Flying to Canada? The U.S.A. wants your details...

[Siphorous]

...even if the flight doesn't pass over U.S. territory.

Unbelievable.

http://www.independent.co.uk/travel...immigration-may-have-other-ideas-7584912.html

Simon Hughes, the deputy leader of the Liberal Democrats, told The Independent: "The concern by the US for its own security is entirely understandable, but it seems to me it's a whole different issue that American wishes should determine the rights and choices of people travelling between two countries neither of which is the US."

 

[Dana]

Bullshit... America the world police force whether you like it or not.

 

[purpledove]

:eek That's ridiculous. It's understandable if a connecting flight etc lands or flies the airspace of US but if not, why do it for everyone? :dunno

on a side note, you're lucky Siph that you've visited US for many times b4. To say the least, they might already have your info and it's just an update. For others tho' it's a hassle.

 

[Siphorous]

For me, they'll have my info for sure and I got thumbprinted one time so undoubtedly I'm in there somewhere. However, the ESTA stuff needs to be renewed every two years so I daresay I'll have to do that for the next time I visit.

But yes... for Canadian/Caribbean visitors who don't have any intention of visiting the U.S. - it does take the biscuit.

 

[Francis]

This was an agreement our Conservative Government believed would help Canadians cross the border faster as US pressure was being put on closing down those entry points and making it much tougher to get in.. Seems many Southern Congressmen and Senators had concerns that Canadians had a very leaky border crossing so they put pressure on to get such an agreement..

But the reality is most that would cross illegally would not do it at a border crossing.. :willy_nilly:

Some of you may remember the thread about the 1000 miles of unprotected land between Canada and the US that raged on a while back. Anyone who could survive crossing that land deserves entry as most of it is in the deepest of lakes and over the highest of snow covered mountains..

The fact Canadians had more to worry about people crossing this 1000 stretch of land was never considered but hey when money talks and you can put your State and Economy on the map who gives a fuck who you hurt right.. :willy_nilly:

So Canada signed this agreement.. You judge who was the winner..

Critics of the deal, however, say that in coming to this agreement, Canadians may be trading away too much personal information in favour of improved commerce. A main tenet of the deal is that both countries will share all data regarding who comes and goes.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2011/12/07/f-border-deal-details.html

 

[Darrell]

Bullshit... America the world police force whether you like it or not.

You have America mistaken for the UN.

 

[Francis]

You have America mistaken for the UN.

Repped..

 

[skyblue]

Bullshit... America the world police force whether you like it or not.

so dana,as a single nation what exactly does america police on its own with no help from other nations?

 

[Siphorous]

This was an agreement our Conservative Government believed would help Canadians cross the border faster as US pressure was being put on closing down those entry points and making it much tougher to get in.. Seems many Southern Congressmen and Senators had concerns that Canadians had a very leaky border crossing so they put pressure on to get such an agreement..

But the reality is most that would cross illegally would not do it at a border crossing.. :willy_nilly:

Some of you may remember the thread about the 1000 miles of unprotected land between Canada and the US that raged on a while back. Anyone who could survive crossing that land deserves entry as most of it is in the deepest of lakes and over the highest of snow covered mountains..

The fact Canadians had more to worry about people crossing this 1000 stretch of land was never considered but hey when money talks and you can put your State and Economy on the map who gives a fuck who you hurt right.. :willy_nilly:

So Canada signed this agreement.. You judge who was the winner..



http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2011/12/07/f-border-deal-details.html

I read that article and watched the two videos on the page. It seems exactly as you say, to facilitate easier border access for people and trade but at a cost of including other information it seems. The John Baird video only mentions 3rd country nationals briefly and gives the impression (as no doubt any politician would) that this is all sweetness and light for Canadians. Certainly the information for 3rd country nationals will be shared when you look at this (page 5):

http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/wh/us-canada-btb-action-plan.pdf

 

[Francis]

I read that article and watched the two videos on the page. It seems exactly as you say, to facilitate easier border access for people and trade but at a cost of including other information it seems. The John Baird video only mentions 3rd country nationals briefly and gives the impression (as no doubt any politician would) that this is all sweetness and light for Canadians. Certainly the information for 3rd country nationals will be shared when you look at this (page 5):

http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/wh/us-canada-btb-action-plan.pdf

It is and it is not as "transparent" as one makes it sound..

Take as example a trip to the US I am planning.. As I book my plane ticket I must include my passport # and name or I get a rejection now.. This is new as on the start of 2012 and is mandatory, including where I will stay and ( name and address ) as well as who I am travelling with.

I wonder how many US Citizens must fill in this type of information when they fly within the US or to Canada ?

Keeping in mind my schedule could change and I certainly have no objection to stating this information, it usually is mandatory on the immigration form, why must it now be included on "Airline" flights ?

 

[Siphorous]

It is and it is not as "transparent" as one makes it sound..

Take as example a trip to the US I am planning.. As I book my plane ticket I must include my passport # and name or I get a rejection now.. This is new as on the start of 2012 and is mandatory, including where I will stay and ( name and address ) as well as who I am travelling with.

I wonder how many US Citizens must fill in this type of information when they fly within the US or to Canada ?

Keeping in mind my schedule could change and I certainly have no objection to stating this information, it usually is mandatory on the immigration form, why must it now be included on "Airline" flights ?

An interesting point. The agreement and the John Baird video gives the impression that Canada will be tightening security to 'match' U.S. standards. Will they be introducing an ESTA like initiative? John Baird also made reference to people who come in on a 6 month visa (presumably visitor) and that they have no idea if they left or not. Seemed to be saying that this would change [my assumption].

 

[Francis]

An interesting point. The agreement and the John Baird video gives the impression that Canada will be tightening security to 'match' U.S. standards. Will they be introducing an ESTA like initiative? John Baird also made reference to people who come in on a 6 month visa (presumably visitor) and that they have no idea if they left or not. Seemed to be saying that this would change [my assumption].

Again, I think the issue is one sided.. I have to fill in this information, while my counterparts in the US don't seem to know what I am talking about nor have to do so when coming to Canada.

I have no problems doing commonly shared responsibilities but it seems this one is one sided.. Perhaps it is just being delayed on the other side which seems to defeat the purpose of following their system..