Grief

[Panacea]

I've been thinking a lot about grief/bereavement lately, and this article pushed me to make a thread.

http://m.detnews.com/lifestyles/article?a=2012202230406&f=1217

What is your take on grief and how it should be treated and viewed by not only professionals but by everyone?
How much grief seems normal to you, or is it limitless?

My dad has lost about 8 friends and family in the past four years, and he's really degraded. He's been emotional and his substance abuse has increased, but he's actually been easier to talk to and more open.

My supervisor lost her dad after a 6 year battle with lung cancer well over a year ago, and she's been wicked ever since. Her worst attributes have come out in full force.


I think both of these people need help of some kind, because they've been put under extreme turmoil and my supervisor isn't experiencing any improvements with time. Seems too much to go through alone.

It's been bothering me regarding my supervisor, because she's used her grief as an excuse to be abusive to
pretty much every single human being she encounters for well over a year. She's been so horrible I refuse to really speak to her, and I get nauseous thinking about seeing her. I find myself struggling to feel any sympathy at all for her, because I don't think it's fair to hurt other people when you hurt.

She deserves support and compassion, but when is a person's grief not an excuse any longer?
Idk, just all made me think.

 

[Dana]

I dunno... I have a friend whose lost a few people this year and she has her moments... I havent really lost anyone close to me yet.

 

[pjbleek]

when dad died I was 21 and my family was/is not a real emotional. when Mom passed away in October it was different because she touched us all in different ways and the emotions were checked at the door again, but I couldn't hold it in..I was bawling something fierce...and while others may hold it in if you feel to let it out then by all means...

 

[Aeval]

I don't know how much is enough....it's a tough call, but to me, there comes a time when you have to snap out of it and realize life goes on. You have to mourn the loss of a loved one, of course, but you have to cherish the time you had with them as well.

Losing someone is a reminder of our own mortality as well and I guess some people can't deal with that and lose sight of living...fear...regret...loss...whatever it is that stops them from moving on is wasted energy.

Rambling sorry....I have several thoughts bouncing around in my head and I just can't seem to mold them into what I want to say....

 

[pjbleek]

I don't know how much is enough....it's a tough call, but to me, there comes a time when you have to snap out of it and realize life goes on. You have to mourn the loss of a loved one, of course, but you have to cherish the time you had with them as well.

Losing someone is a reminder of our own mortality as well and I guess some people can't deal with that and lose sight of living...fear...regret...loss...whatever it is that stops them from moving on is wasted energy.

Rambling sorry....I have several thoughts bouncing around in my head and I just can't seem to mold them into what I want to say....

its never easy...
:smiley31::smiley31::smiley31::smiley31::smiley31::smiley31::smiley31:

 

[Panacea]

It's amazing how differently people handle it, my cousin was heavily criticized for appearing not to care whatsoever about his mother's unexpected death, and then you have my supervisor...neither grief in context "makes any sense", but it seems to usually be about something else all together.

 

[Kyle B]

My dad has lost about 8 friends and family in the past four years, and he's really degraded. He's been emotional and his substance abuse has increased, but he's actually been easier to talk to and more open.

My supervisor lost her dad after a 6 year battle with lung cancer well over a year ago, and she's been wicked ever since. Her worst attributes have come out in full force.


I think both of these people need help of some kind, because they've been put under extreme turmoil and my supervisor isn't experiencing any improvements with time. Seems too much to go through alone.

I wonder if this casts doubt over Kubler-Ross' theory. Maybe some people just take longer to grieve than others.

It's such a hard thing to understand unless you're in the shoes of the grieving. I myself have very little, to no exposure to grief because I haven't lost anyone close to me yet. It must be daunting though, to lose so many people around you. People who die real old experience that. They slowly lose all of those who grew up with them until they themselves finally go.

 

[Panacea]

What's good about that theory is I don't think it was intended to dictate length of stages...I'd assume some could get stuck in a stage for a while, but it's believed we all go through them eventually? It's interesting.

