The FBI is watching so hide your porn

[dt3]

Exactly. it doesn't take much for someone who has something against you to give word to local law enforcement to get you arrested for "suspicious behavior" and have your butt shipped to a foreign country to be interrogated and tortured. Thats not a joke either. It has happened to several foreign students on visa's in the US and abroad simply because they either looked a certain way or were wrongly accused of "suspicious behavior".

Where'd ya hear that?

 

[All Else Failed]

If law enforcement is not given some latitude tons of criminals, terrorists, etc. continue to roam the streets. Stop being spooked into thinking that just because some abused the system that all will.

It is just like with our American soldiers. They are running around in uniform, while the enemy isn't. Our soldiers are bound to fight within rules of engagement against and enemy that has no rules of engagement. It's crap and it gets the good guys killed.

Its not about keeping criminals and terrorists in check anymore. This administration just wants control in order to better extrapolate their political and economic agenda.

So are you saying our soldiers should abide by international law when engaging the enemy? Perhaps we need to blow a few of their family member's heads off to get the information out of the others to catch them!

 

[dt3]

Its not about keeping criminals and terrorists in check anymore. This administration just wants control in order to better extrapolate their political and economic agenda.

Conspiracy theorize much???

So are you saying our soldiers should abide by international law when engaging the enemy? Perhaps we need to blow a few of their family member's heads off to get the information out of the others to catch them!

She said that we have to while the enemy doesn't...

 

[GraceAbounds]

Cardinal Richelieu said "If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." How long must I be watched to get the equivalent of six lines?

Even though I don't partake in illegal activities, with enough time and effort you could twist the facts and find me suspect for some crime given you had collected enough data on me.

If you don't care about your privacy.....
My response would be "So do you have curtains?" or "Can I see your credit card bills for the last year?"

I understand what your saying Tim, but after I have personally weighed the pros and cons, and yes I admit there are cons, I just lean more on the other side.

As far as the curtains go, yeah I have them. As far as the credit cards go, I could care less, they can look at them all they want. But in my mind I am not freaked out over it as I do not believe they give a rat's but about me as I do not lift any red flags. But then I have family that has told me that I don't need to be concerned with it, that it is not the hype the general public make it out to be. In other words they don't care about your legal porn.

 

[All Else Failed]

Where'd ya hear that?

A Australian citizen named Mamdouh Habib was picked up by law enforcement operating under the patriot act and was wrongly handed over to Egyptian authorities while he was touring some religious schools in Pakistan he planned to go to. He was wrongly accused of "terrorist ties" and was taken to a cell without a trial, electrocuted with a cattle prod, threatened with anal rape, and tortured for months in a cell filled with water up to his knees and was eventually released by the Pentagon after finding out he had absolutely no ties to any terrorist organization. His story was published in 2005 in the Washington post.


Also in 2005, a innocent taxi driver was killed in Bagram prison by American soldiers. he had NO ties to any terrorist group, just accused of being in one.

 

[Maritxu]

great to hear! I just love more of my freedoms taken away!

That was exaclty my first thought and what I was going to say

 

[All Else Failed]

I understand what your saying Tim, but after I have personally weighed the pros and cons, and yes I admit there are cons, I just lean more on the other side.

As far as the curtains go, yeah I have them. As far as the credit cards go, I could care less, they can look at them all they want. But in my mind I am not freaked out over it as I do not believe they give a rat's but about me as I do not lift any red flags. But then I have family that has told me that I don't need to be concerned with it, that it is not the hype the general public make it out to be. In other words they don't care about your legal porn.

You do realize I could go to the FBI and accuse you of being "seditious" or "acting in suspicious, terrorist like behavior" and they could most likely ship you off to a different country to be tortured, right? This has been done to Private citizens here and abroad, and you're perfectly fine with it.

