God gave humanity to Satan as a gift and reward.

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Greatest I am

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God gave humanity to Satan as a gift and reward.

God, in the beginning, created all that was. He called it Eden and put adam in it. The lower case adam, means society. God later called us Adam and Eve, to designate and differentiate man and woman. That is likely why creation of man is shown twice in Genesis.

He then gave all of us to Satan as a gift and made him the ruler of this world as a reward. This maintains the illusion that God gave us free will. After all, free will means we are able to rule ourselves so God himself cannot call himself our ruler without negating our free will. We cannot do as we will if we are following his will. This is quite simple to understand.

Satan, the great deceiver, God’s favorite and glorious angel, was then given the power and instruction to deceive all of mankind. This is obviously why Satan and or the talking serpent were in Eden. God does not put a fox in the henhouse without good reason. The reason was to insure that Adam and Eve became as Gods. You will know that the loss of the tree of life is never shown as a loss anywhere in scripture. You likely know why.

Dogma says that God basically lost all control over mankind at that point and the absence of God, which many call evil and hell, attests to this as an irrefutable fact. Evil is definitely on earth and since God and evil is said to never be in the same place, we know that God is no longer here. We are on our own against Satan and his minions. A full third of the angels that God felt were good enough to be with his best, Satan.

Humanity is Satan’s beyond any doubt. He is the master and we are all slaves to sin.
God helps maintain this situation by insuring that all are born with original sin and sets our nature to do just that, sin.

Scripture is clear on these points. The big question is why?

This seems to be the only answer---------

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

This tells me that we must all sin and repent, to not perish and insure that we are saved.

Colossians 1: 15 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honor and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

It does not take a rocket scientist to dither out that if God were to lose any of us, that would not please him. A God, who had miracle available, would always make sure that his will is never thwarted.

The following type of scenario is then never allowed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3LNL6wKhXA

Those with any sort of faith should know this, but somehow, they follow dogma and a theology that says that God does lose some of us and that somehow, even with all those miracles at hand, Satan and man can thwart God’s will and desire to save us all. This is impossible.

It seems that this bishop is be correct.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF6I5VSZVqc

If we are all to be deceived as scripture indicates, and the majority of the world has faith, logic says that if you have faith in Jesus, God or Allah, then your faith is a deception from Satan. Many say that Satan’s greatest deception or trick is to fool us into believing that he does not exist. The opposite seems to be true and that it is God who is no longer here on this evil world.

Doubt is a good quality. It wards of gullibility.

Should you doubt your faith or do you somehow think that your particular faith, whichever it is, is exempt from Satan’s God given power of deception and dominion over you?

Are you so arrogant that you will ignore Gods own prophesy, that all will be deceived, by not judging the God offered by your church?

Do you dare take that chance and not judge your God, by his actions, to know if you follow a moral God or not?

If deceived, how could we possibly know?

I think there is only one solution. That is, compared the two major forms of law and morality on the planet. Secularism and religions.
I follow secular law because Satan has deceived you people of faith because I see that you love to hate, and demand that there be a place of punishment instead of a place to cure those you and your false God believe to be lost souls.

This Gnostic Christian says that God is a good and moral God and he cures souls. He does not torture them. Any that have truly repented of their sins will know this to be a truth and know that God‘s will that none be lost cannot be thwarted. Even in his never ending absence. He will never return because of the fact of our free will. If we are doing His will, we cannot be exercising our free will. God wants free men. Not slaves.

Where is our master Satan then?
In our sin nature.
Where else could spirit entities live?


Regards
DL
 
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Diggin Deep

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God gave humanity to Satan as a gift and reward.

God, in the beginning, created all that was. He called it Eden and put adam in it. The lower case adam, means society. God later called us Adam and Eve, to designate and differentiate man and woman. That is likely why creation of man is shown twice in Genesis.

He then gave all of us to Satan as a gift and made him the ruler of this world as a reward. This maintains the illusion that God gave us free will. After all, free will means we are able to rule ourselves so God himself cannot call himself our ruler without negating our free will. We cannot do as we will if we are following his will. This is quite simple to understand.

