English

[nova]

Thats fine, I call narrow minded Americans douchebags. So i guess its just how you look at it.

Love the tolerance your open mind is showing here. Really. :24:

I dont believe in hindering human kind. Becoming fluent in a language is not simple for everybody and the US has never made our country look like an exclusive club, its citizens seem to think it is though

I don't give a shit if its simple or hard or what. If you want to move to another country that speaks a different language its part of the process. Its a consequence of the choice you make to move that you have to deal with.

If you're unwilling or unable to deal with the difficulty, it might be in your best interest to stay put where you are.

Again, if I move to France, Germany or China, I'm going to learn French, German or Chinese before I go. If I can't learn it, I'm not going to go...

You're going to have a lot of people agreeing with you and declaring me wrong. But I do not disagree with you that we have an official language.
What the OP is stating is that the US is taking away the accommodations made for those who speak a different language or comprehending their native language better away from them.
That I dont agree with. and not personal reasons either, just dont see how we can offer such a convenience to the public and then take it away for not reasonable reason other than "This is AMERICA"

Quite simply, they never should have had that convenience to begin with. It is not up to us to spend our time and resources accomodating them. Its exactly the opposite really..

 

[itsmeJonB]

Love the tolerance your open mind is showing here. Really. :24:




I don't give a shit if its simple or hard or what. If you want to move to another country that speaks a different language its part of the process. Its a consequence of the choice you make to move that you have to deal with.

If you're unwilling or unable to deal with the difficulty, it might be in your best interest to stay put where you are.

Again, if I move to France, Germany or China, I'm going to learn French, German or Chinese before I go.

.. right, it shows so well in text, regardless.

Thats the thing, you dont give a shit.
You arent moving to France, Germany or China so you cant put yourself in someone else's shoes

 

[itsmeJonB]

Quite simply, they never should have had that convenience to begin with. It is not up to us to spend our time and resources accomodating them. Its exactly the opposite really..

Can't really agree with you. The 'convenience' you speak of is not as simple as you think so I'm just gonna leave you with your backwards mentality.

 

[nova]

.. right, it shows so well in text, regardless.

Thats the thing, you dont give a shit.
You arent moving to France, Germany or China so you cant put yourself in someone else's shoes

Damn straight I don't care how hard something is. Math is hard but if you wanna be a phsyicist, you learn math. Learning languages is hard, but if you want to change countries, you learn the langauge. If you're unwilling or unable, stay home.

So you're psychic? Know what my future plans are?

Because I can tell you right here and right now that something my wife and I have discussed is living abroad for a while in the future. Italy and Greece are at the top of the list at the moment.

I can also tell you that if we do choose to do that, I'm going to learn Italian or Greek before I go...

 

[imayoda]

You're going to have a lot of people agreeing with you and declaring me wrong. But I do not disagree with you that we have an official language.
What the OP is stating is that the US is taking away the accommodations made for those who speak a different language or comprehending their native language better away from them.
That I dont agree with. and not personal reasons either, just dont see how we can offer such a convenience to the public and then take it away for not reasonable reason other than "This is AMERICA"

I certainly empathize with those here for whom English is not a first language. I've been on the other side of the equation enough to appreciate a form in my native language in a foreign country. But it's in the countries that didn't give me that break where I really kicked my language acquisition up a notch.

By and large, my stance on an official language comes from having seen what happens after an extended period without one.

 

[NuckingFuts]

I completly agree with this. I live in a city that is about 45 mins away from Mexico. Through out the years it has become harder to go really anywhere and find someone who speaks english. I'm not saying it is impossible, but come on people this is America. Speak the language.

 

[nova]

Can't really agree with you. The 'convenience' you speak of is not as simple as you think so I'm just gonna leave you with your backwards mentality.

Thats me, backwards enough expect adults to recognize and deal with the consequences of their choices instead of bending over backwards and changing everything else for them. How could I be so backwards? :sarcasm

Since you have such an amazing grasp of this, then explain to my backwards ass the details of this complex situation would you? :24:

 

[Francis]

Speaking and writing a language are two separate topics..

It's easy for someone to say I will learn to speak the language of a country I am going to in 4 weeks.. How much do you think you will learn if your company will send you there to live for 5 to 7 years ?

It's also much easier to learn a language when you are totally immersed in it.. You have no choice but to use it and not fall back on what you know..

I have a family member who has moved from a Dutch to Spanish to English country 5 times in 20 years due to work requirements. I have visited them in each place and made an effort to learn some of the language but I will be damn if I remember what I learned back then.. 2 to 3 week stays make no real learning time frames and even my family member loses the some of the skill.

Heck most of the time I have problems with English and French that I was born and raised with..

IMO the more languages you can learn the better off you are regardless of where you live.. Man if I can add more to what I already know I won't hesitate.. All the best to me..

 

[itsmeJonB]

I guess I cant go into detail about it. I am bilingual, my mother is bilingual and her half of the family are all bilingual even though they chose not to move to the US.
I guess it just pains me to see people not take a person into consideration as a person. Sure my mom is bilingual it doesnt make her fluent. She gets by and she gets the shit end of the stick and insulted by racists and bigots even though she speaks the language better than "them there can". If I were to hand her a legal document in English and told her to read comprehend and sign it no I dont believe she could, even though she has been here almost 30 years trying her damnedest to master a language all people have deemed the hardest language to learn.
I dont take the credibility away from these people because I think I've seen the lighter spectrum rather than the negative

 

[Peter Parka]

I think your average American needs to learn English first before you impose it on the foreigners.

