Racism Or Nationalism?

[Peter Parka]

I was just wondering what your views are on this. When does nationalism get taken over by racism? In my country I find it a real shame that the English flag gets so often represented by racist football hooligans, the BNP and the like. I am proud of my flag and country but part of that is the ethnical aspect of our country. Its got to a point where curry is probably more readily associated with the English that it is India. There are lots of ethnic festivals and celebrations that go on over here and I have no problem with them, I enjoy them but I do think our own culture is being neglected in this PC society because of the risk of seeming racist. I really think St Georges day should be a bank holliday and I would like to see more of my countrymen celebrating it. If any idiot has a problem with it I'd just like to say "When in Rome, do as the Romans". Ethnic minorities have more freedom to celebrate their culture here than if we were in their country! Maybe they should think about that!

 

[sundvlfn88]

I Totally agree with you Peter. You couldn't have said better.

 

[dt3]

Something the US and UK apparently have in common...

 

[All Else Failed]

Im sort of split on this issue. A flag is merely a peice of cloth that identifies a country. No one has ever died for a flag, but for more important reasons. Now, nationalism I think is ok in some situations, but can get out of hand.

Now pete, you are upset at the fact that other cultures are being represented more and more in your country. I can understand why it makes you uneasy, its totally natural. But, I mean, what are you going to do? Melting pots happen, welcome to America pretty much.


That being said, I am proud of my ancestors. Although its hard to stop different cultures from interacting with each other.

 

[Peter Parka]

I'm not pissed off at all about ethnic minorities being represented in my culture, I embrace them if the're good, I just get pissed off when my own culture is made less important and scorned upon because these people find it racist.

 

[All Else Failed]

I'm not pissed off at all about ethnic minorities being represented in my culture, I embrace them if the're good, I just get pissed off when my own culture is made less important and scorned upon because these people find it racist.

Yeah, that would make me upset too. Thats why I plan on moving to Europe lol.

 

[memento_mori]

soccer hooligans waving the english flag around and calling the french a bunch of panzies is a long way away from the nazis, it's nowhere near the level of racism people would care about.

on that issue, it just seems like playful cockyness. and i think that comes as a backlash to all the similation you europeans seem to be doing. we had something similar in the states with the highway systems being built in the 50's. suddenly people were taking pride in their state culture and trying to set themselves apart from the others.

the PC thing requires a bit more clarification and context. i'm really not familiar with st georges day or its connotation to english minorities.

 

[IntruderLS1]

Dude.... Pete.... Preach it brother. I'm totally on your ship with this one.

To the melting pot mentioned above.... The melting pot was a good thing. The problem is, that now we don't have a melting pot anymore, we have this sort of tossed salad. Different cultures move in, and demand the right to maintain the "Old Country" in the new, and demand that the new country simply accept them with no insult.

I'm so sick to death of the racist card, I could just puke. Thinking our public school system should teach in English, and not Spanish does not mean I hate Mexicans.

 

[Peter Parka]

soccer hooligans waving the english flag around and calling the french a bunch of panzies is a long way away from the nazis, it's nowhere near the level of racism people would care about.

on that issue, it just seems like playful cockyness. and i think that comes as a backlash to all the similation you europeans seem to be doing. we had something similar in the states with the highway systems being built in the 50's. suddenly people were taking pride in their state culture and trying to set themselves apart from the others.

the PC thing requires a bit more clarification and context. i'm really not familiar with st georges day or its connotation to english minorities.

Its just like the way in certain areas the council takes ridiculous measures. During the World Cup in certain areas people were told not to hang out the St Georges cross in case ethnic minorities found it offensive yet in the same areas the Turks were taking to the streets waving their flags around whenever their team was doing well. That is just PC gone mad!:mad

 

[dt3]

Well, you gotta watch out for those damn soccer hooligans!

 

[All Else Failed]

Dude.... Pete.... Preach it brother. I'm totally on your ship with this one.