 

[dt3]

A Australian citizen named Mamdouh Habib was picked up by law enforcement operating under the patriot act and was wrongly handed over to Egyptian authorities while he was touring some religious schools in Pakistan he planned to go to. He was wrongly accused of "terrorist ties" and was taken to a cell without a trial, electrocuted with a cattle prod, threatened with anal rape, and tortured for months in a cell filled with water up to his knees and was eventually released by the Pentagon after finding out he had absolutely no ties to any terrorist organization. His story was published in 2005 in the Washington post.

This guy?
Mamdouh Habib - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
He traveled to New York City, United States, prior to the 1993World Trade Center bombing during which time he visited Sheikh Omar Abdel Rahman (who had issued a death fatwa for Anwar Sadat, was later sentenced to life imprisonment for attacking US targets, and being behind the 1993 World Trade Center bombing). Various national security organizations, including the Australian Security Intelligence Organisation (ASIO), became interested in him at this point.
ASIO and the Federal Police have been tapping his conversations since 1993. They allege that there is evidence to indicate he supports atrocities committed by Islamist extremists around the world, including the 1997 Deir el-Bahri massacre in Luxor in his native Egypt in which 58 tourists and four Egyptians were murdered.
ASIO played a recording of him praising the Islamic militants who carried out this massacre to a court in May 1999 to obtain permission to continue monitoring him.The Luxor massacre was carried out by the Islamic extremist group Al-Gama'a al-Islamiyya of which Sheik Omar Abdel Rahman is the spiritual leader. Mamdouh Habib is a known admirer and supporter of the sheik.


Or maybe this is why he was arrested in Pakistan:
BBC NEWS | Asia-Pacific | Profile: Mamdouh Habib
However, later in the same interview, he suggested that Mr Habib was assumed to be guilty just because he was in the restricted province of Baluchistan without proper visa documents.

 

[All Else Failed]

This guy?
Mamdouh Habib - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
He traveled to New York City, United States, prior to the 1993World Trade Center bombing during which time he visited Sheikh Omar Abdel Rahman (who had issued a death fatwa for Anwar Sadat, was later sentenced to life imprisonment for attacking US targets, and being behind the 1993 World Trade Center bombing). Various national security organizations, including the Australian Security Intelligence Organisation (ASIO), became interested in him at this point.
ASIO and the Federal Police have been tapping his conversations since 1993. They allege that there is evidence to indicate he supports atrocities committed by Islamist extremists around the world, including the 1997 Deir el-Bahri massacre in Luxor in his native Egypt in which 58 tourists and four Egyptians were murdered.
ASIO played a recording of him praising the Islamic militants who carried out this massacre to a court in May 1999 to obtain permission to continue monitoring him.The Luxor massacre was carried out by the Islamic extremist group Al-Gama'a al-Islamiyya of which Sheik Omar Abdel Rahman is the spiritual leader. Mamdouh Habib is a known admirer and supporter of the sheik.


Or maybe this is why he was arrested in Pakistan:
BBC NEWS | Asia-Pacific | Profile: Mamdouh Habib
However, later in the same interview, he suggested that Mr Habib was assumed to be guilty just because he was in the restricted province of Baluchistan without proper visa documents.

Yeah, that guy:


Despite the relentless campaign of accusations and vilification on the part of the US and Australian governments, the US government decided in January not to charge Mr. Habib, based on a complete lack of evidence that would hold up in their secret military trial. At this point, Australia sought his release. On January 11, 2005, Australian Attorney-General Phillip Ruddock announced that Habib would be released without charge by the United States and repatriated to Australia within days. Many legal experts, including former Family Court Chief Justice Alastair Nicholson, have argued that the Australian government has breached its protective duty to its own citizens, Mamdouh Habib and David Hicks, by refusing to defend their rights to a fair trial, and that this constitutes a war crime under the Geneva Convention.



Also, even if we was a stone cold terrorist, shipping people out to other countries that do not abide to the Geneva convention to be tortured is so ethically wrong and illegal its sickening.

