Justice or Revenge

[GraceAbounds]

Justice or Revenge? What makes an action justice vs it being revenge and visa versa?

Do you think they are just brothers of another mother or not?

What say you?

 

[Peter Parka]

I guess a lot depends in what situation we're talking about. I think revenge is more driven by emotions than balance. Justice should be about about punishing someone for bad or rewarding them for good without letting biased emotions get in the way. Thats just my feelings anyway!

 

[IntruderLS1]

Oooohhhhh.....

I like this thread already. Rep for the Grace.

 

[Maritxu]

I would say Justice is not about punishment, but more about rehabilitation, and that's what I would call the difference.

 

[HisHoliness]

I would say Justice is not about punishment, but more about rehabilitation, and that's what I would call the difference.

If we can all agree on specific definitions, you're partly right and partly wrong. Justice has little to do with rehabilitation.

Justice -noun
1. the quality of being just; righteousness, equitableness, or moral rightness: to uphold the justice of a cause.
2. rightfulness or lawfulness, as of a claim or title; justness of ground or reason: to complain with justice.
3. the moral principle determining just conduct.
4. conformity to this principle, as manifested in conduct; just conduct, dealing, or treatment.
5. the administering of deserved punishment or reward.
6. the maintenance or administration of what is just by law, as by judicial or other proceedings: a court of justice.

Revenge -verb
1. to exact punishment or expiation for a wrong on behalf of, esp. in a resentful or vindictive spirit: He revenged his murdered brother.
2. to take vengeance for; inflict punishment for; avenge: He revenged his brother's murder.
3. to take revenge.
–noun
4. the act of revenging; retaliation for injuries or wrongs; vengeance.
5. something done in vengeance.
6. the desire to revenge; vindictiveness.
7. an opportunity to retaliate or gain satisfaction.

 

[Maritxu]

In my country, though, Prison is a place ONLY orientated towards Rehabilitation (or they tell you that in the Constitution, lol)
It doesn't really matter what I believe but I may add that's how it should be.

 

[HisHoliness]

I used to be idealistic too. More power to ya.

 

[Maritxu]

It's not really about being idealistic or not, it's about not beeing a hypocrate. If Justice is for punishment purpuses only, then I would expect that to be said in my constitution.

 

[Peter Parka]

It seems like we're getting off topic to the capital punishment thread which I was fully expecting this to go anyway but I agree with Maria. I personally couldn't agree with killing someone for killing someone else, I would feel like a complete hypocrite and I think killing people is sick anyway. A lot of you seem to want to torture and kill sickos who commit these heanous crimes but I wonder how many of you could actually go through with it without being fucked up for the rest of your lives?

 

[dt3]

A lot of you seem to want to torture and kill sickos who commit these heanous crimes but I wonder how many of you could actually go through with it without being fucked up for the rest of your lives?

If they gave me a few hours with that piece of shit who raped and buried the 9 year old girl alive, I wouldn't regret a damn thing. I'd be proud of it for the rest of my life.

And no, it wouldn't be justice. Nothing I could do to him would be justice. But it would sure as hell make me (and probably a lot of other people) feel better.

AEF, that's your cue to jump in and call me a hypocrite and all sorts of other fun stuff

 

[Peter Parka]

If they gave me a few hours with that piece of shit who raped and buried the 9 year old girl alive, I wouldn't regret a damn thing. I'd be proud of it for the rest of my life.

And no, it wouldn't be justice. Nothing I could do to him would be justice. But it would sure as hell make me (and probably a lot of other people) feel better.

AEF, that's your cue to jump in and call me a hypocrite and all sorts of other fun stuff

Haha! I'm not AEF and I'm not going to call you a hypocrite. By your own admision though, that wouldn't be justice. It would make you feel a damn site good and it would make me feel good too but we're looking at it from a revengeful and personal point of view and just because something makes you feel good, dosen't make it right!

 

[dt3]

Revenge -verb
1. to exact punishment or expiation for a wrong on behalf of, esp. in a resentful or vindictive spirit
2. to take vengeance for; inflict punishment for; avenge
7. an opportunity to retaliate or gain satisfaction.

By these definitons, any criminal punishment is revenge. A speeding ticket is "punishment or expiation for a wrong".

 

[Maritxu]

This is not only a very interessting topic, but also very complex.
The reason for this is that we can debate what justice is or what it should be (because it would be normal for all of us to disagree with some laws or the consecuences for some crimes. For instance, I could argue that I think drunk driving should mean you are never allow to drive again or that rapists should not be allowed outside of prisons as rehabilitation programs are not proven to work with them. We could also argue about the streight definition of what justice means in the dictionary, or what it means to each country, or even to each one of us. I could say, for example, that I think justice should be more based on community service and rehabilitation.
I fear we may end up in death penalty again, and about that I will only add one thing. That something is legal, or carried out by the state doesn't make it right.

