Congresswoman shot

edgray said:
So sad. But ultimately unsurprising given the language used by the likes of Palin. The US is such a divided country, and politicians like Palin play on that, demonising the other side to the point where they actually become targets. Using any kind of weapon symbolism, like the targets in Palin's leaflet, is disturbing to the extreme.

Ultimately, you've got to blame the mainstream media for giving these muppets a soap box. Someone like Palin doesn't even deserve to be anywhere except at the butt of a joke.
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The BBC gave the BNP a soap box, what happened in the election was epic, just what I was hoping was going to happen, people who were apathetic towards politics came out in their droves to oust him from his constituency where he had been elected in the European elections
 
If some crazy were to take that map literally, shouldn't he have opened fire on the entire state of Arizona?

While I agree that it's tragic, I think it's highly misguided to try and link this to her political opponents when there is no evidence to support it. Someone who is crazy enough to do this was crazy to begin with.

And let's be serious, while in hindsight it seems like the "crosshairs" are in bad taste, images like that and the uses of words like "we're targeting" - "declaring war on ___" having something or someone "in the crosshairs" ... are pretty commonly used in all of politics, by people of both sides. While I'm no fan of Sarah Palin, I wish more people would go after her political positions, and not her personally. The fact is, she's an avid outdoors person and has a TV show about outdoors and hunting. It's quite logical that she would use language like that when saying her group was "targeting the Seats in House and Senate" that they could win, and not by any means imply they wanted to cause injury to the people they were campaigning against,.
 
Don't blame it on anything but a nut acting out.

We are divided because we are sheep that keep voting in the same idiots. Then if something new and refreshing that seems to have credibility and the countries best interest at heart tries to get elected they get labeled as nuts.

When we elect people and they are held accountable by being voted out when they fuck up then maybe the elected officials will listen to people. In the meantime they just try to pander to their base and hope that enough brainless saps in the middle follow suit.

.
 
edgray said:
Accountable said:
Pray for the victims & their families, and the shooter's family. This could get really ugly if something else doesn't distract the media.
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So sad. But ultimately unsurprising given the language used by the likes of Palin.
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And there it is. Any evidence at all that this guy supported Palin in any way? <= not rhetorical

This is the same tripe ABC's This Week did. They gave a minute or two to the actual story, actually showing a close friend who said he was obsessed about the 2012 prophesies & such, then spent the rest of the hour harping about the extreme rhetoric of the right, obviously trying to convince people that there was a link where none exists.

Tried and convicted without an ounce of proof.
 
Tangerine said:
If some crazy were to take that map literally, shouldn't he have opened fire on the entire state of Arizona?

While I agree that it's tragic, I think it's highly misguided to try and link this to her political opponents when there is no evidence to support it. Someone who is crazy enough to do this was crazy to begin with.

And let's be serious, while in hindsight it seems like the "crosshairs" are in bad taste, images like that and the uses of words like "we're targeting" - "declaring war on ___" having something or someone "in the crosshairs" ... are pretty commonly used in all of politics, by people of both sides. While I'm no fan of Sarah Palin, I wish more people would go after her political positions, and not her personally. The fact is, she's an avid outdoors person and has a TV show about outdoors and hunting. It's quite logical that she would use language like that when saying her group was "targeting the Seats in House and Senate" that they could win, and not by any means imply they wanted to cause injury to the people they were campaigning against,.
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I, personally, would just like to say...that I don't think this has anything to do with Sarah Palin. Just that it seems incredibly..."coincidental" that the woman shot was on this pamphlet or whatever, with crosshairs. I'm not blaming Sarah Palin, just some person's incredibly misguided (potential) take on what she put out there. Nothing more, nothing less.
 
Accountable said:
And there it is. Any evidence at all that this guy supported Palin in any way? <= not rhetorical

This is the same tripe ABC's This Week did. They gave a minute or two to the actual story, actually showing a close friend who said he was obsessed about the 2012 prophesies & such, then spent the rest of the hour harping about the extreme rhetoric of the right, obviously trying to convince people that there was a link where none exists.

Tried and convicted without an ounce of proof.
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Time will tell I guess, we'll have to wait and find out.
 
Accountable said:
And there it is. Any evidence at all that this guy supported Palin in any way? <= not rhetorical

This is the same tripe ABC's This Week did. They gave a minute or two to the actual story, actually showing a close friend who said he was obsessed about the 2012 prophesies & such, then spent the rest of the hour harping about the extreme rhetoric of the right, obviously trying to convince people that there was a link where none exists.

Tried and convicted without an ounce of proof.
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By the way, I didn't say he was a Palin supporter. I was using her as an example of the horrendous rhetoric being used, especially by the far right, in the US.
 
edgray said:
By the way, I didn't say he was a Palin supporter. I was using her as an example of the horrendous rhetoric being used, especially by the far right, in the US.
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But, you see, this is exactly what is a major problem in the media as well.

This thread is titled "Congresswoman Shot" You are simply pointing out examples of "horrendous rhetoric, especially by the far right" and quoting Sarah Palin.