I think more than anything it's about personality and life experience...
My dad has expressed feeling like he's "next in line", which is scary for sure.

 

[Staci]

everyone experiences grief differently. there is no right or wrong way to grieve. i do agree that at some point if the grief has overcome you and taken over your daily life, then yes there is a point on which one must move on.

 

[Alien Allen]

everyone experiences grief differently. there is no right or wrong way to grieve. i do agree that at some point if the grief has overcome you and taken over your daily life, then yes there is a point on which one must move on.

well stated

not much more to add

 

[HK]

I think we have a tendency to believe our own personal way of dealing with something is best. When I'm upset, I cry about it. So for me, someone who doesn't cry, or even really express their emotion about a bereavement at all, is unnatural. But if it works for them, if it means they can get through another day, then that's what they should do.


I agree that hurting other people just because you're hurt is a big reason to look at how you're coping and think about whether it's really working. It's one thing for grief to affect your own life. It's another to then take it and use it to make someone else miserable. I sort of understand if someone is hurting, how they'd want to lash out, but if it's become a substantial part of your interactions with others then it needs fixing.

 

[Panacea]

I agree, I suppose I know a lot of people who use destruction (either of themselves or others) to handle problems and get to that next day. Over the years I've gotten pretty nervy because of this...it's difficult for me to have compassion when I'm getting attacked, and to say "ok, this woman is just suffering, I will let her abuse me" lol. I tend to just avoid these people but at work it's impossible!

She's been reprimanded for her behaviors by a very compassionate higher up, and it seems to be helping *fingers crossed*

 

[NoDak]

everyone experiences grief differently. there is no right or wrong way to grieve. i do agree that at some point if the grief has overcome you and taken over your daily life, then yes there is a point on which one must move on.

I think we have a tendency to believe our own personal way of dealing with something is best.

HK's statement pretty much summarizes the gray areas that abound in the grieving process. How many times has someone lost a spouse and 6 mos. later, they're dating? Makes for a few raised eyebrows, doesn't it? However, that person may have what it takes to move on rather quickly, whereas another might pine for the lost spouse for years, or the rest of their lives. Grief is as individual as the one grieving.

However, I cannot find it in myself to excuse abusive behavior by using the grief factor. I can see it happening for a time, perhaps, but, that stage needs to be passed and move along. Is the supervisor using her grief as a crutch? So many people do. They use it to try to get special favors from others. I call it "milking it out". Grieving does not give us a free pass to be assholes to everybody around us. If we have a hard time moving along, it's our responsibility to take a moment to assess self and, possibly, see professional treatment.

I could write a short book on the subject, but, not here. I was up close and personal to the grieving of a lady who lost her son to suicide. Ain't fun, I'll tell you that.

 

[Panacea]

I know a couple people grieving the loss of loved ones to suicide, actually, and you're right, it's hard. Their cases are so different, and they're such genuinely heart broken people...my heart breaks for them. It's been a long time too, but I think a tragedy like that really rocks people.

My supervisor, in my honest opinion, similar to my dad, is experiencing a flood of issues she's ignored and told herself she's coping with and allowing it to ride on the grief bandwagon (because something like that really does open the flood gates for some). I don't think any of the things she's doing are because her dad is gone. It's because she's experiencing a lot of painful emotions she's held back for years and someone needs to pay for it. Just my two cents.

 

[MjaneGibson]

This is a really good question, so kudos to you for asking it.

Grief is probably the hardest, and most complex emotion that I think any person can feel. It has so many dimensions and possibilities that it's hard for me to have any definite takes on it, and while I haven't lost a parent, child, or sibling, I have seen a lot of people who have and have seen how debilitating it can be.

