What To Do About Social Security?

What should be done about Social Security?

  • I'm under 30- Keep it like it is, fix in 10-20 years.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I'm under 30- Tweak it now raising taxes/lowering benefits to keep solvent.

    Votes: 2 15.4%
  • I'm under 30- Shut down, but pay and refund.*

    Votes: 4 30.8%
  • I'm under 30- Shut it down, cut off the people, don't refund the money paid into it.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I'm 30 or older- Keep it like it is, fix in 10-20 years.

    Votes: 2 15.4%
  • I'm 30 or older- Tweak it now by raising taxes/lowering benefits to keep solvent.

    Votes: 1 7.7%
  • I'm 30 or older- Shut down, but pay and refund.*

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I'm 30 or older- Shut it down, cut off the people on it, don't refund the money paid into it.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • I'm undecided- (please say why if you can).

    Votes: 1 7.7%
  • Other- (please explain your alternative).

    Votes: 3 23.1%

  • Total voters
    13

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Minor Axis

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What would you do?

* Options 3 and 7 mean, you shut down SS, but you keep paying those currently on the system and you refund what people have paid into the system but have not reached 65 years old. Taxes would be used to pay the people currently on the system.

Honestly I'm torn between tweaking and shut down, with pay and refund. The problem with shutdown, most likely there would be no refunds so you'd have some people paying what turns out to be a huge tax over their life times.

(This board makes you make the post first for people to see, then do the poll, hence the confusion.)
 
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Springsteen

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You need to explain more. I don't pay attention.

OIC

Well I say tweak it. Just gently you know, see what happens. If a positive impact is made, then continue.
 

Atomic Sky

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Social Security is a relic of the Great Depression, it hasn't been put to the chopping block for a variety of reason ranging from need to political pandering. Unfortunately it's slowly begun to rot away for various reasons, and politicians from both sides of the aisle refuse to deal with the problem without being absolutely forced to deal with it, and if I where in thier shoes I'd probably be of the same opinion. Afterall, the party that winds up doing away with Social Security is going to alienate a pretty substantial voting group.


However, something must be done because eventually it's going to be a gigantic fiasco. Theorethically you can have the government issue bonds to cover the current debt of the program. End people paying in (get rid of the payroll tax) and close out the system. Tis way you can pay out to those that have already paid in. Eventually you'll have to sell government assests to cover the pay back on the bonds, however, this is far better than having the program going belly up while there are still people depending on it.

The cost of Social Security and Medicare over the next 75 years is $103.2 Trillion, and the amount they plan on taking in (from payroll tax and other sources) is only around $60 trillion. Which leaves a big gap to cover. Best estimates show that the Social Security fund will run out of money in their trust fund by within my lifetime. The program is going to be bankrupt by 2040. Which means that most people that are currently in highschool and college today will then enter the workforce and beggin paying in but will never see a penny coming out unless something is done, So, what's the point of having them pay in in the first place when there is no way the government can deliver without some serious overhauling? Whether that overhauling be severly raising the age which you can start collecting and limiting who can collect benefits or by increasing taxes to draw in more funds for Social Secuity or demoing the program is irrevlevant because something must be done. Granted ending the program like this means that people will need to start putting money away for retirement in private accounts, investments or other ways, but even if they keep the program running we're going to need to do that anyway because after they run out of money to pay out, we'll be up a creek if we haven't done that anyway.

Unfortunately, I see the government waiting until the last possible second to do something. Essentially the current generation is stating "it's not our problem" and dumping it on the plate of the next generation. I fear this will lead to serious problems in the future.

Response to poll: I'm under 30- Shut down, but pay and refund.*

I'm not really a stalwart when it comes to this issue. I'm rather pragmatic. I don't mind comprimise, and I don't really care what they do in regards to Social Security as long as the problem is fixed.
 

Accountable

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I've said since I was 30 that I wish they'd pick a cutoff date and pay SS to those born on or after that date as the program currently stands, and not pay those before it. I'm fine with picking the date right after my birthday. The important thing is that we get rid of it.
 

Dakota Jim

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I notice all the militant "shut it down" types are young. Ask your parents, grandparents who paid in their entire working time what they think. If the politicians had not eliminated the trust fund and converted the funds into the general fund, if they had not lumped disability, some elements of unemployment, medicaid into it.....you could have depended on it when you retired. Youth fades and old age is the inevitable.
 

