Water Wasters

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Johnfromokc

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Have any in your community? We are in a continuing drought in Oklahoma, as is much of the country. Everyone is aware of this - it's no secret. We have had more days over 100 degrees F than I've ever seen outside of the southwestern U.S. deserts.

I've been concerned about water conservation ever since I was stationed at Twentynine Palms California in the Mojave Desert from 1983 to 1985. They used sewer water for any irrigation on the base. But here in Oklahoma City, that gets nearly all of its water from the underground aquifers, people water lawns and fill land locked ponds 24/7. Unfucking believable.

It is well known that our aquifer is under tremendous strain, yet these people refuse to conserve water in any meaningful manner. Who knows how long it took to charge our aquifers with water. Hundreds? Thousands? Millions of years? There is no doubt we are pumping water from the ground much faster than it trickeled into it.

Here are some glaring examples of water wasting in my neighborhood. Everyone has 5 or more acres of land, and it is mostly wooded. The neighbor beside me has a land locked pond - meaning it has no source of water from a spring or creek. Two other neighbors also have land locked ponds. All were filling their ponds with well water pumped from the ground. Most have stopped, but one or two continue to fill these ponds despite the drought conditions. When we moved here, the lot next door was vacant, but the land owner ran the well pump 24/7 to keep this land locked pond filled. To give you an idea how much water this is, look at the following figures:

The typical residental well pump has a pumping capacity of 15 gallons per minute (GPM). There are 60 minutes in each hour, so every hour the pump runs equals 900 gallons of water. With 24 hours in a day, those 900 gallons per hours equal 21,600 gallons of ground water. With 365 days in a year, that land locked pond owner is wasting 7,884,000 annually. Even if they only pumped 25% of the time, that is still nearly 2,000,000 gallons of ground water wasted.

A couple of our pond filling neighbors well's went dry. One saw the light and stopped pumping well water into the pond, and the other was outraged because the well drillers are backed up into December and won't be able to drill a new well for him until then. He is trying to refinance his 4000 + square foot house so he will save $3,300 per year on his mortgage, and he is afraid if he can't keep his pond filled, the appraisal will come in too low. WTF? This is a 50-something year old couple - empty nesters - kids long gone. They own a mortgage brokerage - Ironic no?

Multiply that times all the land locked aesthetic pond fillers in Oklahoma City and we are wasting billions of gallons of water. I hate to even think about all the golf courses and other lawn waterers out there pumping water from our aquifers to evaporate on the surface.

With current water use laws, we can't do a damned thing about it either. So much for people doing the right thing without government regulation.
 
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Joe the meek

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John, know where most water is wasted in a residential household? Waiting for the hot water to get there (wasting the cold water).

What's becoming big with continuous (tankless) hot water heaters are specific pumps designed to bring the hot water to the outlet, being turned on by motion detectors. This way, when you turn on your hot water, you get it. Systems are on the pricey side to install, and if you're in a rural area, the savings aren't there (well water), but for people on city water, depending on your water rate, the pump system can actually pay for itself on your water bill in a couple of years.

I know some of the manufacturers are trying to get these systems mandatory for new construction in some city limits.
 
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Dana

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I've never understood watering lawns... Why? We have morons here that like to hose down their driveway... Really? The ground is supposed to be dirty idiot.
 

Johnfromokc

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John, know where most water is wasted in a residential household? Waiting for the hot water to get there (wasting the cold water).

Sounds like tankless marketing Joe. And it is not true, at least in Oklahoma, and most likely other parts of the country. Most water is wasted watering lawns and golf courses and filling land locked ponds out here.

I'm all for conserving water any way we can. Strictly limiting outdoor watering will save a hell of a lot more water than tankless water heaters. Just think of all the water the desert golf courses alone waste on a daily basis. We take water for granted in the United States, to the point, I fear, that we will face shortages sooner than most might think.

http://pubs.usgs.gov/circ/1344/
 

PoopaSwoof

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When we have drought conditions in Florida, the counties impose watering restrictions.
I never water my lawn. If mother nature doesnt provide then the lawn does without.
I dont use pesticides, herbicedes or fertilizer either. We live on a landlocked lake and I dont want anything washing into my fishing hole.
Besides, I'm a cheap bastard.
 

Dana

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Sounds like tankless marketing Joe. And it is not true, at least in Oklahoma, and most likely other parts of the country. Most water is wasted watering lawns and golf courses and filling land locked ponds out here.

I'm all for conserving water any way we can. Strictly limiting outdoor watering will save a hell of a lot more water than tankless water heaters. Just think of all the water the desert golf courses alone waste on a daily basis. We take water for granted in the United States, to the point, I fear, that we will face shortages sooner than most might think.

http://pubs.usgs.gov/circ/1344/
I remember all those 80s PSAs about turning off your water while your brushing your teeth and stuff... Looking back it sounded like BS....
 

Joe the meek

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Sounds like tankless marketing Joe. And it is not true, at least in Oklahoma, and most likely other parts of the country. Most water is wasted watering lawns and golf courses and filling land locked ponds out here.

No, not hardly. First, people use to call their tankless water heaters "instant" water heaters thinking that they would have instant hot water at the tap which is far from the truth.

Secondly, go to all indoor taps, turn on the hot water, and time the water (and figure out your flow rate LOL) of water going down the sink waiting for hot water. For my master bedroom, it'll be 30 seconds before I get warm water out of the tap.

30 seconds may not sound like a lot of wasted water, but it adds up EVERY single day of the year. Take that wasted water and multiply it by the dwellings that utilize hot water using city water and it does add up (quicker than you think)

Third, yes, some pump manufacturers (smarter ones get independent testing) and are working to to show cities what could be saved on their water resources.

