To Vote Or Not To Vote?

[Peter Parka]

What's your opinion on this? Its not compulsery to vote here but I know it is in some countries like Australia. I know this is impractical but it's a shame people can't be tested on their political knowledge before they are allowed to vote, I really think a lot of stupid people are responsible for the fucked up leaders we keep getting. Personally I see it as my duty to vote. If you don't vote I don't see why you should bitch about the government you get, Thoughts?

 

[memento_mori]

i didnt vote for the last local election because i didnt have the time to look into where politicians stood and i didnt know enough about the issues.

but i absolutely think people should study the issues and make an informed choice on who to put in government. the more opinions we get the better picture of who we want in office.

and you better believe i'll be voting for someone in '08.

 

[All Else Failed]

A free person's most important right above all else is the right to vote. Now, if a person does not know the candidates well enough, or they are just so disgusted by the selection of candidates, I think they should reserve the right not to cast their ballot for the lesser or evils since the lesser of evils is still an "evil".

 

[sharpies]

I think it's great that in Australia it is compulsory, but even if it wasn't I would still vote. There are two main reasons:
- a lot of people died fighting so that many countries around the world have the right to choose who governs them. There are so many countries that don't have that right & many people still fighting for it. I cannot believe that so many people couldn't give a shit & give up their hard fought right to democracy.
- if you let everyone else vote but don't cast your vote then it is possible that some minority may win. Imagine if most people decide not to vote but all the Ku Klux Klan band together & vote along with their friends, you could find yourself living in a very nasty place. This may be true for any minority group crazy christians, terrorist moslems, nazi skinheads, lawyers... etc.

Allan

 

[memento_mori]

agreed

 

[SilentSinz]

i vote only cause i work for the state, thought and for raises, and what happens in my department its important to know who your voting for and what there about. Im very envovled in voting and writin gmy senators and reps.....and i totaly agree vote or dont vote i dont care but when it comes down to bitching about how things are run dont you dare open your mouth to me if you didnt vote!

 

[dt3]

I agree, if you don't vote, don't complain. Personally, I like playing my own little part in our democracy. McCain-Giuliani in 08!

 

[All Else Failed]

I agree, if you don't vote, don't complain. Personally, I like playing my own little part in our democracy. McCain-Giuliani in 08!

Well, the problem with that is if a person does not think the candidates are worthy of his/her vote and they dont vote, its not like they magically give up their 1st amendment rights to make their concerns be heard. I mean, if there was an election and every candidate was a horrible choice for president and I dont feel like I should vote and I dont, I don't think its wrong for me to voice my distaste for them.

 

[memento_mori]

Well, the problem with that is if a person does not think the candidates are worthy of his/her vote and they dont vote, its not like they magically give up their 1st amendment rights to make their concerns be heard. I mean, if there was an election and every candidate was a horrible choice for president and I dont feel like I should vote and I dont, I don't think its wrong for me to voice my distaste for them.

very true, but i think what people mean by the "if you didn't vote then don't complain" philosophy is that people's opinion that, say Bush, should never have been voted into office is kind of bold when they themselves didn't vote.

it's not that hard. vote for a third party canidate if you don't like the top two. if you really can't agree with any of the canidates, get your opinion out there and maybe someone else will run. make an honest effort, then you'll have the entire 4 years** to criticize what the government is doing.

**4 years in the states anyway.

 

[All Else Failed]

very true, but i think what people mean by the "if you didn't vote then don't complain" philosophy is that people's opinion that, say Bush, should never have been voted into office is kind of bold when they themselves didn't vote.

it's not that hard. vote for a third party canidate if you don't like the top two. if you really can't agree with any of the canidates, get your opinion out there and maybe someone else will run. make an honest effort, then you'll have the entire 4 years** to criticize what the government is doing.

**4 years in the states anyway.

Still, even if they didnt vote for Bush, I don't see why they still can't actively disagree with him if they didn't WANT to vote for him in the first place. If you were in some fictitious society where a person is elected king each year, and you didn't like him at all and you chose not to dignify his election with your vote, and he got elected and he was a total failure, wouldn't you still complain?


A vote does not give or take away a person's opinion.



Sure, you could throw your vote at some 3rd party candidate to take away votes from the two other parties, but besides delaying the inevitable what did you do? I think its totally fine not to vote at all if you dop not agree with any of the candidates. Plus, I think its a wasted vote if you just vote for a third party candidate just on the gorunds of "He's not them."

