High school valedictorian denied diploma over graduation speech

[Francis]

Your questions were answered ..you just cant rebut them

Nope sorry didn't even come close.. try again..

I didnt deny she was a model student before hand....but lets face it she wasnt a model student graduation day....I guess we could have a model citizen go do a bank job then not punish him???
She broke the rules..its pretty simple.

Model students dont curse in front of a large crowd at a school function...not the behavior of a model student is it?

OK so you didn't deny she was a Model student before hand so all of a fraction of a second she turns from one into a deviant and than back again.. WOW..

Oh yah what about what her accomplices ? Why do they not get punished as they are as guilty as her in the eyes of the law ?

I never stated she was chosen for being a good off or a bad student

No I made the point that a valedictorian is not chosen for being a goof off or a bad student. Hence you have to be not just good for one year but all through high school..

I have not claimed such...I will say this however it was a poor decision on her part and totally disrespectful to the school and its audience...which is unacceptable.
Mind you I want her to get her diploma..but there needs to be some consequences for her action...20 page essay....or a 100 laps around the gym....perhaps pick up gum wrappers and sweep the sidewalks... or wax the floors....some mild form of punishment.
Graduation ceremonies are meant to be serious...Staff takes it very seriously as to show an audience what a great bunch of kids they have.....You ruin the ceremony ...you piss off the big cheese...it has always been that way..this is nothing new

If you read my post it says and I quote "You could claim". That may be why we have a failure to communicate as there is a big difference..

Seeing she got applause and congratulated for her speech I can't help but wonder who she disrespected?

Also there is no mention that the ceremony was ruined.. Not sure where you get that information from.

And again, like I said so do the student take this as very serious. Why would you assume they do not.. Just because she inserted the word "Hell" does not mean she did not take the ceremony seriously. That's your opinion of this situation.

Oh one last thing..

If

Hell is hell there is no mistake

Give me the proper definition of "Heck" as in the use she intended it to be in her speech as an interjection ?

 

[The Man]

Nope sorry didn't even come close.. try again..




OK so you didn't deny she was a Model student before hand so all of a fraction of a second she turns from one into a deviant and than back again.. WOW..

Oh yah what about what her accomplices ? Why do they not get punished as they are as guilty as her in the eyes of the law ?



No I made the point that a valedictorian is not chosen for being a goof off or a bad student. Hence you have to be not just good for one year but all through high school..



If you read my post it says and I quote "You could claim". That may be why we have a failure to communicate as there is a big difference..

Seeing she got applause and congratulated for her speech I can't help but wonder who she disrespected?

Also there is no mention that the ceremony was ruined.. Not sure where you get that information from.

And again, like I said so do the student take this as very serious. Why would you assume they do not.. Just because she inserted the word "Hell" does not mean she did not take the ceremony seriously. That's your opinion of this situation.

Oh one last thing..

If


Give me the proper definition of "Heck" as in the use she intended it to be in her speech as an interjection ?

OK so you didn't deny she was a Model student before hand so all of a fraction of a second she turns from one into a deviant and than back again.. WOW..

You have a very bad habit stating things that people have not said..it adds no value to a discussion.

I stated I dont deny she had been a model student prior to her action.....I never claimed she went back again to being a model student ...at this time she apparently isnt or she would make an apology rather than act like a victim for her own crime.

To further the fact that she WAS a model student makes it worse as she knew better

Oh yah what about what her accomplices ? Why do they not get punished as they are as guilty as her in the eyes of the law ?

There are no accomplishes she gave the speech solo.....but I see where you are trying to go with this...you are only harming your own argument as it shows that there was thought beforehand before she committed to cursing .....premeditated "crime" if you will...this goes against the fraction of a second of prior argument that you claim.

No I made the point that a valedictorian is not chosen for being a goof off or a bad student. Hence you have to be not just good for one year but all through high school..

That I can agree with...however that doesn't negate the fact that she cursed ...what it does show that this was out of her character...now go back and read above about premeditation.

If you read my post it says and I quote "You could claim". That may be why we have a failure to communicate as there is a big difference.

Why would I do such?......Perhaps you could claim such..but that would go against your prior arguments as premeditation has now been established .