Although you did not TECHNICALLY say there was a link, just by focusing on that area in this context, you are drawing a connection between the two. No different than a newspaper headline that reads "Congresswoman shot in Head" and then going into detail about compaign rhetoric inthe article. It's reasonable to assume the writers intent is to show a connection. It's happening in widespread fashion by media around the world, and it's wrong.
 
Ironic that this woman got shot as she's a pro guns supporter. I thought the pro guns lobby claim they need their guns for protection. How comes none of them managed to shoot this guy before he killed some people. Looks like that argument fails.
 
Peter Parka said:
Ironic that this woman got shot as she's a pro guns supporter. I thought the pro guns lobby claim they need their guns for protection. How comes none of them managed to shoot this guy before he killed some people. Looks like that argument fails.
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There's more to the argument than protection.

Also, just because people are pro-gun, doesn't mean they carry their gun wherever they go.

It seems a lot of Europeans and other non-Americans on this board think that just because the US has a more relaxed gun policy, than that somehow means that everyone walks around with a gun and there are bullets flying everywhere.
 
Kyle B said:
It seems a lot of Europeans and other non-Americans on this board think that just because the US has a more relaxed gun policy, than that somehow means that everyone walks around with a gun and there are bullets flying everywhere.
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Well it's a fact that there's a hell of a lot more innocent people shot dead in the USA than most other so called civalised countries.
 
anathelia said:
I, personally, would just like to say...that I don't think this has anything to do with Sarah Palin. Just that it seems incredibly..."coincidental" that the woman shot was on this pamphlet or whatever, with crosshairs. I'm not blaming Sarah Palin, just some person's incredibly misguided (potential) take on what she put out there. Nothing more, nothing less.
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So you're not sayin' nuthin', you're just sayin'? :cool
Did the guy have that pamphlet on him or in his apartment? Did he have a list of the others named in that pamphlet?
I understand you don't think this has anything to do with Palin, but it seems incredibly ... "coincidental" that you write as if that is precisely what you think.

Tangerine said:
But, you see, this is exactly what is a major problem in the media as well.

This thread is titled "Congresswoman Shot" You are simply pointing out examples of "horrendous rhetoric, especially by the far right" and quoting Sarah Palin.

Although you did not TECHNICALLY say there was a link, just by focusing on that area in this context, you are drawing a connection between the two. No different than a newspaper headline that reads "Congresswoman shot in Head" and then going into detail about compaign rhetoric inthe article. It's reasonable to assume the writers intent is to show a connection. It's happening in widespread fashion by media around the world, and it's wrong.
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Exactly. :thumbup
 
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Accountable said:
So you're not sayin' nuthin', you're just sayin'? :cool
Did the guy have that pamphlet on him or in his apartment? Did he have a list of the others named in that pamphlet?
I understand you don't think this has anything to do with Palin, but it seems incredibly ... "coincidental" that you write as if that is precisely what you think.


Exactly. :thumbup
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Note how in my last sentence I said it was a potential misguided take? Of course I don't know what went through the guy's head. And correlation does not equal causation. Looking back on my post, I'm not entirely sure why I put coincidental in quotation marks. Because it gives a meaning I didn't mean to give off. It could be a connection, it could not be. All I can derive from the entire situation (and the dude's youtube page) is that he's more than a little crazy.
 
NuckingFuts said:
This guy was a nut, no need to analyze.
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Not all nuts shoot people. If we can figure out why this nut did then maybe we can prevent other nuts from doing likewise. If the tea party is creating a toxic political environment then the responsible thing for them to do is clean up their act. I don't think we should jump to conclusions though. Maybe it's like Peter said, give a nut a gun and what do you expect.
 
Tangerine said:
But, you see, this is exactly what is a major problem in the media as well.

This thread is titled "Congresswoman Shot" You are simply pointing out examples of "horrendous rhetoric, especially by the far right" and quoting Sarah Palin.

Although you did not TECHNICALLY say there was a link, just by focusing on that area in this context, you are drawing a connection between the two. No different than a newspaper headline that reads "Congresswoman shot in Head" and then going into detail about compaign rhetoric inthe article. It's reasonable to assume the writers intent is to show a connection. It's happening in widespread fashion by media around the world, and it's wrong.
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Of course the media isn't helping, the likes of Beck and O'Reilly and most of Fox Noise have a huge part to play in this. But the campaign rhetoric from the right has been a call to arms for the past 3 years. Not only using things like crosshairs on campaigns, but calling opposition candidates "targets" and making them out to be "evil" (the whole Hitler thing with Obama is a prime example and very typical of right wing US viewpoints.)

That all this does is create an enemy at home. And that's what the likes of Palin are guilty of. The democrats tend to not use these tactics, whilst the republicans revel in it. They have divided your country, and turned an opposing political party into a bigger evil than Al Qaida.

Look at what the Neo-cons did, or at least tried to do to Clinton. It was all out war against their very own president.
 
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