Satan, the great deceiver, God’s favorite and glorious angel, was then given the power and instruction to deceive all of mankind. This is obviously why Satan and or the talking serpent were in Eden. God does not put a fox in the henhouse without good reason. The reason was to insure that Adam and Eve became as Gods.

"That they may know from the rising of the sun to its setting that there is none besides me. I am the Lord, and there is no other." (Isaiah 45:6)

In Isaiah 45, the prophet writes that God created the heavens, formed the earth, made it and established it. So it is clear that God didn't create the world as a place of waste or chaos, rather a place of order and purpose. As the creator of heavens and earth, God has the first word and the last. His Word is His will. God means what He says and He says what He means. God also gives and takes away authority on earth.

In Genesis, God gave Adam power, dominion and authority over all of His creation. When Adam disobeyed God's one and only commandment, Adam transferred all these rights over to God's arch enemy, the devil. Many years later, when the devil was tempting Jesus, he showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and said, "All this authority I will give you, and their glory; for this has been delivered to me, and I give it to whomever I wish." (Luke 4:6)

Although God is almighty, perfect and just, He has allowed Satan to exercise a certain amount of power and authority as god of this world, as described in 2 Corinthians 4:4. The good news is that with His crucifixion, resurrection and ascension, the power, dominion and authority that Adam lost in the garden was reclaimed and regained by Jesus Christ.

Before the crucifixion, Pilate was interrogating Jesus. When Jesus didn't respond, Pilate asked, "Don't you realize I have power either to free you or to crucify you?" Jesus answered, "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above." (John 19:10, 11)

Romans chapter 13 teaches Christians to be subject to governing authorities. "For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God." Whether this passage speaks of church leadership, civil servants or higher levels of government doesn't matter. What's important to know is that God is the supreme dispenser of all authority.

In Luke 10:19, Jesus gave authority to His disciples, giving them power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and power over the enemy. From Pentecost on, all Christians have God-given authority to do the same. Ephesians teaches that Christians are members of the Body of Christ, that Jesus Christ is the Head of His Body and all things are under His feet. The revelation of Ephesians closes with a listing of armor for Christians - Ephesians 6:10-17. He give us these things so that would not be found helpless and slaves to sin, but be able to take stand against Satan and overcome his temptation on earth.
 

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"That they may know from the rising of the sun to its setting that there is none besides me. I am the Lord, and there is no other." (Isaiah 45:6)

In Isaiah 45, the prophet writes that God created the heavens, formed the earth, made it and established it. So it is clear that God didn't create the world as a place of waste or chaos, rather a place of order and purpose. As the creator of heavens and earth, God has the first word and the last. His Word is His will. God means what He says and He says what He means. God also gives and takes away authority on earth.

In Genesis, God gave Adam power, dominion and authority over all of His creation. When Adam disobeyed God's one and only commandment, Adam transferred all these rights over to God's arch enemy, the devil. Many years later, when the devil was tempting Jesus, he showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and said, "All this authority I will give you, and their glory; for this has been delivered to me, and I give it to whomever I wish." (Luke 4:6)

Although God is almighty, perfect and just, He has allowed Satan to exercise a certain amount of power and authority as god of this world, as described in 2 Corinthians 4:4. The good news is that with His crucifixion, resurrection and ascension, the power, dominion and authority that Adam lost in the garden was reclaimed and regained by Jesus Christ.

Before the crucifixion, Pilate was interrogating Jesus. When Jesus didn't respond, Pilate asked, "Don't you realize I have power either to free you or to crucify you?" Jesus answered, "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above." (John 19:10, 11)

Romans chapter 13 teaches Christians to be subject to governing authorities. "For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God." Whether this passage speaks of church leadership, civil servants or higher levels of government doesn't matter. What's important to know is that God is the supreme dispenser of all authority.