Seeing she got applause and congratulated for her speech I can't help but wonder who she disrespected?

An applause is pretty standard...and does not negate the fact that she broke the rules.

Also there is no mention that the ceremony was ruined.. Not sure where you get that information from.

This big cheese would disagree with you,just as several here disagree with you.
If that isnt enough she ruined it for herself as now her diploma is held hostage until a resolution.

And again, like I said so do the student take this as very serious. Why would you assume they do not.

Which further harms your own argument as it shows that the students also take this matter seriously...Ruined for them as well??

Just because she inserted the word "Hell" does not mean she did not take the ceremony seriously.

That's your opinion of this situation.

I have not took such position....my position is cursing at said function is a serious matter.

Oh one last thing..

If


Give me the proper definition of "Heck" as in the use she intended it to be in her speech as an interjection ?

IF has no use here...she made the decision to curse.
But I see where you are trying to go with this so I will save you the furthering frustration.
For comparitive purposes.
Taking a shit and bowel movement mean the same thing...now which term is proper use of language at an important school function.

 

[Tangerine]

Since when does a high school principal have the unmitigated authority to decide who gets a diploma? Last time I checked public schools were not ruled by dictators. I'd be curious to see what procedures were followed.

And as for the possibility of lawsuits, there are plenty of cases of parents and students suing schools when administrators over-reach their authority and over-react. I can think of two in fairly recent memory where courts got involved and side with the parents/students and cost school systems money and resulted in the administrators (rightfully) losing their jobs.

One was a case where a child in something like the 5th grade was expelled for bringing a tiny (and I mean GI Joe-sized) plastic handgun to school in his bag. He was told he violated the school's "zero tolerance" policy on weapons and simulated weapons. The other was a case where a principal cancelled a school prom because there were two girls who had announced their intentions of coming as a couple. The zealot principal first tried to tell them he would not allow them in. When threatened with a lawsuit, he decided he would just cancel the entire prom to prevent their attendance. Not only was he sued by the parents of one of the kids in question, several other parents of kids not involved also went to court saying he was overstepping his authority by taking away something their kids were promised through no action or fault of their own. There was no money awarded, but the principal was fired and a judge ruled the school must hold the prom and couldn't restrict access to it simply because of being a same sex couple.

This case, IMO is the same thing. An over-reacting, heavy-handed ego-driven administrator trying to make a point and display his authority. Nothing positive will be taught to any kids under his care because of this, and he should not be allowed to be in a position of influence over teens and young adults anymore.

 

[The Man]

IMO she needs a good spanking for intentionally causing a disturbance at said function.

 

[Tangerine]

IMO she needs a good spanking for intentionally causing a disturbance at said function.

Evidence that she caused a disturbance? From all I've read only one person had any reaction at all - the principal.

In fact, the first the girl or anyone knew of any issue was well after the graduation ceremony when she went to the office to pick up her diploma.

 

[AUFred]

IMO she needs a good spanking for intentionally causing a disturbance at said function.

That would be a parental decision.

 

[The Man]

Evidence that she caused a disturbance? From all I've read only one person had any reaction at all - the principal.

In fact, the first the girl or anyone knew of any issue was well after the graduation ceremony when she went to the office to pick up her diploma.

The other students were laughing and applauding

 

[The Man]

That would be a parental decision.

Sadly the father supports her while being aware of her modified speech and the purpose of its change.

To make matters worse all the girl has to do is get out a piece of paper and write a short apology letter to get her diploma.

 

[The Man]

Holding a diploma hostage for misconduct is nothing new as this school here also wants an apology.

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THE VALEDICTORIAN of a Brooklyn high school was escorted out of the building and denied her diploma yesterday because she trashed the school in a scorching graduation speech.

The school says it won't give Tiffany Schley her sheepskin until she says she's sorry - but the 17-year-old is unrepentant.

"I was speaking for my peers," Tiffany told the Daily News. "We've been living with this for four years."


http://articles.nydailynews.com/200...-school-officials-next-week-school-s-problems

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Hardly any cases makes the news...I am not sure why they are making a fuss of diploma denial in the last few weeks in regard to bad behavior.

