Objective reality?

[Tim]

Objective reality is how things really are. How can that be applied to ethics or morality?

Ethics and Morality are defined by us, which would automatically preclude them from objective reality. They would fall under the heading of subjective reality.

 

[GraceAbounds]

Objective reality is how things really are. How can that be applied to ethics or morality?

When practically applying right and wrong (ethics and morality) decisions etc. to a situation it should be based on objective reality, not emotional subjective reality.

Ethics and Morality are defined by us, which would automatically preclude them from objective reality. They would fall under the heading of subjective reality.

I understand where you are coming from. But personally I believe differently. I believe that God is the author and definer of morality. Man redefined morality.

 

[Tim]

I'm not saying that you should apply emotional subjective reality to ethics or morality.

I see objective reality as something that cannot be defined differently from culture to culture. It is an absolute. Morality and ethics do not fit this test...

In your above example where you compare protection of life vs lying, if it truly could be considered objective reality, then under no circumstances could lying be justified over the protection of life... Well I bet there can be dozens of cases made where lying would be more ethical/moral than the protection of life.

I'm not wording this as clearly as I want... but you get at what I am saying...

 

[GraceAbounds]

Do you believe in the concept of objective reality, and do you believe that that applies to all things, including ethics?

I believe in objective reality. I believe it applies to all things; including ethics.

Subjective reality is viewed though our emotions, our upbringing, our culture, etc. Personally I do not believe that emotions, our upbringing, our culture, etc. are things that can be 'trusted'. Emotions are cues. Our upbringing should not be what truly defines us. And our culture can be at changed any time if we want it to be through education, experience, and practice.

I see objective reality as something that cannot be defined differently from culture to culture. It is an absolute. Morality and ethics do not fit this test...

Since I believe that God is absolute and that he defines morality - in my mind it is absolute. Just because mankind redefines morality and ignores God's morality does not make it un-absolute, if you see what I am saying. I know that people that don't believe in God do not believe this. I'm just expressing my own personal beliefs on the issue.

In your above example where you compare protection of life vs lying, if it truly could be considered objective reality, then under no circumstances could lying be justified over the protection of life... Well I bet there can be dozens of cases made where lying would be more ethical/moral than the protection of life.

I'm not wording this as clearly as I want... but you get at what I am saying...

I understand what your saying. I know that any giving situation can have a thousand different variables to it, but it still does not change the fact that there is an objective reality ---- even though I do not believe that mankind can even truly gather all aspects of any situation (think deep here ... lol). Regardless, as far as my beliefs go there is only one Truth, one Absolute, and even though I will screw it all up as far as decisions go more than likely ... it doesn't change the fact that it is there. (of course you'd have to believe in God to believe this though)

I'm sure I didn't word my thoughts clearly either. So we are batting a 100 here. :willy_nilly:

 

[All Else Failed]

I'm a fan of Nietzsche-esque immorality. ("Immorality" in his point of view isn't the kind of immorality we see it as)

 

[FreeWorkVest]

There is a reality. A rock is a rock, water is water, no matter the perception. Ice is still water, even if it is carved into a swan. So I believe there is indeed an immutable, objective reality.
There is also a perceptive reality. You can carve a stone into a hammer, but the stone hasn't been changed, just the shape.

As far as morality and ethics, they are black and white. Wrong is always wrong. Right is always right.

To answer the "Does this make me look fat?" If Yes is the answer, to answer something else would be expedient, and the repercussions will be postive rather than negetive, the truth is always right.