In Luke 10:19, Jesus gave authority to His disciples, giving them power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and power over the enemy. From Pentecost on, all Christians have God-given authority to do the same. Ephesians teaches that Christians are members of the Body of Christ, that Jesus Christ is the Head of His Body and all things are under His feet. The revelation of Ephesians closes with a listing of armor for Christians - Ephesians 6:10-17. He give us these things so that would not be found helpless and slaves to sin, but be able to take stand against Satan and overcome his temptation on earth.

Does it make sense to you that God would convict Satan of something, impose a horrendous penalty, threaten a hell and then defer it for 2,000 years, and give Satan full access to God's new baby humans?

If on earth as it is in heaven means anything, then we should release all the murderers and rapists. That is the example that your God is giving us. Yuk.

As to your personal beast of burden, a scapegoat Jesus. Get off him. That is an immoral ride.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYaQpRZJl18&feature=related

Regards
DL
 

Diggin Deep

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Does it make sense to you that God would convict Satan of something, impose a horrendous penalty, threaten a hell and then defer it for 2,000 years, and give Satan full access to God's new baby humans?

If on earth as it is in heaven means anything, then we should release all the murderers and rapists. That is the example that your God is giving us. Yuk.

As to your personal beast of burden, a scapegoat Jesus. Get off him. That is an immoral ride.

God did not reward Satan or give him power. Adam gave his power, dominion and authority over God's creation to Satan when he disobeyed God.

Even though Satan has access to God's people, doesn't mean he has authority or power over us (example: Job and Satan's attempt to tempt Jesus) - the plan of Satan failed and God's soverignty prevailed. The only authority and power that Satan has over God's people is that in which we gave/give him. God has given His people the tools to overcome and defeat the spiritual warfare that Satan imposes. As Job did, we also face terrible tragedies and suffering in life. What is important is that we remain faithful despite the circumstances. That we may learn true humility and dependence on God through the hard times. This leads back to free will...we don't have to choose God. We can choose to believe or follow anything we want. We can choose self or we can choose God. It's ultimately our choice.

You left out a part of the Lord's Prayer: "...Your will be done, on earth as it is in Heaven..." God's will was not for us to murder or rape, neither on earth or in heaven. Furthermore, God said to obey the laws of the land. This would mean that if you break the law, you must suffer the punishment.

Jesus - whether you believe He is the Son of God, the Savior, or that He was just a mere mortal man; one would have a really hard time proving He was immoral based on what we know of Him.
 
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Greatest I am

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God did not reward Satan or give him power. Adam gave his power, dominion and authority over God's creation to Satan when he disobeyed God.

Even though Satan has access to God's people, doesn't mean he has authority or power over us (example: Job and Satan's attempt to tempt Jesus) - the plan of Satan failed and God's soverignty prevailed. The only authority and power that Satan has over God's people is that in which we gave/give him. God has given His people the tools to overcome and defeat the spiritual warfare that Satan imposes. As Job did, we also face terrible tragedies and suffering in life. What is important is that we remain faithful despite the circumstances. That we may learn true humility and dependence on God through the hard times. This leads back to free will...we don't have to choose God. We can choose to believe or follow anything we want. We can choose self or we can choose God. It's ultimately our choice.

You left out a part of the Lord's Prayer: "...Your will be done, on earth as it is in Heaven..." God's will was not for us to murder or rape, neither on earth or in heaven. Furthermore, God said to obey the laws of the land. This would mean that if you break the law, you must suffer the punishment.

Jesus - whether you believe He is the Son of God, the Savior, or that He was just a mere mortal man; one would have a really hard time proving He was immoral based on what we know of Him.

We do know that scripture and Moses thought his divorce laws--let no man put asunder-- was garbage and that is why it was ignored. To implement that no divorce law would have been immoral.

Try telling a wife that gets beat twice a week and rapes his daughter that she should not divorce and see what you get.

Regards
DL
 

Diggin Deep

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You have touched on something personal in my life - considering my mother was beaten by my father, was molested as a child and the list goes on and on of personal experiences. Did my mother find God and has she been able to maintain a personal relationship with God, despite divorcing my father and the other struggles she has faced - yes! And yes my father has been able to reconcile those very issues with my mother and God. And yes they have a better friendship now than they ever did as a married couple.