Child acts up..they apologize later and get diploma{if not they mail it}...been that way for decades.

 

[AUFred]

I think this is being made a lot bigger deal than it really is.

 

[Tangerine]

The other students were laughing and applauding

OMG Applauding! How DARE they disrupt a ceremony with such scandalous behavior!!!



I wonder... and this is just a hunch... but maybe they were applauding the content of her speech and not just the fact that she said a word that hasn't been considered profane in a public sense for last 35 years or so?

 

[The Man]

OMG Applauding! How DARE they disrupt a ceremony with such scandalous behavior!!!



I wonder... and this is just a hunch... but maybe they were applauding the content of her speech and not just the fact that she said a word that hasn't been considered profane in a public sense for last 35 years or so?

OMG Applauding! How DARE they disrupt a ceremony with such scandalous behavior!!!

I stated laughing and applauding ...this occurred during the speech..A proper speech gets applauded after the speech

I wonder... and this is just a hunch... but maybe they were applauding the content of her speech

No they were applauding and laughing her for her defiant behavior of cursing

not just the fact that she said a word that hasn't been considered profane in a public sense for last 35 years or so

It was profane in her own mind as she wrote heck in her speech ..but changed it to hell during the speech due to peer pressure

While it may not be profane to you or I...it was to her and can be for many people in the audience.

 

[Kakapo Dundee]

I think this is being made a lot bigger deal than it really is.

I concur.

 

[The Man]

lets look at it like this had it been the principal that said hell the liberals would be throwing a fit and wanting him terminated.

"We are going to have one hell of a graduation tonight....You should be proud of your children...Hell I know I am proud of them.

" Now I would like to have you listen to the speech by the valedictorian...One hell of a girl"

Some one asks in the audience how long the ceremony last...Principal says.."hell if I know"

This was a school function ...not a sports bar.
Hell is unacceptable language for a school function

 

[The Man]

I concur.

Yes....all she has to do is write a short letter of apology for her misconduct and get her diploma...if not they will mail it to her anyway

 

[The Man]

Yes....all she has to do is write a short letter of apology for her misconduct and get her diploma...if not they will mail it to her anyway

Everyone would be a winner...she could be the little rebel she wanted to be..even make a copy of her letter before turning it in and brag to her future friends with it...

"yeah I wrote this fake apology and the fool gave me my diploma"

 

[AUFred]

All that needs happen is the Principal needs the stick removed from his butt and let life move on.

 

[Tangerine]

I stated laughing and applauding ...this occurred during the speech..A proper speech gets applauded after the speech





No they were applauding and laughing her for her defiant behavior of cursing


It was profane in her own mind as she wrote heck in her speech ..but changed it to hell during the speech due to peer pressure

While it may not be profane to you or I...it was to her and can be for many people in the audience.

Your ability to understand the thoughts and motivations of people you've never met in a situation where you were not present is quite impressive. Can you also move objects with your mind?

What we all SHOULD be laughing at is your ability to take things that you either assume, think, or simply want to believe - state them as fact - and then re-use them as facts in your argument over and over again.

 

[Tangerine]

A proper speech gets applauded after the speech

Ever watch the President of the United States give a speech? Something tells me they might have a different opinion.

 

[The Man]

Your ability to understand the thoughts and motivations of people you've never met in a situation where you were not present is quite impressive. Can you also move objects with your mind?

What we all SHOULD be laughing at is your ability to take things that you either assume, think, or simply want to believe - state them as fact - and then re-use them as facts in your argument over and over again.

Your ability to understand the thoughts and motivations of people you've never met in a situation where you were not present is quite impressive.

And as usual you are beginning to show your ass with your lack of debating skills...as above is exactly what you are doing.
Perhaps you should read the articles....but if that isnt enough we dont have to be a genius to understand ...that when children root for you to say hell at a speech and you say it/there is going to be chuckling and clapping.

What we all SHOULD be laughing at is your ability to take things that you either assume, think, or simply want to believe - state them as fact - and then re-use them as facts in your argument over and over again

Thats your opinion...but what we really laugh ass is when you get your ass slaughtered in the forum and watch you begin to post like a teen age girl...as that is exactly as you come across..