 

[GraceAbounds]

If we can all agree on specific definitions, you're partly right and partly wrong. Justice has little to do with rehabilitation.

Justice -noun
1. the quality of being just; righteousness, equitableness, or moral rightness: to uphold the justice of a cause.
2. rightfulness or lawfulness, as of a claim or title; justness of ground or reason: to complain with justice.
3. the moral principle determining just conduct.
4. conformity to this principle, as manifested in conduct; just conduct, dealing, or treatment.
5. the administering of deserved punishment or reward.
6. the maintenance or administration of what is just by law, as by judicial or other proceedings: a court of justice.

Revenge -verb
1. to exact punishment or expiation for a wrong on behalf of, esp. in a resentful or vindictive spirit: He revenged his murdered brother.
2. to take vengeance for; inflict punishment for; avenge: He revenged his brother's murder.
3. to take revenge.
–noun
4. the act of revenging; retaliation for injuries or wrongs; vengeance.
5. something done in vengeance.
6. the desire to revenge; vindictiveness.
7. an opportunity to retaliate or gain satisfaction.

Brownie points given.

In this thread and the execution thread many people do not seem to understand the difference between the two words. And are trying to say that both words mean the same thing when they don't.

It looks like we have four opinions on this issue:

(1 group) that does not agree with the death penalty and calls it revenge (I disagree with this group as they are making up their own definitions to words)

(2 group) that does not agree with the death penalty and understands it to be a sentence to carry out justice (I respect this stance even though I don't agree)

(3 group) agrees with the death penalty and sees it as a way of getting revenge (I don't agree with this group even though my physical/flesh side has to fight feelings of revenge occasionally as well)

(4 group) agrees with the death penalty and understands it as a means to justice being served (I agree)

Which group are you in?

 

[dt3]

(3 group) agrees with the death penalty and sees it as a way of getting revenge (I don't agree with this group even though my human side has to fight feelings of revenge occasionally as well)

What about your robot side?

 

[GraceAbounds]

What about your robot side?

I was noting a difference between my physical and spiritual being.

Saying human side didn't come out right did it? LOL!

No robot side here, I promise. ha!

 

[NightWarrior]

There is a very thin line between justice and revenge. Personally, I think that someone who is punished by death gets off too easy. I say make them rot in prison thinking about the crime for the rest of their lives. Perhaps they can take up a religion and repent, I don't know.

 

[All Else Failed]

If they gave me a few hours with that piece of shit who raped and buried the 9 year old girl alive, I wouldn't regret a damn thing. I'd be proud of it for the rest of my life.

And no, it wouldn't be justice. Nothing I could do to him would be justice. But it would sure as hell make me (and probably a lot of other people) feel better.

AEF, that's your cue to jump in and call me a hypocrite and all sorts of other fun stuff

I love you too much, babe. :booty:

 

[dt3]

I love you too much, babe. :booty:

Holy crap, it all makes sense now!

 

[Maritxu]

Brownie points given.

In this thread and the execution thread many people do not seem to understand the difference between the two words. And are trying to say that both words mean the same thing when they don't.

It looks like we have four opinions on this issue:

(1 group) that does not agree with the death penalty and calls it revenge (I disagree with this group as they are making up their own definitions to words)

(2 group) that does not agree with the death penalty and understands it to be a sentence to carry out justice (I respect this stance even though I don't agree)

(3 group) agrees with the death penalty and sees it as a way of getting revenge (I don't agree with this group even though my physical/flesh side has to fight feelings of revenge occasionally as well)

(4 group) agrees with the death penalty and understands it as a means to justice being served (I agree)

Which group are you in?

Maybe I'm wrong but I think death penalty is being interpretated as part of justice and that is why you agree with it, right? I wanted to remind you all that some people in this forum don't live in countries where the death penalty is still practised. And I have said before, that something is legal or carried out by the state doesn't make it good.
And about Grace's question, I don't think I fit in any of your groups. The only thing that is clear is that I'm against death penalty. I happen to believe I am nobody to decide who lives or dies, I happen to believe too, I'm better than a murderer, more forgiving, more human. I do think a great number of people think death penalty is about revenge, most of them actually, the ones who agree with it.
One last thing Grace, I thought it was funny you sympathize with revengeful people, but not with those who oppose the death of a human being, why? This is not an attack, is just a question, please answer it.