Accountable

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I notice all the militant "shut it down" types are young. Ask your parents, grandparents who paid in their entire working time what they think. If the politicians had not eliminated the trust fund and converted the funds into the general fund, if they had not lumped disability, some elements of unemployment, medicaid into it.....you could have depended on it when you retired. Youth fades and old age is the inevitable.
How can you tell that??
 

nova

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I notice all the militant "shut it down" types are young. Ask your parents, grandparents who paid in their entire working time what they think. If the politicians had not eliminated the trust fund and converted the funds into the general fund, if they had not lumped disability, some elements of unemployment, medicaid into it.....you could have depended on it when you retired. Youth fades and old age is the inevitable.

I have asked my grandparents. They feel like they were robbed given what they paid in vs what they're pulling out...
 

Minor Axis

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I have asked my grandparents. They feel like they were robbed given what they paid in vs what they're pulling out...

Are you kidd'n? How long have your parents been on SS? I bet you a virtual dollar, they pull out more than they put into it if they live to an average age.
 

ann06d

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Just voted for you...

japcosplay06.jpg
 

IntruderLS1

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Are you kidd'n? How long have your parents been on SS? I bet you a virtual dollar, they pull out more than they put into it if they live to an average age.

Just stopping in to make my monthly post. ...

How does this make Social Security solvent again?

... Out of curiosity.
 

nova

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Are you kidd'n? How long have your parents been on SS? I bet you a virtual dollar, they pull out more than they put into it if they live to an average age.

On a monthly, inflation adjusted basis, they are pulling out less than what they paid in and their payments are much less than what they would have gotten putting their money into US gov't debt. If not for my grandmother's state employees retirement plan from all the years she spent teaching, they'd be really hard up for money...
 

Alien Allen

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robbing the fund just made it go belly up sooner.

There is no way it is sustainable when the worker to retiree ratio is so out of whack.

And every day nothing is done makes the problem that much more severe down the road.
 

boombala

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Another look at means testing according to income might prove beneficial; altho, this was unpopular when Ross Perot introduced the idea in 1992.
 

Minor Axis

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On a monthly, inflation adjusted basis, they are pulling out less than what they paid in and their payments are much less than what they would have gotten putting their money into US gov't debt. If not for my grandmother's state employees retirement plan from all the years she spent teaching, they'd be really hard up for money...

My father has been on SS for 20 years and he has received more back than he paid into it. Your Grandmother has a State Pension? Her type (someone with a pension) is becoming more rare each year. BTW, would you call her a socialist or a money grubbing labor low life? Just curious. :)
 

nova

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My father has been on SS for 20 years and he has received more back than he paid into it. Your Grandmother has a State Pension? Her type (someone with a pension) is becoming more rare each year. BTW, would you call her a socialist or a money grubbing labor low life? Just curious. :)

:clap Congratulations, just when I thought you couldn't make any statements any more asisine, you prove me wrong with your last sentence.

Firstly, your father is irrelevant to the conversation. My grandparents know what they paid in over the years. They know what they're pulling out. Its not hard to find a reputable inflation calculator. The inflation adjusted latter amount is less than the former amount.

Secondly, its not a pension per say. The state retirement plan is more like a state run 401k and is not really defined benefit. The plan was in trouble a few years ago because some moron invested too much of the contributions into WorldCom stock.
 

Minor Axis

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:clap Congratulations, just when I thought you couldn't make any statements any more asisine, you prove me wrong with your last sentence.

I'm starting to wonder if either you or retro in your zeal to defeat can recognize humor when it cracks you over the noggin. :D

Firstly, your father is irrelevant to the conversation. My grandparents know what they paid in over the years. They know what they're pulling out. Its not hard to find a reputable inflation calculator. The inflation adjusted latter amount is less than the former amount.

And if they had taken that money and put it into a savings account, or ... the stock market, they'd be much better off today?
 
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nova

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I'm starting to wonder if either you or retro in your zeal to defeat can recognize humor when it cracks you over the noggin. :D

Or your attempts at humor just suck....

And if they had taken that money and put it into a savings account, or ... the stock market, they'd be much better off today?

No question about it yes. My grandmother put a similar amount into the retirement plan and gets a lot more out of it.

Honestly we give our retirees a worse rate of return on SS than they would get buying our own gov'ts debt, basically less than we pay the red Chinese to finance us. If thats not honest to god evil I don't know what is.

Even worse is the fact that SS gives you no opportunity to build actual wealth to pass on to your family. When you're dead, its gone.

All of that would be fine if the politicians were honest and billed SS as a welfare program instead of a retirement plan but they don't.
 
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