Fourth, I don't even sell tankless water heaters, so give me a break.

Fifth, I'm on well water, so I really don't care.

Sixth, one of the last larger homes I worked on recently, their shower head was rated at 20 gallons a minute LOL
 

Johnfromokc

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I'm British. The words 'water conservation' over here are like a bad joke.

It would be hard to believe you Brits are worse water wasters than Americans. We feel entitled to use all we want whenever we want for whatever purpose we want.

We visited South Australia in 2009. You want to talk about serious water conservation? Every home we saw has a rain talk. The ground water is saline and unfit for human consumption in the River Country around the Murray River. Water from the river is rationed strictly to the orchards and vineyards and other farming operations. We all could stand to learn a lot from them.

Here's a city park with a rain tank. You see these everywhere in SA:

6440_1098169423611_1507914120_30300813_616487_n.jpg


Here is an old building with a rain tank. SA has been conserving water for many decades:

6440_1098170143629_1507914120_30300829_6907543_n.jpg
 

Johnfromokc

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No, not hardly.

Are you trying to say that the USGS geologists don't know what they are talking about? They say irrigation is the #1 consumer of water in the United States, but you say it's homeowners awaiting the arrival of hot water?

Fourth, I don't even sell tankless water heaters, so give me a break.
Maybe not, but you are apparently quoting their propaganda which does not correlate to USGS data.

Fifth, I'm on well water, so I really don't care.

So, you don't draw water from the same aquifer as everyone else in your region? Do you think you have no responsibility to conserve water because you draw water from the aquifer from underneath your land?

Guess what? Wells are going dry in my neighborhood because of that attitude. An attorney at the Oklahoma Water Resources Board is looking into those water wasters. Some might just be held liable for wasting water.

Just because you own a private well does not give you the right to waste water any way you choose. We are all connected and our actions affect others.

Sixth, one of the last larger homes I worked on recently, their shower head was rated at 20 gallons a minute LOL

Is this supposed to impress people? WTF?

Some years ago, in South Georgia, a farmer was usiing millions of gallons of ground water to irrigate his crops. He used so much water, that he drew down the water table to the point that he sucked all his neighbors wells dry. They took him to court and won. He had to pay to drill new wells for the entire community.

Private well owners are not exempt from common sense, nor are they exempt from water rights and water usage laws and the legal consequences.
 

Joe the meek

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John

Pop a chill pill.

My only point was that there is a great deal of water wasted in residential areas that don't have lawns, and that the water is wasted INSIDE the home. To you, apparently it's selling hype, although some of the larger towns that I'm aware of have now considered enacting some kind of pump system into new residential home buildings due to the constraints of their water supply.

As for our own home, I believe we don't waste water needlessly, as I've never watered the lawn, although I have been thinking of re hooking up the drip system the previous homeowner had installed when he was growing seedlings a long time ago.

You giving me the Dargo complex? Personally, I think a 20 GPM shower head is ridiculous, my point is that people spend money on what they want and at the time, there are no laws against it. Kicker was, guy building the home was single, and his shower was bigger than most of my bathrooms.

Your face turning less red now:D
 

HK

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It would be hard to believe you Brits are worse water wasters than Americans. We feel entitled to use all we want whenever we want for whatever purpose we want.

I meant more that the idea that we might have to conserve water is humorous :p Britain is famous for being consistently wet.

Still. At least I'm not Welsh.
 

Zorak

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Water conservation is a problem over here too to some degree, because our hydrosphere is particularly vulnerable. Rivers and reservoirs are easily depleted during dry seasons because the amount of rainfall that falls during the wet season, although frequent, is extremely light. Most rainfall often falls in areas difficult to accumulate it; such as the mountainous north and remote Highlands.
In recent years summers have been wet, so it hasn't been such a problem. But I do remember many years growing up where sizeable rivers would disappear for months.

I meant more that the idea that we might have to conserve water is humorous :p Britain is famous for being consistently wet.

Here's an interesting fact; London receives less annual rainfall than Sydney. :eek
 

retro

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I grew up dealing with drought conditions and having to conserve water. Just the way of life for Californians. We have strict watering laws and a the fines are heavy for breaking them.
 

cam elle toe

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I worked for the Sydney Water Board for 6 years.

I had to know the "Spiel" for when people complained about their exess water rates.

How to check for leaks, how to conserve water etc, how to check if your meter is working properly.

Tank water tastes SO much better than town water. PLUS, it has the added bonus of NOT having fluoride added to it .... win/win .:thumbup
 

Johnfromokc

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I was having a conservation with a co-worker who has a small farming operation. He was lamenting those in the community who in his words "spend $500 on water to save a $50 landscaping plant". This is so true.

My neighborhood consists of minimum 5 acre lots, and several residents own 2 lots. We are all on well water, each owning their own private well. Some of them have decorative ponds - large holes dug in the ground - that they pump water into, as well as various and sundry non native landscaping they pour water on regularly. Some have pumped their wells dry - not bone dry, yet - but to the point they have to wait for them to recharge until they can run the sprinklers again.

There's a homeowners accociation - the first and last I'll ever reside in a neighborhood that has one - and the water wasters are all HOA officers and their supporters. They refer to themselves as "affluent" and if their use of water forces everyone in the neighborhood to drill a new well at a minimum cost of $5,000 each, then, as one particularly vocal resident said - "so be it".

Unbelieveable. And not a fucking thing can be done about it under current law. So much for the argument that people will do the right thing of their own accord without the force of law.
 

Joe the meek

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Yeah, you strike me as the type of man to belong to a HOA:24: I've got to ask, why did you even bother moving there due to the HOA?
 
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