Yeah, there's absolutely nothing wrong with the US Tax system

[ClicheGuevara]

FairTax seems awesome
Keep our all pay,
Pay taxes on things we buy

I'm down if they include a luxury tax. .

 

[retro]

How is it different from a VAT (value-added tax)?

a VAT is put on top of the existing taxation system; FairTax would eliminate the entire US tax system and replace it with a modified consumption tax.

 

[Accountable]

Why so many people don't understand this very basic element of finance is hard for me to believe.

If you raise taxes on business, you are simply collecting more money from every customer who buys every piece of product or service. Period.

It's easier to hide the tax that way. If we were able to take a typical citizen's annual expenditures and lay out the manufacturing steps for each product he bought, then show how each raw item, each step, etc etc gets taxed, I think most people would be shocked at how much of our paycheck is really going to Washington. Don't forget, the manufacturer pays payroll taxes, which adds to the cost of each product.

I'm down if they include a luxury tax. .

Huh? The tax would apply to luxuries as well ... or do you mean charge an extra tax on what some politician decides is a luxury?

 

[Accountable]

a VAT is put on top of the existing taxation system; FairTax would eliminate the entire US tax system and replace it with a modified consumption tax.

So in and of itself, the Fair Tax is the same as a VAT, where the tax is figured into the price marked on the price tag? Sorry, I want the tax sticking out there stark and alone. I want to know how much the item is, and how much I'm paying in sales tax, just like it is now.

A federal sales tax is better than a federal income tax, but we'd have to repeal the 16th Amendment FIRST, rather than approving the sales tax with the promise that the income tax would stop, THEN vote in another amendment. That's a tall order. I'm all for repealing the 16th. But then we should let the states decide how much of their revenue they will grant to Washington to defend the country & handle interstate & international issues ... oh yeh, and the post office.

 

[retro]

So in and of itself, the Fair Tax is the same as a VAT, where the tax is figured into the price marked on the price tag? Sorry, I want the tax sticking out there stark and alone. I want to know how much the item is, and how much I'm paying in sales tax, just like it is now.

A federal sales tax is better than a federal income tax, but we'd have to repeal the 16th Amendment FIRST, rather than approving the sales tax with the promise that the income tax would stop, THEN vote in another amendment. That's a tall order. I'm all for repealing the 16th. But then we should let the states decide how much of their revenue they will grant to Washington to defend the country & handle interstate & international issues ... oh yeh, and the post office.

:willy_nilly:

This is why FairTax isn't a VAT... it's a consumption tax of x% (most figures say between 22-25%).... you're the one who keeps throwing the VAT concept out there. There are similarities between the two, but they're not the same.

 

[ClicheGuevara]

It's easier to hide the tax that way. If we were able to take a typical citizen's annual expenditures and lay out the manufacturing steps for each product he bought, then show how each raw item, each step, etc etc gets taxed, I think most people would be shocked at how much of our paycheck is really going to Washington. Don't forget, the manufacturer pays payroll taxes, which adds to the cost of each product.

Huh? The tax would apply to luxuries as well ... or do you mean charge an extra tax on what some politician decides is a luxury?

I think it's pretty obvious what a luxury is and yes tax them higher, You want a freakin Maserati then you should be willing to pay an extra 2% on top of the normal tax! I'm willing to pay more for my hd tv because it is a want and not a need.

 

[Alien Allen]

I think it's pretty obvious what a luxury is and yes tax them higher, You want a freakin Maserati then you should be willing to pay an extra 2% on top of the normal tax! I'm willing to pay more for my hd tv because it is a want and not a need.

They had a luxury tax on boats in MI a few years ago. The legislature and governor thought just like you that screw the rich, they can afford it.

Ask the people that sold boats how that worked out for them. Within months it was obvious the rich pay attention to what they have to pay and quit buying boats in the same numbers. The tax was rescinded shortly after its inception.

You don't need a luxury tax. The guy buying the Maserati is already paying ten times the tax on that car that you and I would be paying on a typical car.

 

[ClicheGuevara]

They had a luxury tax on boats in MI a few years ago. The legislature and governor thought just like you that screw the rich, they can afford it.

Ask the people that sold boats how that worked out for them. Within months it was obvious the rich pay attention to what they have to pay and quit buying boats in the same numbers. The tax was rescinded shortly after its inception.

You don't need a luxury tax. The guy buying the Maserati is already paying ten times the tax on that car that you and I would be paying on a typical car.

Yeah that is true, you do pay more tax the higher the item gets in price. .But it's not about fucking over rich people. It's about wants and needs to me, I want a nice tv so I will pay more for it. I need hamburger so I shouldn't pay as much for it.

 

[Minor Axis]

What about the corporations that make billions in profit and pay ZERO in federal taxes? Why don't you guys ever bring that up? What do you think it would look like if corporations started paying their fair share of tax revenue?

I agree with you too. Corporations are basing their headquarters overseas just to avoid paying taxes. This is so wrong, but typically conservatives/business folks primary goal is to maximize profits so if there is a way, there is a will. It's up to the government to prevent this from happening.

Corporations don't pay taxes even now. They just calculate them is at part of the total overhead and pass the costs onto the consumer. Um that would be us, the taxpayers.

Regulations could control that... I think.

 

[Alien Allen]

Businesses employ people even if headquartered overseas

If the tax structure was not punitive here they would not move out

I have lost every penny saved up over the last 2 years to make it thru this winter at work. You think I might have a better chance of rehiring if I could make a profit???

 

[Accountable]

:willy_nilly:

This is why FairTax isn't a VAT... it's a consumption tax of x% (most figures say between 22-25%).... you're the one who keeps throwing the VAT concept out there. There are similarities between the two, but they're not the same.

Forgive me, but I don't know which of my statements your pronoun is referring to. What is why Fair Tax isn't a VAT? I'm truly not trying to be tedious, even though it looks like it.

Yeah that is true, you do pay more tax the higher the item gets in price. .But it's not about fucking over rich people. It's about wants and needs to me, I want a nice tv so I will pay more for it. I need hamburger so I shouldn't pay as much for it.

You don't need a hamburger, you need food. Like Allen says, luxury taxes are based on jealousy not logic, and hurt the economy more than help. I want the rich to spend as much of their money as possible, putting their dollars in salesmen's pockets rather than politicians'.

I agree with you too. Corporations are basing their headquarters overseas just to avoid paying taxes. This is so wrong, but typically conservatives/business folks primary goal is to maximize profits so if there is a way, there is a will. It's up to the government to prevent this from happening.

You would force them to keep their headquarters here? How on earth would you do that?? And would you also force Mercedes or Samsung to move their corporate HQ to the states or stop doing business here? There's really no difference in the two scenarios.

Regulations could control that... I think.

Regulating margins? You know how politicians work. They'd set the margin slightly higher than the average, then the businesses who are doing well with slimmer margins will understandably raise theirs to the max. The longterm result would hurt competition and reduce quality.