a load of crap) hehe!

 

[debbie t]

:24:nice one

 

[All Else Failed]

I guess just from my point of view that people out to mind their own business (Im talking about the Wisconsin people who are bringing this up). It seems as though they have nothing else better to do than to nitpick. I just think its a load of crap. But thats just my personal opinion on the matter. lol

Well see, thing this is, if its on public property its everyone's business.

 

[Sparkler]

As Christmas is a Christian festival to begin with and its celebrated on December 25th for centuries and also the fact that Santa Claus is also christian in origins maybe those wishing to have a non denominational holiday could choose another different day in the year rather than belittling these Christmas symbols.

 

[Tim]

Sometimes I wonder what the towns people would say or do if the capitol building had a big display with an upside down pentagram for some Wiccan holiday.... would that be ok for everyone? How about an Islamic holiday setting... A Pagan alter with a bloody lamb on it???

If we don't keep church and state separated, then be prepared to accept EVERYONES religions icons and displays...

As for me, I say keep church at church where it can run free and wild and keep the government segregated from ALL religions.

 

[All Else Failed]

Christmas is not a christian holiday. The Romans simply picked the 25th of December to squash the pagan festival of [SIZE=-1]Saturnalius, to make them convert easier. Historians pretty much agree on that Christ (if he existed) was born months before, maybe in march or April.


[/SIZE]

 

[All Else Failed]

Sometimes I wonder what the towns people would say or do if the capitol building had a big display with an upside down pentagram for some Wiccan holiday.... would that be ok for everyone? How about an Islamic holiday setting... A Pagan alter with a bloody lamb on it???

If we don't keep church and state separated, then be prepared to accept EVERYONES religions icons and displays...

As for me, I say keep church at church where it can run free and wild and keep the government segregated from ALL religions.

Oh, I'm sure they would accept it with open arms!:24:

 

[Tim]

If I had a Pagan alter in my front yard with burning torches and faux sacrifices each night, I wouldn't be asked to remove it, I would be run out of town by good Christian folk...

 

[All Else Failed]

This Is A Christian Nation Tim

We Were Founded On Baby Jesus.

If You Don't Like It Then Git Owt!!!!!!111!!1

 

[debbie t]

the wedding photos i posted were at a pagan wedding,and im a christian ,so you wouldnt be run out of my town.
my baptism had more wiccans there than shropshire had ever seen.
all belief systems are relevant