 

[memento_mori]

Still, even if they didnt vote for Bush, I don't see why they still can't actively disagree with him if they didn't WANT to vote for him in the first place. If you were in some fictitious society where a person is elected king each year, and you didn't like him at all and you chose not to dignify his election with your vote, and he got elected and he was a total failure, wouldn't you still complain?


A vote does not give or take away a person's opinion.



Sure, you could throw your vote at some 3rd party candidate to take away votes from the two other parties, but besides delaying the inevitable what did you do? I think its totally fine not to vote at all if you dop not agree with any of the candidates. Plus, I think its a wasted vote if you just vote for a third party candidate just on the gorunds of "He's not them."

people have the right to complain, we just take their complaints less seriously when they didn't vote. not voting is a serious problem in the states, and "Didn't Vote? Don't Bitch!" is a better slogan than last election's "Vote or Die" campaign.

throwing away our vote on a 3rd party candidate? they're still candidates. the only reason they don't have better chances to win is because people look at it as throwing away their vote, so they don't even bother to look at them. that and probably a large number of people don't agree with them, but its still tragic to see 3rd parties as throwing away your vote to me, especially when i see the democrats and republicans saying a lot of the same things that people aren't inspired by. we need diversity, dammit!

 

[All Else Failed]

people have the right to complain, we just take their complaints less seriously when they didn't vote. not voting is a serious problem in the states, and "Didn't Vote? Don't Bitch!" is a better slogan than last election's "Vote or Die" campaign.

throwing away our vote on a 3rd party candidate? they're still candidates. the only reason they don't have better chances to win is because people look at it as throwing away their vote, so they don't even bother to look at them. that and probably a large number of people don't agree with them, but its still tragic to see 3rd parties as throwing away your vote to me, especially when i see the democrats and republicans saying a lot of the same things that people aren't inspired by. we need diversity, dammit!

Why take them less seriously? If a total moron casts his ballot for a president, he gains more respect in his opinions just because he voted?

Sadly, 3rd party candidates in America have an astronomically low chance of ever winning. I won't say it can't happen, but with today's two party system its damn near improbable. Now, if you AGREE with a 3rd party candidate and you vote for him, thats a different story. But to vote for him just because "he's not one of the other two" is none-sensical. I think you need to fully understand what that candidate is running for, what his ideas are etc etc. Too many people think "Well, he certainly isnt Bush!" and then vote just based on those grounds. If you don't know what you are voting for, don't vote.

I totally agree that we need more diversity. That is why the election process we have now NEEDS to be changed. Money caps for how much one can spend on campaigne adds and the like will be one solution. That would make it a fairly equal playing field. I want to see not only republicans, democrats, conservatives and liberals...I want to see socialists, communists and every other form of political ideology in the race. The two party system offers nothing but nothing. There IS no difference between republicans and democrats now a days.

 

[memento_mori]

Why take them less seriously? If a total moron casts his ballot for a president, he gains more respect in his opinions just because he voted?

basically. the total moron tried, the idiot who's protesting by not voting didn't. if you're so disgusted with every single candidate that you cannot vote for any of them, you have a serious problem. you need to be more accepting of politicians, or get your hippy ass outside to protest with other hippies in numbers- so you can get your voices out. not voting will only weaken the system we've got running.

Sadly, 3rd party candidates in America have an astronomically low chance of ever winning. I won't say it can't happen, but with today's two party system its damn near improbable. Now, if you AGREE with a 3rd party candidate and you vote for him, thats a different story. But to vote for him just because "he's not one of the other two" is none-sensical. I think you need to fully understand what that candidate is running for, what his ideas are etc etc. Too many people think "Well, he certainly isnt Bush!" and then vote just based on those grounds. If you don't know what you are voting for, don't vote.

I totally agree that we need more diversity. That is why the election process we have now NEEDS to be changed. Money caps for how much one can spend on campaigne adds and the like will be one solution. That would make it a fairly equal playing field. I want to see not only republicans, democrats, conservatives and liberals...I want to see socialists, communists and every other form of political ideology in the race. The two party system offers nothing but nothing. There IS no difference between republicans and democrats now a days.

No one wants to see meaningless votes be balloted and end up with a bad president, but I think we need to have more faith in majority rules.

heh. it'll be like the salary cap in the NFL. poly-ticks is too much like baseball nowadays- the yankees with all the money buy all of the good players and all of the advertising time. but the yankees don't win every year, and if people paid more attention and support to people they personally agreed with maybe we wouldn't have so much complaining about who we have in office.

what's next? getting rid of electoral college?