 

[dt3]

Yeah, that guy:


Despite the relentless campaign of accusations and vilification on the part of the US and Australian governments, the US government decided in January not to charge Mr. Habib, based on a complete lack of evidence that would hold up in their secret military trial. At this point, Australia sought his release. On January 11, 2005, Australian Attorney-General Phillip Ruddock announced that Habib would be released without charge by the United States and repatriated to Australia within days. Many legal experts, including former Family Court Chief Justice Alastair Nicholson, have argued that the Australian government has breached its protective duty to its own citizens, Mamdouh Habib and David Hicks, by refusing to defend their rights to a fair trial, and that this constitutes a war crime under the Geneva Convention.



Also, even if we was a stone cold terrorist, shipping people out to other countries that do not abide to the Geneva convention to be tortured is so ethically wrong and illegal its sickening.

With Habib back home, Australian officials have revoked his passport, say he remains under suspicion, and warn his activities will be constantly monitored to ensure he does not become a security threat.


I don't have a problem with torturing terrorists. Or even suspected terrorists.

 

[Mrs Behavin]

Dang! This thing got to 3 pages in only a matter of couple hrs! Wow!

 

[All Else Failed]

With Habib back home, Australian officials have revoked his passport, say he remains under suspicion, and warn his activities will be constantly monitored to ensure he does not become a security threat.


I don't have a problem with torturing terrorists. Or even suspected terrorists.

Except torture hardly works, is completely unethical and defies the Geneva convention. I can't believe that you're in favor of even torturing suspected terrorists, not only because its ineffective, but also because they can be totally innocent! This Is America, we would like to hold ourselves in a good light and be an example to others about being just and fair, and breaking international law and ethics will certainly not help us make any allies in this fight, nor does it even follow Habeas Corpus.

What would you say to an innocent man, once found innocent, after you kept him in a cell and beat him daily? "oops? sorry for violating your human rights?" Torture is also wrong because it follows the idea of "guilty until proven innocent". Which is disgusting.

See what fear mongering does to people? It makes them, turn on their own kind.

 

[dt3]

Except torture hardly works, is completely unethical and defies the Geneva convention. I can't believe that you're in favor of even torturing suspected terrorists, not only because its ineffective, but also because they can be totally innocent!

See what fear mongering does to people? It makes them, turn on their own kind.

You're right. The best way to defend America is to send all the terrorists a dozen roses and comp them a suite in Vegas. That should work.

 

[Tim]

This country was based on our freedoms and civil liberties. The right to feel safe from being tortured by our own government. If these things aren't for you, maybe you should leave this country and go to another one where the people don't care that their government tortures their own citizens.


Damn that felt good... I always hear that shit from people that don't like when you complain about problems in the US... I just found it ironic that it works in this sense to.

 

[dt3]

This country was based on our freedoms and civil liberties. The right to feel safe from being tortured by our own government. If these things aren't for you, maybe you should leave this country and go to another one where the people don't care that their government tortures their own citizens.


Damn that felt good... I always hear that shit from people that don't like when you complain about problems in the US... I just found it ironic that it works in this sense to.

If our citizens are trying to mass murder other citizens, then I'd rather that one citizen be tortured than 1000's of innocent ones.

 

[All Else Failed]

You're right. The best way to defend America is to send all the terrorists a dozen roses and comp them a suite in Vegas. That should work.

You are every mistaken if you think I'm some sort of pacifist. Far from it. I believe that violence can be just in certain situations. The best way to defend America is to stop doing so much business in the middle east. Do you think its a coincidence that terrorists do not attack countries not involved in the middle east? Hmmm......

 

[dt3]

You are every mistaken if you think I'm some sort of pacifist. Far from it. I believe that violence can be just in certain situations. The best way to defend America is to stop doing so much business in the middle east. Do you think its a coincidence that terrorists do not attack countries not involved in the middle east? Hmmm......

Believe me, I'm all for that. In 50 years they'd kill each other off. Or we could just turn Israel loose.

 

[All Else Failed]

Believe me, I'm all for that. In 50 years they'd kill each other off. Or we could just turn Israel loose.

Well I'm glad we found some middle ground.....Israel is a toughly though. They can defend themselves, they have time and time again.