Can Destiny and Free Will Coexist?

[Accountable]

People talk about things happening because of destiny. "We were meant to be together." "It's God's Will that she died." At the same time, these same people talk about taking responsibility for one's own actions. :wtf:

I say you can't have it both ways. Either God had predestined every person's future - which means we are completely free from responsibility and only need to kick back and wait for life to happen - or we are completely free (and therefore responsible) to make our lives as good or bad as we are capable.

I believe in God, and that God has plans for each of us, but those plans no more direct our lives than the plans any parent has for any child. We determine our own destinies.

Free Will negates any possibility of Destiny, and Destiny negates any possibility of Free Will. They cannot possibly coexist.

What say you?

 

[Peter Parka]

Destiny is a load of crap which has zero evidence to back it up with.

 

[Accountable]

Destiny is a load of crap which has zero evidence to back it up with.

You were destined to say that.

 

[lonemeditater]

You were destined to say that.

I think destiny and free will are just ways people try to understand why things happen and why certain people are more furtunate while others have what are considered to be "poor lives." The ideas may appear to be opposite, but they seem to define each other in some senses. In discussion these ideas are defined as opposites, but in actuallity they seem to carry out each other's purposes. A belief in predestination is a belief that everything that happens is supposed to happen, and the future is set on that path. A belief in the power of will, rather than destiny, is the belief that we create the paths that we follow in life. The funny thing is that by doing what you own will, you will do what you are supposed to do, which would be fulfilling your destiny anyway. Another funny thing is that if you choose to believe in destiny, in following your "destiny" you're merely living out your life in a way that you believe you're supposed to, but since there is no actual guide for each specifc life, it all boils down to you making the decisions anyway.

In short it's a pointless topic because in the end,and in all truth, you are only DESTINED to do what you WILL. It's like trying to prove that anything exists. >_>

 

[All Else Failed]

I've always wondered if we really have "free will". I usually come out thinking that if we do have it, its extremely limited in scope, and is subordinate to our brain's activity.

destiny is crap.

 

[canidae]

One destiny is sure - death (at least in the limited human understanding of the physical sense . . . so maybe that's up for grabs as well)

 

[Peter Parka]

Taking a piss and a shit is a pretty sure thing too now that I think about it

 

[canidae]

Taking a piss and a shit is a pretty sure thing too now that I think about it

Yeah, but ya can control that . . . to some degree More free will at play

 

[Accountable]

I've always wondered if we really have "free will". I usually come out thinking that if we do have it, its extremely limited in scope, and is subordinate to our brain's activity.

destiny is crap.

Saying free will is subordinate to our brain's activity is like saying the computer is subordinate to the cpu. It's the brain that makes the decision, not the will that tells the brain what to decide.

Perhaps you're talking about instinct? If we're mostly instinct, then what of personal responsibility?

 

[Accountable]

I think destiny and free will are just ways people try to understand why things happen and why certain people are more furtunate while others have what are considered to be "poor lives." The ideas may appear to be opposite, but they seem to define each other in some senses. In discussion these ideas are defined as opposites, but in actuallity they seem to carry out each other's purposes. A belief in predestination is a belief that everything that happens is supposed to happen, and the future is set on that path. A belief in the power of will, rather than destiny, is the belief that we create the paths that we follow in life. The funny thing is that by doing what you own will, you will do what you are supposed to do, which would be fulfilling your destiny anyway. Another funny thing is that if you choose to believe in destiny, in following your "destiny" you're merely living out your life in a way that you believe you're supposed to, but since there is no actual guide for each specifc life, it all boils down to you making the decisions anyway.

In short it's a pointless topic because in the end,and in all truth, you are only DESTINED to do what you WILL. It's like trying to prove that anything exists. >_>

Maybe, but we have to start somewhere. I think, therefore I am. The decision to be made here is either 1) I do because I must, or 2) I do because I choose. We'll never find out until we come out the other end (or not) whether we are right in either sense.

I choose to believe that my choices are mine and mine alone. By doing so, I'm left out there without the safety net of saying it was "God's Will" or that it was "meant to be," should I fuck something up. But if I succeed, I'm not hypocritical by taking the credit.

 

[All Else Failed]

Saying free will is subordinate to our brain's activity is like saying the computer is subordinate to the cpu. It's the brain that makes the decision, not the will that tells the brain what to decide.

Perhaps you're talking about instinct? If we're mostly instinct, then what of personal responsibility?

Yeah I know, I just worded it strangely.

 

[lumpenstein]

Destiny, il n'existe pas!
Free will is a relative term. Will and any attempt to exercise is always bound by social and moral law.

 

[Accountable]

Destiny, il n'existe pas!
Free will is a relative term. Will and any attempt to exercise is always bound by social and moral law.

Law does not prevent us from exercising our will; it only changes the consequences. :cool

 

[lumpenstein]

Law does not prevent us from exercising our will; it only changes the consequences. :cool

Sure it does! Both social and moral codes stop a person from exercising their will all the time, if not the laws wouldn't exist.

 

[Accountable]

Sure it does! Both social and moral codes stop a person from exercising their will all the time, if not the laws wouldn't exist.

The codes themselves do not stop us. The consequences of breaking the codes help us decide whether to exercise our will toward satisfying ourdesire of self-indulgence or desire of belonging. It seems like a minor difference on the surface, but it's the difference between free will and destiny.

A child touches a hot stove. It hurts! The next time the child has an opportunity to touch the stove he doesn't. Is it because he can't? Of course not. Does the rule of "don't touch hot things" stop him? No, if it did he wouldn't have touched it the first time. Does the pain stop him? No, he wouldn't feel pain unless he actually touched the stove, and only then if it were hot. The child could still touch the stove if he chose to.

People use their free will to obey or break social and moral codes all the time. If no one ever broke the codes, the codes would not exist. We wouldn't need them.

 

[StfuitzD]

Personally, I do not believe in Destiny ( my name is Destiny )
I don't think anyone is meant to be/do anything.. I think you yourself needs to work for it.

I don't think they're a reasons to things that happen, it's just me.. I just don't believe in any of that

 

[Accountable]

Personally, I do not believe in Destiny ( my name is Destiny )
I don't think anyone is meant to be/do anything.. I think you yourself needs to work for it.

I don't think they're a reasons to things that happen, it's just me.. I just don't believe in any of that

Thanks and welcome!

 

[Jack Sparrow]

For me both are one and the same

 

[Hans]

You cannot prove destiny in life.

The only way you can is if 1)There is an afterlife 2)There is something in the afterlife that confirms destiny.

That being said, I think Im on a railroad, and even if I think I am making a choice, its all just me playing my roll. However, that fact doesnt bother me in the slightest.

 

[Accountable]

For me both are one and the same

How?

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