 

[All Else Failed]

basically. the total moron tried, the idiot who's protesting by not voting didn't. if you're so disgusted with every single candidate that you cannot vote for any of them, you have a serious problem. you need to be more accepting of politicians, or get your hippy ass outside to protest with other hippies in numbers- so you can get your voices out. not voting will only weaken the system we've got running.



No one wants to see meaningless votes be balloted and end up with a bad president, but I think we need to have more faith in majority rules.

heh. it'll be like the salary cap in the NFL. poly-ticks is too much like baseball nowadays- the yankees with all the money buy all of the good players and all of the advertising time. but the yankees don't win every year, and if people paid more attention and support to people they personally agreed with maybe we wouldn't have so much complaining about who we have in office.

what's next? getting rid of electoral college?

I don't think its idiotic to protest, or not to vote. If you detest the candidates, I feel like you do not have an obligation to vote.

No, I don't have a problem if I'm disgusted with all the cnadidates. Its a fact that the two big parties now a days are no different from each other and offer no variety, so it's quite easy to be disgusted with all of them if they are all the same.

(Plus, I know you're only trying to spark debate dave. )


The majority of this country elected Bush for a second time. I lost faith in the majority when that happened.


Get rid of the electoral college? Not a bad idea actually.

 

[memento_mori]

I don't think its idiotic to protest, or not to vote. If you detest the candidates, I feel like you do not have an obligation to vote.

i think it's idiotic to protest by not voting.

No, I don't have a problem if I'm disgusted with all the cnadidates. Its a fact that the two big parties now a days are no different from each other and offer no variety, so it's quite easy to be disgusted with all of them if they are all the same.

you do have a problem if you're in a country that's about to elect people that make laws you have to follow that you don't agree with. it's not an insult, it's a pressing situation.

and we agree, candidates are appealing to the middle man so much and playing politically correct that it's hard to understand where their values really lie, and what they'll do in office. or that's what i think anyway, it doesn't seem like they're talking the same because we finally agree on how to run the country- because if we did we wouldn't be so upset about it.

The majority of this country elected Bush for a second time. I lost faith in the majority when that happened.


Get rid of the electoral college? Not a bad idea actually.

that's depressing. i still have hope in the majority's ability to make a decision. i try not to think of it as bush winning so much as kerry losing, b/c that guy had a bad campaign. i think a lot of people said bush got us into this mess, we better have him get us out of it. it's a new slate next year, let's make it a better 4 years than the last ones.

getting rid of electoral college is an actual proposal. i dont know how i feel about it, but its a thought.

 

[All Else Failed]

Meh, I'm just fed up with the way things are done in this country. Completely sick and tired.

 

[White2000GT]

I want to see not only republicans, democrats, conservatives and liberals...I want to see socialists, communists and every other form of political ideology in the race.

Surely you jest. Man I am really beginning to wonder if you know what the hell you are talking about half the time. Go spend some time in a socialist or communist country sometime and I bet you will have a whole new level of respect and appreciation of our capitalist society.

 

[memento_mori]

Surely you jest. Man I am really beginning to wonder if you know what the hell you are talking about half the time. Go spend some time in a socialist or communist country sometime and I bet you will have a whole new level of respect and appreciation of our capitalist society.

and i think YOU should spend some time in a truly free market society, like hong kong.

there's nothing wrong with having different ideas out there, and we do have some socialist practices that work- minimum wage for example.

 

[White2000GT]

I think I have no desire to go anywhere near China if I can help it. But thanks anyways. Sure there is nothing wrong with having different ideas out there. But I'll be damned if I'm gonna cast a vote for anyone who holds any communist ideals. Not this guy!
And good call on that minimum wage thing! Can you imagine how shitty it would be to work at a job if not for that?

 

[memento_mori]

I think I have no desire to go anywhere near China if I can help it. But thanks anyways. Sure there is nothing wrong with having different ideas out there. But I'll be damned if I'm gonna cast a vote for anyone who holds any communist ideals. Not this guy!
And good call on that minimum wage thing! Can you imagine how shitty it would be to work at a job if not for that?

true dat. no pressure to vote for the commies.

but some of our ideas are kinda pinko, like minimum wage and social security and unemployment insurance. having parties that stick up for ideas like that might be a good thing.