To the melting pot mentioned above.... The melting pot was a good thing. The problem is, that now we don't have a melting pot anymore, we have this sort of tossed salad. Different cultures move in, and demand the right to maintain the "Old Country" in the new, and demand that the new country simply accept them with no insult.

I'm so sick to death of the racist card, I could just puke. Thinking our public school system should teach in English, and not Spanish does not mean I hate Mexicans.

Well, I think its very useful to assimilate to a society, but you cant really just expect people to not want to keep some of their customs.

Hell, all of us are hypocrits when we talk about this, I wonder how a native American would feel about us talking about "people keeping their culture".

 

[raubin]

It is a real pity that the UK doesn't have any proper celebrations of the country. Here in Spain they seem to have a fiesta every bloody week! It does mess with your head and mixes the days up a bit!

That is one reason I would never move back to the UK, they care more about foreigns than it's own people, immigrants seem to have more rights than the English - they get a house, a car, money and benefits when we need anything they turn their back on you.

Where I used to live in Bournemouth, I used to get on the bus after work and I would 9 times out of ten be the only Englishman on the bus.

Peter will know this, in east London we play a game called spot the Englishman!

 

[raubin]

P.S - I am not racist, I just love my country and I am proud to be English

 

[memento_mori]

"I'm not racist, I hate everyone equally."

Its just like the way in certain areas the council takes ridiculous measures. During the World Cup in certain areas people were told not to hang out the St Georges cross in case ethnic minorities found it offensive yet in the same areas the Turks were taking to the streets waving their flags around whenever their team was doing well. That is just PC gone mad!:mad

people have a right to separate what offends them from what they consider acceptable, especially when they're trying to define their social identity. blacks get the right to say 'we don't like being called niggers' as much as you have the right to say 'i don't like being called dumbass.'

with that said, people are getting offended too easily these days. not only are they being offended, but they don't seem to want to forgive that easily.

and now we have governments trying to get into the frey to enforce not stepping on people's toes. this is some really dangerous ground, because where do we draw the line between courtesy and free speech?

governments have a bad habit of being too arbitrary. and courtesies have a bad habit of being too arbitrary. together they seem like a big threat to our freedom of thought.

i really don't have an answer to this other than make your voices heard and maybe make some change in government regulations, like christmas decorations and flag waving.

 

[All Else Failed]

Wait, I don't see how waving or displaying your old country's flag in the open as a bad thing?

 

[memento_mori]

it's crazy. it doesn't seem that offensive to me. like people waving the southern confederate flag, i just let it be. because i'd rather they be stupid than repressed.

 

[dt3]

it's crazy. it doesn't seem that offensive to me. like people waving the southern confederate flag, i just let it be. because i'd rather they be stupid than repressed.

Whoa, hold up buddy. I'm gonna start a new thread just for you.

 

[Peter Parka]

Peter will know this, in east London we play a game called spot the Englishman!

Haha! You know it! Whenever I go down to West Ham you know the only white people you see are there for the football match!

 

[NightWarrior]

Well, I think its very useful to assimilate to a society, but you cant really just expect people to not want to keep some of their customs.

Hell, all of us are hypocrits when we talk about this, I wonder how a native American would feel about us talking about "people keeping their culture".

I'm not sure how to respond to this one. Its one thing to keep their customs, but to make it an absolute or a requirement is something different. We shouldn't have to accept the fact that these cultures come here to the US and do not have to learn English. Here in NC a ton of money is wasted training already under paid teachers Spanish so that the Mexican population (who are not US citizens by the way) can assimilate our schools. Why should the US citizens have to bear the burden?

 

[All Else Failed]

I'm not sure how to respond to this one. Its one thing to keep their customs, but to make it an absolute or a requirement is something different. We shouldn't have to accept the fact that these cultures come here to the US and do not have to learn English. Here in NC a ton of money is wasted training already under paid teachers Spanish so that the Mexican population (who are not US citizens by the way) can assimilate our schools. Why should the US citizens have to bear the burden?

I agree that it should be a requirement that you learn English. You're at a huge loss if you cant speak the language.