CIA Destroyed Tapes Despite Order

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All Else Failed

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CIA Destroyed Tapes Despite Order - TIME



(WASHINGTON) — The Bush Administration was under court order not to discard evidence of detainee torture and abuse months before the CIA destroyed videotapes that revealed some of its harshest interrogation tactics.

Normally, that would force the government to defend itself against obstruction allegations. But the CIA may have an out: its clandestine network of overseas prisons.
While judges focused on the detention center in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, and tried to guarantee that any evidence of detainee abuse would be preserved, the CIA was performing its toughest questioning half a world away. And by the time President Bush publicly acknowledged the secret prison system, interrogation videotapes of two terrorism suspects had been destroyed.
The CIA destroyed the tapes in November 2005. That June, U.S. District Judge Henry H. Kennedy Jr. had ordered the Bush Administration to safeguard "all evidence and information regarding the torture, mistreatment, and abuse of detainees now at the United States Naval Base at Guantanamo Bay."
U.S. District Judge Gladys Kessler issued a nearly identical order that July.
At the time, that seemed to cover all detainees in U.S. custody. But Abu Zubaydah and Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri, the terrorism suspects whose interrogations were videotaped and then destroyed, weren't at Guantanamo Bay. They were prisoners that existed off the books — and apparently beyond the scope of the court's order. Attorneys say that might not matter. David H. Remes, a lawyer for Yemeni citizen Mahmoad Abdah and others, asked Kennedy this week to schedule a hearing on the issue.
Though Remes acknowledged the tapes might not be covered by Kennedy's order, he said, "It is still unlawful for the government to destroy evidence, and it had every reason to believe that these interrogation records would be relevant to pending litigation concerning our client."
In legal documents filed in January 2005, Assistant Attorney General Peter D. Keisler assured Kennedy that government officials were "well aware of their obligation not to destroy evidence that may be relevant in pending litigation."







For just that reason, officials inside and outside of the CIA advised against destroying the interrogation tapes, according to a former senior intelligence official involved in the matter who spoke on condition of anonymity because it is under investigation. Exactly who signed off on the decision is unclear, but CIA director Michael Hayden told the agency in an e-mail this week that internal reviewers found the tapes were not relevant to any court case.
Remes said that decision raises questions about whether other evidence was destroyed. Abu Zubaydah's interrogation helped lead investigators to alleged 9/11 mastermind Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and Remes said Abu Zubaydah may also have been questioned about other detainees. Such evidence might have been relevant in their court cases. "It's logical to infer that the documents were destroyed in order to obstruct any inquiry into the means by which statements were obtained," Remes said.
He stopped short, however, of accusing the government of obstruction. That's just one of the legal issues that could come up in court. A judge could also raise questions about contempt of court or spoliation, a legal term for the destruction of evidence in "pending or reasonably foreseeable litigation."
Kennedy has not scheduled a hearing on the matter and the government has not filed a response to Remes' request.
 
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debbie t

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there should be no secrets,freedom of speech goes both ways.
as for interrogation ive seen amnesties photos of stress postures used at guantanamo bay and theyre vile.you cannot take the moral high ground if you also want to behave like an arse hole
i trust amnesty international ,i dont trust the UK or UK government
 
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there should be no secrets,freedom of speech goes both ways.
as for interrogation ive seen amnesties photos of stress postures used at guantanamo bay and theyre vile.you cannot take the moral high ground if you also want to behave like an arse hole
i trust amnesty international ,i dont trust the UK or UK government

Giving out top secret information gets people killed. I want them out there protecting our interests. What harm is it to you that you didn't know there was prisons "hidden". None.

The government has every right to keep secrets.
 

debbie t

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it harms me if there are hidden prisons as amnesty international cant monitor them,i certainly wouldnt like the iraquis to have hidden prisons and torture squads...oh hang on thats why the US and the UK went in there wasnt it..to free a people from hidden prisons and death squads,and torture.the treatment of prisoners at guantanamo bay has been severly criticised by amnesty.no civilised society should have to resort to torture.
it harms me and it harms you.
here in the UK we have D notices on books and arent allowed to read them,the rest of world are allowed to read them.i dont need a nanny state,i dont need a dishonest state,i need honesty

im not proposing that we give away military secrets ,i am advocating elected governments not deceiving us.

read any of michael moores books?
 