 

[HottyToddyChick]

Speaking and writing a language are two separate topics..

It's easy for someone to say I will learn to speak the language of a country I am going to in 4 weeks.. How much do you think you will learn if your company will send you there to live for 5 to 7 years ?

It's also much easier to learn a language when you are totally immersed in it.. You have no choice but to use it and not fall back on what you know..

I have a family member who has moved from a Dutch to Spanish to English country 5 times in 20 years due to work requirements. I have visited them in each place and made an effort to learn some of the language but I will be damn if I remember what I learned back then.. 2 to 3 week stays make no real learning time frames and even my family member loses the some of the skill.

Heck most of the time I have problems with English and French that I was born and raised with..

IMO the more languages you can learn the better off you are regardless of where you live.. Man if I can add more to what I already know I won't hesitate.. All the best to me..

That's what I was going to say. If you are forced, you're more likely to pick it up, and faster, too.

 

[Abcinthia]

English is actually a hard language to learn. Compared with other European countries and langauges (especially French where a lot of English words came from), the way we pronounce words and where we put emphasis is different.

That said if you want to live in a country, you should learn the language.

 

[Francis]

Agreed that someone should learn the language if they move to a country..

Of all those I have met here, that come from other countries, few have not tried to communicate in our official language.

OK they might not be great at it, but hey, they try.. Of course I am not a prick with them and try to help them as well so it's a two way street. Anyone made to feel inferior will of course buck the system..

Let's face it... Unless you are native american, we are all immigrants or sons of, if you look at it that way..

 

[Zorak]

Wait a minute... Aren't you the land of the free?

Aren't all people equal?

Surely then people can practice whatever language they wish, and why should anyone be excluded from the full comprehension of any legal, governmental or social documents?

Why'd you kick the King out if you don't want to accept anyone who doesn't speak his tongue :24::24:

 

[nova]

I think your average American needs to learn English first before you impose it on the foreigners.

You Brits and your "Queens English." Probably should rename our flavor Americanese or something :24:

Wait a minute... Aren't you the land of the free?

Aren't all people equal?

I don't rightly see what that has to do with anything.

Requiring english on official documents is the essence of equality under the law specifically because we're not making special considerations for any one group.

Surely then people can practice whatever language they wish, and why should anyone be excluded from the full comprehension of any legal, governmental or social documents?

Why'd you kick the King out if you don't want to accept anyone who doesn't speak his tongue :24::24:

People can choose to speak any language they want. The rest of us should not be forced to spend our time and resources accomodating their choices however.

 

[Zorak]

People can choose to speak any language they want. The rest of us should not be forced to spend our time and resources accomodating their choices however.

No of course not.

Why would you accomodate anyone different from yourself.... :thumbdown

 

[edgray]

the world is a changing place and more and more people are choosing to live in other countries. I would consider it the height of a civilised society to accommodate as many languages as possible. I don't think anyone should be forced to learn a language, and I certainly wouldn't consider it rude if they chose to not learn my language. Christ, in London there are over 300 languages spoken and the city ticks along fine.

I do however think it's in someone's best interest to learn enough to at least get by in the country they choose to live in. But when it comes to legal documents, the language in them is so bizarre and almost illegible for even native English speakers, you'd have to become fluent just to get the gist of them.

 

[nova]

No of course not.

Why would you accomodate anyone different from yourself.... :thumbdown

Yes yes, lets just go ahead and offer documents and translators for every fucking language in the world. Where's my gov't docs in Urdu, Pashtun and Swahili for fucks sake?

Why the fuck should we ever expect anyone to make the least bit of effort to integrate into our society, we should just change everything to suit them. We should accommodate them just because they're different after all. None of that silly bullshit about expecting people to take responsibility for their own choices will be tolerated.... :sarcasm

Now do you wanna come up with a real argument or do you wanna continue with the "You're just not a tolerant person" line of bullshit?

 

[Zorak]

Yes yes, lets just go ahead and offer documents and translators for every fucking language in the world. Where's my gov't docs in Urdu, Pashtun and Swahili for fucks sake?

Why the fuck should we ever expect anyone to make the least bit of effort to integrate into our society, we should just change everything to suit them. We should accommodate them just because they're different after all. None of that silly bullshit about expecting people to take responsibility for their own choices will be tolerated.... :sarcasm

Now do you wanna come up with a real argument or do you wanna continue with the "You're just not a tolerant person" line of bullshit?

Wow, wasn't hard to rattle your cage was it?

Actually, I agree. I think all governmental and offical documents for America should be written in English and English only, because I believe languages can create a partisan sundering of a population. A common tongue can help that. As long as the liberty of multilingialism still exists on an informal level.

However, having said that, I can't think of any reason as to how official documents in multiple languages infringes upon anyones liberty. Although you seem to disagree:

The rest of us should not be forced to spend our time and resources accomodating their choices however.

Sorry if you see that as 'a line of bullshit.'

 

[nova]

Wow, wasn't hard to rattle your cage was it?

Don't like your ridiculous implications being called out huh?

However, having said that, I can't think of any reason as to how official documents in multiple languages infringes upon anyones liberty. Although you seem to disagree:

Its the whole idea of the expectation that the rest of us should change how we do things to facilitate their choice not to learn English. In other words, its our responsibility to mitigate the difficulties they encounter because of that choice.

Sorry if you see that as 'a line of bullshit.'

Its your implied demonization of me thats the line of bullshit. The implication of "well he just isn't tolerant of those who are different."