Where did the cosmos come from?

[SgtSpike]

This question is mainly directed at athiests, as religious people believe that God (or gods) created the universe. But I really don't understand what athiests believe about the beginning of the universe.

There's two possibilities for the beginning of the universe. Either the cosmos has been here for eternity, or it began at some specific point. So, let's take both options, and assume there is no God.

1. The cosmos has been here for eternity.
There's a problem with this argument. We know, by the law of thermodynamics, that objects lose energy over time. They expel energy as light, heat, movement, etc. So, if you believe the universe has been here for eternity, can you go back in time for eternity and tell me what the universe looks like then? Is there an infinite supply of energy that is only now becoming finite? If we go forward to today from eternity ago, why isn't the universe completely dead? Why is there still energy left?

2. The cosmos had a beginning.
The majority of you probably believe this, maybe in the form of the big bang. I have a major problem with the big bang though, or for any universe with a beginning without a God. Before the universe was there, it was not, and there was nothing. So how did something suddenly appear out of nothing? Even the big bang theory says that the universe originated from a hot and dense mass... but where did that hot and dense mass come from?

To me, it seems much EASIER to believe in God than to believe that the universe has been here for eternity or that it suddenly appeared from nothing. So I am trying to better understand why non-believers can so easily believe something like this that cannot be easily explained...

 

[Peter Parka]

Could also ask, where did god come from?

 

[The Joker]

Use the same 2 possibilities but instead of the universe, put God as the subject.

How does that make sense?

 

[SgtSpike]

God has always been there. And he doesn't abide by the laws of thermodynamics.

But stop trying to change the subject. I want to hear from YOU what YOU believe about the beginning of the universe.

 

[Peter Parka]

God has always been there. And he doesn't abide by the laws of thermodynamics.

But stop trying to change the subject. I want to hear from YOU what YOU believe about the beginning of the universe.

If you think god is the beginning of the universe, then surely you have a plausable explanation of where he or she came from. It really isnt changing the subject at all.
I personally have no idea and am open to reasonable explanations.

 

[nursey1972]

ah hell....... we are here so why fight about how we got here, just be happy that we are! hehe

 

[PinkZebra]

The question (for me) is answered in the very first verse of the Bible.
Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth".

 

[Tim]

Look into the M-theory. I believe that this is the line of theory that will lead to the the answers we are looking for.

 

[Tim]

I heard something that was very interesting once...

If you were to take a chimpanzee and train it from birth to learn and understand calculus, after a lifetime of teaching it, would it be able to truly understand calculus? Well the answer is no, it just doesn't have the brain capacity for it. So what makes you think that man has the brain capacity to understand where we all came from? What makes you believe there is nothing beyond the law of thermodynamics as we know it?

I find it very arrogant to think that because we don't know the answer to a question that it must be God.
If you were to ask this very question 500 years ago, you would have been thought to be mad. But if you would have asked If God did not create the lightning bolt that struck that tree, then where did it come from? At the time I could not have explained to you where lightning came from, yet that was not proof of god. Just like today when you ask where the universe came from, because we don't know the answer today, it does not prove there is a god.

 

[SgtSpike]

If you think god is the beginning of the universe, then surely you have a plausable explanation of where he or she came from. It really isnt changing the subject at all.
I personally have no idea and am open to reasonable explanations.

Ok, maybe not changing the subject, but you're still not answering my question. Which is the reason I started this thread.

And God didn't "come from" anything. That would defeat the concept of eternity. Eternity means He has always been there.

 

[SgtSpike]

I heard something that was very interesting once...

If you were to take a chimpanzee and train it from birth to learn and understand calculus, after a lifetime of teaching it, would it be able to truly understand calculus? Well the answer is no, it just doesn't have the brain capacity for it. So what makes you think that man has the brain capacity to understand where we all came from? What makes you believe there is nothing beyond the law of thermodynamics as we know it?

I find it very arrogant to think that because we don't know the answer to a question that it must be God.
If you were to ask this very question 500 years ago, you would have been thought to be mad. But if you would have asked If God did not create the lightning bolt that struck that tree, then where did it come from? At the time I could not have explained to you where lightning came from, yet that was not proof of god. Just like today when you ask where the universe came from, because we don't know the answer today, it does not prove there is a god.

500 years ago, this was the question all philosophers were trying to answer. It wasn't mad to think that there was a God who created the universe - there were many more people who believed there was a God back then than there are today.

And I'm not trying to prove that there is a God here. All I am trying to do is understand how the athiests in this crowd believe that the universe came into being. Which none of you have answered yet. Seems like a simple question, and Christianity can answer it so easily, but science cannot answer it, at least that I have seen...

