The Blasphemy Challenge

[TommyTooter]

of course.

I've been told many a time that without a belief in God, you cannot have morals.

Which makes an interesting point: If you believe in God, are you only doing so to secure a place in heaven? And do you only behave morally for fear of God's wrath?

In my mind, a yes to either one of those makes you a pretty lousy human being.



The topic of the thread.

how so?

it strikes me as a pretty good notion.

christians can be a real pain in the ass to non-christians who are working hard to be good humans without the help of john's hallucinations, paul's deviations from torah and everybody else's misinterpretations of the master.

i don't think one even has to believe that there is an actual sentient critter that is what is supposed to be god to live a righteous life. whether there actually is an afterlife or not is something we can't really know until we get there. i hedge my bets by doing the best i can to live life loving living.

 

[edgray]

how so?

it strikes me as a pretty good notion.

christians can be a real pain in the ass to non-christians who are working hard to be good humans without the help of john's hallucinations, paul's deviations from torah and everybody else's misinterpretations of the master.

i don't think one even has to believe that there is an actual sentient critter that is what is supposed to be god to live a righteous life. whether there actually is an afterlife or not is something we can't really know until we get there. i hedge my bets by doing the best i can to live life loving living.

It seems silly to me, as the OP pointed out. So I can go rape, pillage and murder but as long as I believe in God it's A-Ok?

 

[mazHur]

Believe it or not but God is there...smiling at you, me and all!!

If you killed someone ANYWHERE in the world you will be held liable by men as well as God; but if you deny existence of God or talk ill of Him in some places other than yours you will certainly face the music....

BR has rightly put it :'

'People should be judged by their actions... not their beliefs.'

'but I doubt if anyone can have anything without a 'belief'??

Though not directly related to the topic the foll passage from an email aptly reflects upon how human logic can be flawed...


''Our logic can be flawed, our perceptions just surreal interpretations of what is really out there, but wait, can we assume the scientist has the last word? They will themselves tell us no. They speak of light, that its speed is related not to its source, but to the observer! They say light (EMR) seems like a wave, has a frequency, but is composed of erratic splattering of energy packets. So what is energy? They might speak of gravity, as if it were more than a word we use to describe a manifestation, the movement of things, by way of a mysterious “force”. What is a force? That which moves things. The scientist is as blind to what is really going on as the rest of us. It is simply that his models, his way of thinking, can give us more power in a certain way.''

 

[sexysadie]

But is it really a sin to not believe? I think sins are things like killing, raping, bullying, hurting others, etc. People should be judged by their actions... not their beliefs. That's not to say that beliefs aren't important. Bad beliefs can lead to bad actions. But it's the actions that are really wrong.

I'm sure not all Christians believe this but, according to some, I can never be forgiven and go to heaven now. Not because I did something bad but because I publicly expressed my lack of belief. IMO, this is a transparent scare tactic invented by some early Christians to keep doubters in line. But I'm not scared.

That's where you're wrong doll, that's not what God is all about. I think he see's what's in your heart....as I do. You're not a bad person, you just don't understand and it's human nature to question what we don't understand. I wish I could explain it in a way that you'd understand, I really do, but it's more about faith than anything else.....to blindly trust that which you don't understand is not an easy task. I consider myself to be an intelligent individual, and I trust and believe in God with all my heart and soul. It's not a tactic, a tactic for what exactly? If I'm wrong and there is no God, then what have I lost really??? IBut doll, if I'm right what have YOU lost?

 

[sexysadie]

It seems silly to me, as the OP pointed out. So I can go rape, pillage and murder but as long as I believe in God it's A-Ok?

Do you hear yourself, really? :24:

 

[sexysadie]

how so?

it strikes me as a pretty good notion.

christians can be a real pain in the ass to non-christians who are working hard to be good humans without the help of john's hallucinations, paul's deviations from torah and everybody else's misinterpretations of the master.

i don't think one even has to believe that there is an actual sentient critter that is what is supposed to be god to live a righteous life. whether there actually is an afterlife or not is something we can't really know until we get there. i hedge my bets by doing the best i can to live life loving living.

