Obamacare upheld!! BUSH SCOTUS APPOINTEE John Roberts is the swing vote!!!

[Tangerine]

Of course it's a healthcare problem. Do you have any idea how many people are turned away every day? Just sent home to die.

Sure you can get life saving care without insurance or money. But try walking in and saying you have cancer and no money. The'll laugh at you.

Except my brother just about a month ago walked into a hospital with no health insurance. He was immediately diagnosed with squamous carcinoma in his throat and neck. His prognosis is not good and the choices for treatments are extensive. He has not paid one penny out of his pocket and he is being cared for by some of the most compassionate and caring doctors I've ever met, and in a facility that is exceptionally modern, and state-of-the art.

How do you explain that? He was not "sent home to die."

 

[Tim]

Except my brother just about a month ago walked into a hospital with no health insurance. He was immediately diagnosed with squamous carcinoma in his throat and neck. His prognosis is not good and the choices for treatments are extensive. He has not paid one penny out of his pocket and he is being cared for by some of the most compassionate and caring doctors I've ever met, and in a facility that is exceptionally modern, and state-of-the art.

How do you explain that? He was not "sent home to die."

I'm glad your brother got the help he needed.

Do you think he's going to be able to pay the bills? I'm pretty sure the costs are going to be substantial.



And according to a Harvard study, more than 45,000 people die in the US each year because of lack of health insurance.
So while your brother may be a lucky one, there are many who die because they can't afford medical treatment.

 

[Accountable]

It's a flawed leap in logic to claim anyone died from lack of health insurance. That's like saying that Louie - after borrowing money from the loan shark for a wager which he lost, then was unable to repay the loan - died of bad luck.

I don't mean to make light of the situation, but Harvard making claims like that is hyperbole.

 

[Tim]

It's a flawed leap in logic to claim anyone died from lack of health insurance. That's like saying that Louie - after borrowing money from the loan shark for a wager which he lost, then was unable to repay the loan - died of bad luck.

I don't mean to make light of the situation, but Harvard making claims like that is hyperbole.

Would it be better if I said 45,000 people die in the US each year because they weren't wealthy enough to pay for healthcare?

 

[Accountable]

Only if you can also say that good money management prevents disease.

 

[Johnfromokc]

Sometimes good money management doesn't stop medical bankruptcy - even with health insurance.

 

[Tim]

Only if you can also say that good money management prevents disease.

That's not true. There are many in our country that would never make enough to cover some medical procedures.

Over 2,100 Heart transplants per year at over $1,000,000 each. Are you saying that if you managed your money properly you should be able to swing that?
What about cancer treatment where it can run well over $1,000,000 for care.


But I guess in your world, I should just put half my paycheck into a saving account in case anyone in my family gets sick. And if someone gets really sick, then to bad, declare bankruptcy and stick the bill on the next round of patients.

 

[Johnfromokc]

 

[Accountable]

Would it be better if I said 45,000 people die in the US each year because they weren't wealthy enough to pay for healthcare?

Only if you can also say that good money management prevents disease.

That's not true.

Of course it's not true, and not for the reasons you described. It simply doesn't follow.

 

[Tim]

Of course it's not true, and not for the reasons you described. It simply doesn't follow.

At least you don't disappoint. Your post is as cryptic and useless as usual. Would it pain you to actually add a little substance or maybe a point?

 

[Johnfromokc]

At least you don't disappoint. Your post is as cryptic and useless as usual. Would it pain you to actually add a little substance or maybe a point?

No shit. He says a lot of nothingness. It's like pulling teeth.

 

[Panacea]

I guess the topic is gap clients (those ineligible for Medicaid/Medicare and those not wealthy enough to afford medical procedures without insurance, or instances in which insurance doesn't prevent financial ruin in medical emergencies...which, if you're an honest person is a vast majority of us, insured or not). Libertarians aren't going to like hearing someone claim people die because of a lack of something that sounds like a grasp at entitlement, to the point they may actually swing so far in the opposite direction they sound like heartless pricks.

It's all about wording, keeping the ideology alive without actually having an honest discussion. This isn't calling out anyone here, I just think this topic needs to seep beyond political ideologies. It's too important.

 

[Tangerine]

I'm glad your brother got the help he needed.

Do you think he's going to be able to pay the bills? I'm pretty sure the costs are going to be substantial.




And according to a Harvard study, more than 45,000 people die in the US each year because of lack of health insurance.
So while your brother may be a lucky one, there are many who die because they can't afford medical treatment.

My brothers cancer, unfortuntely, doesn't bode well for his survival more than a year or so.

So, when he finally loses that battle, would the Harvard statistics consider him someone who died because of a lack of health insurance? It will be true that he had no insurance, and at some point it will be true that he passed away from cancer. But he will also have gotten great care and treatment in order to prolong his life what little they could. It makes me wonder where cases like his would fall in the results of their study.

It's also noted that no, he will not be receiving bills from the hospital where he is being cared for. They have their own donor-funded charitible funding for those who slip between the cracks of traditional and Governmental medical plans. There are many, many forms of health care in this country that are similar. Rarely do they make reference of such in any media coverage or debate of health care. In fact, I myself had no idea how vast the reach of such systems are until I had to experience this first hand.

 

[Accountable]

It's also noted that no, he will not be receiving bills from the hospital where he is being cared for. They have their own donor-funded charitible funding for those who slip between the cracks of traditional and Governmental medical plans. There are many, many forms of health care in this country that are similar. Rarely do they make reference of such in any media coverage or debate of health care. In fact, I myself had no idea how vast the reach of such systems are until I had to experience this first hand.

But they're not federal programs, and I think that's the problem Washington has with them.

I wish you and your brother well.

 

[Accountable]

At least you don't disappoint. Your post is as cryptic and useless as usual. Would it pain you to actually add a little substance or maybe a point?

Money or lack of money does not kill people. People do not die because of a low bank balance. Please don't pretend this is beyond your intelligence. Stripped of the emotion and judgmentalism, the Harvard findings simply don't follow logic. That is my only point.

 

[Johnfromokc]

This sums up Obamacare nicely:

 

[Accountable]

Yup! That's how things get done in Washington. Make it appear to be two opposing sides then coordinate to push it through.

 

[Johnfromokc]