My best friend of 12 years has seen more loss than I think anyone should ever have to be put through. Her mother, after suffering from hepatitis C (she was a nurse and stuck herself accidentally), died in March 12, 2002. Obviously devastated, she grieved in the rather unhealthy way of drinking and smoking too many cigarettes...can't blame her. After making a steady adjustment back to her life, her father was killed in a head on collision on, get this: March 21, 2004. It was a quick downward spiral to cutting, drinking and coke, and back around again. It took her years to be able to tolerate just being in her own skin without cutting it or screaming. But, she did it...and I think that based on her circumstances, she did a pretty good job. I am happy to say, she is doing wonderfully

I know that you posted this quite a long time ago, and I sure hope that everything with your father and friend has proven to have gotten better. It's possible that they did need intervention...my friend did, and it took a lot of letters, yelling, and hugs to get her that help, but she did.

I think the important thing for people to remember is that the death of someone close to you is so traumatic and matter-of-fact that it a person needs to be given ample time to grieve. I have often seen, not just with my friend, but with many others, that people often get irritated with the length of time one grieves, irritated with how they grieve, and far too often try to "fix" the pain their loved ones are feelings. While understandable, and in some cases, noble, it's not something that necessarily needs fixing, but just...love. Cheesy, sure...but what else is there?

I've been thinking a lot about grief/bereavement lately, and this article pushed me to make a thread.

http://m.detnews.com/lifestyles/article?a=2012202230406&f=1217

What is your take on grief and how it should be treated and viewed by not only professionals but by everyone?
How much grief seems normal to you, or is it limitless?

My dad has lost about 8 friends and family in the past four years, and he's really degraded. He's been emotional and his substance abuse has increased, but he's actually been easier to talk to and more open.

My supervisor lost her dad after a 6 year battle with lung cancer well over a year ago, and she's been wicked ever since. Her worst attributes have come out in full force.


I think both of these people need help of some kind, because they've been put under extreme turmoil and my supervisor isn't experiencing any improvements with time. Seems too much to go through alone.

It's been bothering me regarding my supervisor, because she's used her grief as an excuse to be abusive to
pretty much every single human being she encounters for well over a year. She's been so horrible I refuse to really speak to her, and I get nauseous thinking about seeing her. I find myself struggling to feel any sympathy at all for her, because I don't think it's fair to hurt other people when you hurt.

She deserves support and compassion, but when is a person's grief not an excuse any longer?
Idk, just all made me think.

 

[skyblue]

My supervisor lost her dad after a 6 year battle with lung cancer well over a year ago, and she's been wicked ever since. Her worst attributes have come out in full force.

it effects people in different ways,its 5 years now since i lost my dad and i dont think i'm over it even now

 

[Panacea]

it effects people in different ways,its 5 years now since i lost my dad and i dont think i'm over it even now

I don't know if anyone ever really gets "over it" when they lose a loved one. Seems to stay with us forever, because we are always reminded of them and how much we loved them. I think active grief, severe anxiety and mood changes for dozens of months is a bit concerning for that person's sake, though.

 

[MjaneGibson]

Just a quick blurb...I didn't realize that you wrote this yesterday...I was looking at when you joined lol. Sorry!

 

[NoDak]

Just a quick blurb...I didn't realize that you wrote this yesterday...I was looking at when you joined lol. Sorry!

Doesn't really matter what was posted and when. This is a subject that's current stuff at any time. I'm appreciating the thoughts expressed here. Nobody's right, nobody's wrong on any of it.

 

[zen]

Tough to be able to quantify as it is entirely subjective. I'm sure that, psychologically speaking, there is a time allotment for healthy emotionally balanced people. I also think that recovery is different depending on how the death occurred. Sudden, or after an illness. If one of my children died I can honestly say that I don't ever see me being the same after.

By the time I was 17 I had been exposed to quite a few deaths. Friends through misadventure, cousins, other family, etc... At 17 my dad died after a long illness. He died at home, and I remember sitting beside his body feeling relief for him. I still think about him....but the pain is gone and all is left is a memory.

I have carried more coffins than I care to think about.

Life goes on......