Nuclear proliferation and North Korea
- Thread starter pinky
- Start date
Users who are viewing this thread
-
105Replies
-
2KViews
-
0Participant count
-
Participants list
Peter Parka
Well-Known Member
Cant see that it will go anywhere. Love how the US thinks it should police the world though and decide who should and shouldn't have nukes.
Peter Parka
Well-Known Member
I think it goes something like, ifyou're on our side you can have them, if not, naughty, naughty. They were only too happy for Iraq to have certain weapons, even selling them to him until they wernt on the same side any more.
Minor Axis
Well-Known Member
Israel has never officially admitted it, but the consensus is they do have them. If you consider major countries as responsible, and 3rd world countries as an unknown, then it's not a double standard to try to keep nukes in the hands of the what you consider to be the responsible countries, if that is not an oxymoron.
Peter Parka
Well-Known Member
I know this opens up a whole different kettle of worms but which country has been the only one who has actually used them on innocent citizens?
lumpenstein
Active Member
Ouch!
That isn't a can of worms; it's a whole barrel full! :eek
It is well know international politics that you give everything you have to your allies and deny them to your enemies. Now, in true Orwellian fashion, in the blink of an eye an enemy can suddenly become an ally and vice-versa. Look at Iraq (once an ally so let's give it WMD to use against Iran) or Czechoslovakia (against which nukes were once aimed but now, as the Czech Republic and Slovakia are members of NATO).
TheOriginalJames
Well-Known Member
Israel isn't a communist state where they'll just randomly invade their neighbors. Korean war... anybody?
Piddly podunk bitch ass communist countries like N Korea do not need nuclear weapons.
Piddly podunk bitch ass communist countries like N Korea do not need nuclear weapons.
TheOriginalJames
Well-Known Member
Japan had 3-4 chances to surrender prior to the bombs going off. They chose to be stubborn little mother fuckers and they got what they deserved.
Peter Parka
Well-Known Member
Yes James, those innocent citizens living in fear with no interest themselves whatsoever in the war deserved to be nuked.
lumpenstein
Active Member
It was basically the emperor, one man, that refused to surrender. The people did not deserve that nor did they deserve to be bombed, no more than the people of Iraq deserve to be bombed and boycotted into the stone age.
Fox Mulder
Active Member
I agree with you on Japan (to an extent), but not Iraq. More people will live in Iraq then will die because Hussein has been removed from power. The dirty little secret the media doesn't want you to know is that hundreds of thousands were dying under Hussein's regime (either by direct murder or by starvation and abuse). The two situations are very different.
The reason I say to an "extent" on Japan is because we were left with a choice of many hundreds of thousands of Americans die or Japanese die. The choice was made to save the American lives. Looking back at it now, it was a mistake. However, that being said, the war in Japan would have dragged on for years and likely the same number of people (or possibly even more) would have died before Japan finally surrendered (or the power was taken from the government).
lumpenstein
Active Member
I have to disagree with that. At that point in the war the Japanese navy and airforce were non-existant and the army was decimated. I find it hard to imagine their military inflicting hundreds of thousands of casualties. America was bombing their troops and cities with impunity. I don't know; all I can say is I am glad I wasn't the one to make the decision.
Alien Allen
Froggy the Prick
there would have been a bloodbath on their mainland. there really is no disputing that if you follow history.
the Japanese were not one to give up.
You make it sound like we this was an easy decision and you also left out the fact they were warned.
History shows what hollow threats mean. People do not take them seriously. For all the bad that came out of Iraq I doubt some tin horn dictator will ignore us the next time. at least not in the near future. Hussein should have paid more attention to Kadhafi and taken the countless hints the world gave him.
Fox Mulder
Active Member
Research it. Imagine Iraq, except intead of a few thousand insurgents, you had hundreds of thousands (or even millions) of Japanese and a lot more access to weapons. It wasn't so much the military, but the civilian population as well. As my memory serves, the estimate was 600,000 American lives in six months with an all out invasion of Japan (similar to that of Germany) and it could have been a lot more after that. The flip side was kill 100,000 civilians and destroy the two cities. But--in addition to the saving of the 600,000 American lives (at least), many Japanese would also have died with the invasion as well and likely as many or more than what the bomb killed. That's no excuse or justification--they should not have used it and most people now agree it was a mistake in retrospect (although not necessarily at that time with the attitude prevalent in those days).
The US doesn't, the existing nuclear powers make the decision of which the US is only of the members. Geeezzzz, you guys really have got to stop watching the bullshit called the "news" and read a book.
BTW, you are aware that Bush through the diplomatic corp has , until recently revealed, secret meetings with diplomatic leaders from North Korea? He has suffered a lot of heat from the more conservative wing of the Republican party for doing so.
TEAM AMERICA springs to mind hehehehehehe aaaaaaa so funny lol
Minor Axis
Well-Known Member
That's a perspective that some people might have, but in the spectrum of invading Japan and the estimated resulting 1 million+ casualties of invading the Japanese homeland and because it was a new technology, it seemed like a prudent choice. If you are judging the U.S., put any other country in our place at that time, under that circumstance and consider the outcome.
You and your assumptions gets old. If someone views the world differenty than you it's because they been watching the liberal news. What makes you think books are any different? Most written documents have an agenda. History is often written by the victor. And as far as Bush's diplomacy every diplomat in the world knows it's better to be talking with your enemy than only acting tough with them. The conservative wing of the Republican party are idiots, a well know documented fact.
You and your assumptions gets old. If someone views the world differenty than you it's because they been watching the liberal news. What makes you think books are any different? Most written documents have an agenda. History is often written by the victor. And as far as Bush's diplomacy every diplomat in the world knows it's better to be talking with your enemy than only acting tough with them. The conservative wing of the Republican party are idiots, a well know documented fact.
What assumptions? I pointed out an inaccurate statement. The US doesn't decide who can have and can not have nuclear weapons. Try following along with the conversation. BTW, pointing out that the statement was inaccurate is neither a conservative nor liberal view, its a fact. The problem here is people like you read liberal rags and watch CNN and think you understand what is happening as the result of sound bite information. Then what happens is you make inaccurate statements by parroting what you hear Wolf Blitzer say such as the "the US says North Korea can't have nuclear weapons". Read a book, several in fact, then apply a little analytical thinking to what you've read, understand the motivations behind TV news (I'll give you a hint: lowest common denominator) and then you may make a statement of an informed opinion. Note: informed opinion can be either a conservative, middle of the road or liberal opinion.
If it's liberal more than likely it'll be stupid. :24:
Minor Axis
Well-Known Member
Your news assumption, go read a book instead, then your guaranteed to get the right version.
78,875Threads
2,185,392Messages
4,959Members