Some people are able to work through and deal with the suffereing that life brings us by depending and believing in God - some not. As for my mother who did not have a relationship with God while this was going on, was able to find God through it. Whether God closes a door or we close it, somewhere He opens a window.

So what is more important to God? A wife that sticks it out with her abusive husband? Or a wife that leaves her abusive husband and finds God through the struggles that life has brought her? I would be inclined to side with answer 2. God uses our struggles and turmoil in life to bring us closer to Him. I've seen people who were able to deal with the worst struggles in marriage and life. Through there faith in God, they were able to deal with their problems, strengthen their marriage and overcome the worst of tragedies. I've also seen people who weren't able to, but still either strengthened their relationship with God or found Him while dealing with it. God cares about the individual and does not always test the faith of those He knows will fail.

Do we do things that may not be God's will for us - yes and every day! Thankfully, God is a loving and merciful God. Do I believe God's will for me was to be in the pastorial field - yes. Did I fulfill that will - no. He still chooses to use me for His purpose - as a witness that even though I closed a door, He was able to open a window.
 

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This is a discussion and debate forum.

Go find some other venue to preach.

Regards
DL

A typical response from you, knowing that you are being sussed out. Personally I thought you had given up on posting anti-religion nonsense you seem to do all day, and had gone into politics, you seemed a lot better at understanding politics than religion
 

Diggin Deep

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This is a discussion and debate forum.

Go find some other venue to preach.

Regards
DL

Honestly, I expected more from you. But as usual, when someone replies to you with something that might make a little sense and leaves you with nothing rational or intelligent to say - you resort to one liners that slam the belief you oppose or the person directly. It's ok though, I have broad shoulders and I make no excuses for how I believe. I've never claimed that my way is the right way and have never forced my belief on anyone.

I'm not preaching at you or to you...or anyone for that matter. You have no problem sharing your beliefs on this forum. Neither do I. I'm proud of what I believe in. You pose questions and statements based on your belief and life experiences against the Bible God. Heaven forbid anyone to reply with answers and life experiences for the Bible God that may go against your way of thinking.

It wouldn't be much of a discussion and debate forum if everyone agreed with you.
 
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BornReady

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This is obviously why Satan and or the talking serpent were in Eden.

A good rule of interpretation is never take a story with talking animals in it literally.

As to your personal beast of burden, a scapegoat Jesus. Get off him. That is an immoral ride.

This is one of my problems with traditional Christianity. A proper religion emphasizes personal responsibility instead of promoting scape goats. Thankfully, many have seen the need for change and that is what liberal Christianity is all about.
 

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A good rule of interpretation is never take a story with talking animals in it literally.



This is one of my problems with traditional Christianity. A proper religion emphasizes personal responsibility instead of promoting scape goats. Thankfully, many have seen the need for change and that is what liberal Christianity is all about.

Being a religionist myself, I do not mind religions that promote self responsibility.

It is those silly literalists and fundamentals who have no clue as to what the authors were trying to tell them in terms of morals.

It is not their fault in a direct way but their churches fault. That and these days, the followers often do not follow the teachings of their own hierarchies.

For instance, the pope says not to read genesis literally but theist do. Sigh.

Regards
DL
 

Greatest I am

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Honestly, I expected more from you. But as usual, when someone replies to you with something that might make a little sense and leaves you with nothing rational or intelligent to say - you resort to one liners that slam the belief you oppose or the person directly. It's ok though, I have broad shoulders and I make no excuses for how I believe. I've never claimed that my way is the right way and have never forced my belief on anyone.

I'm not preaching at you or to you...or anyone for that matter. You have no problem sharing your beliefs on this forum. Neither do I. I'm proud of what I believe in. You pose questions and statements based on your belief and life experiences against the Bible God. Heaven forbid anyone to reply with answers and life experiences for the Bible God that may go against your way of thinking.

It wouldn't be much of a discussion and debate forum if everyone agreed with you.

I do not mind disagreement. I do mind mindless preaching.

Regards
DL
 
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