If you are right then why is it always the NON christians who start these threads...lol I believe in God and I'm a hard working mother of two..........if you choose not to believe it makes me sad but so be it. Next you'll be telling me that if I were a true christian I'd WANT to make you believe........so really doll, I can't win here can I?

 

[sexysadie]

I think the strategy is to villify doubters. It's called poisoning the well. Unfortunately it's working. Atheists are the least trusted minority in the USA.

I think you've got waaaay too much time on your hands...lol

 

[BornReady]

I consider myself to be an intelligent individual, and I trust and believe in God with all my heart and soul.

Absolutely! I wouldn't want to change a thing about you.

It's not a tactic, a tactic for what exactly?

You are not using a fear tactic. But Christian leaders who claim God will never forgive someone for denying the existence of the Holy Spirit are using a fear tactic. They do this because they are afraid they will lose their flock. So they try to scare them into not doubting, imo. You may not know any pastors like this but I do. I used to be a Christian and was in a very conservative fundamentalist group. And yes, the pastors used fear every chance they got.

If I'm wrong and there is no God, then what have I lost really??? But doll, if I'm right what have YOU lost?

And if the Muslims are right then we're both screwed.

Seriously though, if you're living your life the way you choose then you've lost nothing. But people who let a pastor, priest, shaman, imam, rabbi or similar control them have lost a lot.

why is it always the NON christians who start these threads...

I can't speak for all non-Christians but I start these threads because religion and philosophy interest me. I am not anti-Christian. Some of my best friends are Christians. I am against intolerance and for free thought. There aren't too many intolerant people that come to forums like these. So I'm preaching to the choir for the most part.

I think you've got waaaay too much time on your hands...lol

lol maybe but atheists really are the least trusted minority according to a national survey.

American's increasing acceptance of religious diversity doesn't extend to those who don't believe in a god, according to a national survey by researchers in the University of Minnesota's department of sociology.

From a telephone sampling of more than 2,000 households, university researchers found that Americans rate atheists below Muslims, recent immigrants, gays and lesbians and other minority groups in "sharing their vision of American society." Atheists are also the minority group most Americans are least willing to allow their children to marry.

2000 households is a very small sample size but I've read other surveys that found the same result.

 

[edgray]

Do you hear yourself, really? :24:

I suppose you don't because God's busy talking to you.

 

[dkwrtw]

I saw God in a dream once, he looks disturbingly like Sagat from Street Fighter.

 

[edgray]

I saw God in a dream once, he looks disturbingly like Sagat from Street Fighter.

:24: :24:

I wonder if he has the same moves?

 

[dkwrtw]

I don't know, he was riding a whale with Angel wings, I ate pasta with him.

 

[edgray]

I don't know, he was riding a whale with Angel wings, I ate pasta with him.

That is one truly bizarre image. I suppose it's no less plausible than a dude with a white beard sat on a cloud smiting people.

 

[dkwrtw]

Despite his scarred up body and whatnot he didn't seem in the least bit violent, we were on the top floor of an office building, laughing and being Merry, and sharing divine pasta with one another.

 

[sexysadie]

I suppose you don't because God's busy talking to you.

No, I don't hear you because the words that you've typed on this screen didn't come with sound..lol....why, what do you hear

 

[sexysadie]

That is one truly bizarre image. I suppose it's no less plausible than a dude with a white beard sat on a cloud smiting people.

Did you see that in your sunday school book doll? Does it have big colorful pictures in it?

 

[Minor Axis]

lol I seriously laughed out loud when I read that. I'm not laughing at you and I have no reason to doubt you. It just struck me as funny considering God had just killed practically everything.

Talk about a double standard, lol! Not you... God.

 

[TommyTooter]

It seems silly to me, as the OP pointed out. So I can go rape, pillage and murder but as long as I believe in God it's A-Ok?

it's a crap shoot at best from where i sit.

if the scriptures are full of shit as many believe, no problem.

if not, well, that remains to be seen. it ain't over 'til the dead lady sings.

 

[mazHur]

“The word is not the thing”, and our perceptions, our scientific models, our claimed knowledge, is not real.

 

[BornReady]

Talk about a double standard, lol! Not you... God.

lol Exactly