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NightWarrior

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it harms me if there are hidden prisons as amnesty international cant monitor them,i certainly wouldnt like the iraquis to have hidden prisons and torture squads...oh hang on thats why the US and the UK went in there wasnt it..to free a people from hidden prisons and death squads,and torture.the treatment of prisoners at guantanamo bay has been severly criticised by amnesty.no civilised society should have to resort to torture.
it harms me and it harms you.
here in the UK we have D notices on books and arent allowed to read them,the rest of world are allowed to read them.i dont need a nanny state,i dont need a dishonest state,i need honesty

im not proposing that we give away military secrets ,i am advocating elected governments not deceiving us.

read any of michael moores books?

Lets clarify, the US didn't really care about the Iraqui people ;) They only cared about the oil and killing Saddam.

I wouldn't read anything Michael Moore wrote, he's a moron in my eyes.
 

debbie t

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well ,im sure my government lied to me about the reasons ie saving a people under threat and the nonexistant weapons of mass destruction,but at least theyre were good reasons even if untrue.
im pleased you admit it was for the oil shame your government hasnt had the balls to do so.
michael moore isnt a moron ,hes about the only descent commentator on US soil

i can see that if you and i were lucky enough to go to a dinner party together we would have a fabulous evening of banter and political football...i might quite enjoy it
 
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NightWarrior

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well ,im sure my government lied to me about the reasons ie saving a people under threat and the nonexistant weapons of mass destruction,but at least theyre were good reasons even if untrue.
im pleased you admit it was for the oil shame your government hasnt had the balls to do so.
michael moore isnt a moron ,hes about the only descent commentator on US soil

i can see that if you and i were lucky enough to go to a dinner party together we would have a fabulous evening of banter and political football...i might quite enjoy it

Michael Moore twists the truth to his own liking. He has everyone believing him because people want to believe in conspiracies or that our government is corrupt or whatever.
 

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corruption is a property of an entity, one that knows no low, nor knows a high.

however, government is a special entity. it has to have a public face that does mostly good, in its peoples' eyes. they have to trust the government to some extent, as well as hold it in contempt to other facets. in order to keep its face, it has to do things behind its peoples backs in order to keep the peace, so to speak. when things get leaked, which should happen to all governments, and the public does not like it, the public should do something about it, besides sitting on their laurels and ho-humming at the news.

pretty much, a government is the only entity that can have its cake and eat it too, with an unending amount of cake, provided the people allow it to continue.

granted, there are government conspiracy theorists, and there are also true stories. it happens, get over with it, and if you do not like it, go stick your thumb up your ass, or do something about it.

have a nice day!
 
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NightWarrior

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corruption is a property of an entity, one that knows no low, nor knows a high.

however, government is a special entity. it has to have a public face that does mostly good, in its peoples' eyes. they have to trust the government to some extent, as well as hold it in contempt to other facets. in order to keep its face, it has to do things behind its peoples backs in order to keep the peace, so to speak. when things get leaked, which should happen to all governments, and the public does not like it, the public should do something about it, besides sitting on their laurels and ho-humming at the news.

pretty much, a government is the only entity that can have its cake and eat it too, with an unending amount of cake, provided the people allow it to continue.

granted, there are government conspiracy theorists, and there are also true stories. it happens, get over with it, and if you do not like it, go stick your thumb up your ass, or do something about it.

have a nice day!

I was gonna tell you this. If you don't like your government, go live in Canada. They'll take everyone and anyone. You can sit on the internet and whine all day long about BS, doesn't mean your doing anything about it other than whining.
 

debbie t

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a country with a corrupt government needs to be policed by its people and removed(one good thing we can do in the UK at least-altho we do it rather ALOT)
if the american people cant police their corrupt leaders then theyll end up with a country which hitler and starlin would love to have governed,easy meat so to speak.
suggesting running off to canada,or stuffing ones digits up ones arse are peurile comments.
which resource rich country will you invade next ,dont make it poland hitler found it a little urksome.
 
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NightWarrior

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a country with a corrupt government needs to be policed by its people and removed(one good thing we can do in the UK at least-altho we do it rather ALOT)
if the american people cant police their corrupt leaders then theyll end up with a country which hitler and starlin would love to have governed,easy meat so to speak.
suggesting running off to canada,or stuffing ones digits up ones arse are peurile comments.
which resource rich country will you invade next ,dont make it poland hitler found it a little urksome.

Yours if you don't stfu with nonsense. :jk
 
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NightWarrior

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.....ok......but they were under court order NOT to discard any evidence. The CIA, like always, shit on the law.

Did you read a different article? Because they clearly stated that the evidence they discarded was evidence not part of the order. Its all word play, my friend. You have to be 100% clear on a law, which we all know is never the case. This leads to interpretation, thus a legal battle. I'm sure they will get a spanking, but honestly, what can the judge do to the CIA?
 
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