 

[dt3]

Seems like a simple question, and Christianity can answer it so easily, but science cannot answer it, at least that I have seen...

Anybody can answer a question. Proving it is the problem. You cannot prove god created everything. If you held religion to the same standard of proof you seek from science, you'd see that neither has a conclusive answer.

 

[GuesSAngel]

I heard something that was very interesting once...

If you were to take a chimpanzee and train it from birth to learn and understand calculus, after a lifetime of teaching it, would it be able to truly understand calculus? Well the answer is no, it just doesn't have the brain capacity for it. So what makes you think that man has the brain capacity to understand where we all came from? What makes you believe there is nothing beyond the law of thermodynamics as we know it?

I find it very arrogant to think that because we don't know the answer to a question that it must be God.
If you were to ask this very question 500 years ago, you would have been thought to be mad. But if you would have asked If God did not create the lightning bolt that struck that tree, then where did it come from? At the time I could not have explained to you where lightning came from, yet that was not proof of god. Just like today when you ask where the universe came from, because we don't know the answer today, it does not prove there is a god.

me likey this answer

 

[dt3]

me likey this answer

You're biased

 

[Tim]

500 years ago, this was the question all philosophers were trying to answer. It wasn't mad to think that there was a God who created the universe - there were many more people who believed there was a God back then than there are today.

And I'm not trying to prove that there is a God here. All I am trying to do is understand how the athiests in this crowd believe that the universe came into being. Which none of you have answered yet. Seems like a simple question, and Christianity can answer it so easily, but science cannot answer it, at least that I have seen...

well apparently you didn't read my entire post, or maybe you didn't understand it. But we as a species are still trying to figure out where the universe originated. It is still beyond our science/comprehension, but with all science we are getting closer every day to figuring it all out. But just because there is no answer today, does not mean that it's proof of a god.

We are making huge leaps in knowledge every day and with this knowledge we will be able to unlock the mysteries of the universe... eventually.

And if you look into the 11 dimensions of space and the membrane or M-theory, you will see that it's theorized that the big bang was actually a result of these membranes/dimensions colliding together creating our little slice of heaven (our universe). This is still very young science yet very exciting science since several different fields of science converged on this theory using different calculations. I seriously suggest reading up on it, it's pretty interesting stuff.

 

[The Joker]

Ok, maybe not changing the subject, but you're still not answering my question. Which is the reason I started this thread.

And God didn't "come from" anything. That would defeat the concept of eternity. Eternity means He has always been there.

At some time or another, he would have had to START being there.

Think about it.

He cant have just always been there, he would have had to have come into existance, when you think about it, do you get a weird confusing feeling like me?

It just means we don't know, and won't ever know while we are alive.

And I for one don't want to judge my life by something that's written in a BOOK.

 

[SgtSpike]

Anybody can answer a question. Proving it is the problem. You cannot prove god created everything. If you held religion to the same standard of proof you seek from science, you'd see that neither has a conclusive answer.

I never said I could prove religion. All I'm asking is how did the universe come into being, if not from God?

 

[GuesSAngel]

You're biased

don't make me bring out the boyfriend card on you...*cough*james*cough*

 

[SgtSpike]

well apparently you didn't read my entire post, or maybe you didn't understand it. But we as a species are still trying to figure out where the universe originated. It is still beyond our science/comprehension, but with all science we are getting closer every day to figuring it all out. But just because there is no answer today, does not mean that it's proof of a god.

We are making huge leaps in knowledge every day and with this knowledge we will be able to unlock the mysteries of the universe... eventually.

And if you look into the 11 dimensions of space and the membrane or M-theory, you will see that it's theorized that the big bang was actually a result of these membranes/dimensions colliding together creating our little slice of heaven (our universe). This is still very young science yet very exciting science since several different fields of science converged on this theory using different calculations. I seriously suggest reading up on it, it's pretty interesting stuff.

So you don't have an answer then? What do you personally believe? Or do you just not know/care at this point?

I will take a look at the M-theory.

 

[SgtSpike]

At some time or another, he would have had to START being there.

Think about it.

He cant have just always been there, he would have had to have come into existance, when you think about it, do you get a weird confusing feeling like me?

It just means we don't know, and won't ever know while we are alive.

And I for one don't want to judge my life by something that's written in a BOOK.

Eternity or infinity is hard for us to grasp, yes, but I think it is much easier to say that there is a God who has always been here than to say there is a universe that has always been here.